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001 shows the Lexus LS pre-collision system in action

Agent001 submitted on 05/21/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 10:14 PM
from: www.autospies.com

[69] user comments | category: Videos

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Tags: Lexus, Safety, Cool, LS460, LS600h

Tag Links: Lexus, Safety, Cool, LS460, LS600h

001 shows the Lexus LS pre-collision system in action

Here is a great animation demonstrating the new Lexus pre-collision radar based system in action that can actually route someone around an obstacle.

The available Pre-Collision System (PCS) is equipped with a front-mounted radar sensor that constantly monitors the distance of the vehicle ahead. When the PCS computer determines that a frontal collision is unavoidable, it preemptively tightens the front seatbelts and engages the Brake Assist for increased braking force when the driver steps on the brake pedal. Read Article

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S4cabriofoxone - 5/21/2007 10:24:53 PMView My AgentSpace

+7 Boost

I'm sure it works very well in real life (I hope it does, because I might be plunking down $75K for one), but this video doesn't really show me anything... I guess it sharpens the steering so it's easier to get around an obstacle?

And you gotta love the music in the background.

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enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:28:36 PM

+2 Boost

yes, very sexy music. like in a really hip elevator.

Agent001 - 5/21/2007 10:30:32 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Do you know the artist and title?

You will be even more impressed with the choice then ;)

001

lexusis350 - 5/21/2007 10:33:05 PM

+2 Boost

Are you considering buying one?

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:36:07 PM

+2 Boost

impressed by the artist? it sound very W hotels (which are always about 3 years behind, though really cool for suburban types making the schlepp into the big city).

Agent001 - 5/21/2007 10:36:42 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Clue...it's an 80's tune

001

Agent001 - 5/21/2007 11:09:29 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Times up!

Alphaville-Big in Japan

mitchatlexusofmarin - 5/22/2007 2:18:51 AM

+2 Boost

S4- I answered your question on the other post.

S4cabriofoxone - 5/22/2007 5:15:16 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Thanks, mitch.

And yes, lexusis350. My wife still wants to look at the S-Class even if it is too big to get in and out of the garage with easily (she loves the way it looks), but I'm pushing her to look at the LS460 SWB, also. We'll be looking seriously around September or October.

lexusis350 - 5/22/2007 9:23:47 PM

+2 Boost

That's exciting.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:27:55 PM

-4 Boost

wow. 2002 technology comes to the new LS.

the 2002 S-class had the same impact sensing rader, seatbelt pre-tensioning and brake assist. additionally the S-class moves the power seats into optimal crash positioning and closes the sunroof and windows to protect from debris.

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Agent001 - 5/21/2007 10:29:35 PMView My AgentSpace

+6 Boost

But it doesn't automatically evade the obstacle like the Lexus system does and it does not have a face detection camera mounted on the steering wheel.

001

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:33:30 PM

-2 Boost

the lexus pre-collision system doesn't steer the car. so how does it avoid the obstacle.

and the face monitor is about keeping the driver focused. it simply sets off an audible alarm when the driver's eyes drift for too long. it's actually a separate element from pre-collision.

Agent001 - 5/21/2007 10:36:07 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

It does on the ls600h

001

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:39:10 PM

+1 Boost

hat's news to me. initally, the system (face monitor and all) will only be on the LS600.

never heard about car steering itself at speed. i'm certain it won't do that due to the legal implications toward toyota if it steers into say....people. that's actually why the self-parking system disengages if you take your foot offf the brake....legal reasons.

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 10:49:56 PM

+3 Boost

It was Lexus the world's first that introduced radar-based pre-collision system.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:58:40 PM

-1 Boost

no supra. it was mercedes in 2002. lexus is, however, introducing the first face recognition monitor to alert the driver if he drifts his attention.

here's the description from edmunds:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/GeneralFuture/articleId=106121

Since 2002, the S-Class has been equipped with Mercedes' Pre-Safe system. It works like this: In the seconds just before a possible impact, the front seatbelts are automatically tightened, the sunroof closes, and the seats can move to positions that provide better protection. On the new S-Class, the system has been taken further. Pre-Safe now closes the car's side windows to provide better support for the window curtain airbags, and inflate special seat cushions to provide greater lateral support for occupants and help the side airbags provide even better collision protection.

Also, Distronic cruise control that maintains a preset following distance behind the vehicle ahead will be replaced by an optional Distronic Plus system. Integrated with Pre-Safe, the radar-based system operates at nearly all speeds up to 125 mph. Distronic Plus works with a new Brake Assist Plus system to monitor traffic conditions, and if a collision is anticipated, ideal brake pressure is applied, even if the driver applies the brake pedal too lightly. Mercedes says its studies show the new system reduces rear collisions in heavy city traffic by 75 percent.

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 11:09:51 PM

+1 Boost

I couldn't find the link immediately, but I am dead sure it was Lexus first that had radar-based pre-collision system.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:12:25 PM

-1 Boost

you can't 'find the link' supra...because you're dead wrong. mercedes invented pre-crash technology based on radar cruise control that they also pioneered.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:14:07 PM

-2 Boost

and FYI, the old LS430 did not have pre-collision. this is new to the current generation LS.

Agent004 - 5/22/2007 1:43:59 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

This system does not steer around the obstacle. It tightens up the steering ratio, it does NOT steer the car.

mitchatlexusofmarin - 5/22/2007 2:20:17 AM

+1 Boost

001 is completely correct- and it can identify (distinguish between)soft or hard targets.

Ironman273 - 5/22/2007 10:35:20 AM

+4 Boost

The previous generation LS did have pre-collision available. If you look at the grill of an LS and see the L logo under a big square of glass, that's the pre-collision system.

EL34 - 5/21/2007 10:41:27 PM

+2 Boost

So it has a camera hooked up to a sensor that knows what a forward looking head looks like and when yahoo turns his head for a certain amount of time it sets off an alarm.

The tune sounds like Wang Chung.

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enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 10:43:31 PM

-2 Boost

that's exactly what it does.
wakes grandpa up if he drifts off. (average LS buyer is 62 after all)

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 11:00:13 PM

+2 Boost

If it were German first, you guys would cheer your pants off.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:09:56 PM

-3 Boost

why? a camera that knows which way the driving is facing is not breakthrough technology. it's simple software.

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 10:57:07 PM

+1 Boost

001, do you know why Lexus didn't put the rear end pre-collision system in US market?

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enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:00:04 PM

-2 Boost

no rear pre-collision due to legal concerns in the US market.

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 11:39:50 PM

+5 Boost

Finally found the links I read before from clublexus:

Lexus was first to offer a radar based pre-collision system.
http://www.densomediacenter.com/PDF/SAE_NewsCon.pdf

Quote:
Next, I’d like to talk about DENSO’s Pre-Collision System, which we consider a bridge betweenpassive and enhanced safety.

DENSO developed three key components for this system -- a millimeter-wave radar

3/8/2004
New Pre-Collision System available on Lexus LS 430
http://www.densocorp-na.com/newmc/ne...?ArticleID=241

Quote:
The system was initially developed for the Toyota Harrier, launched in Japan in February 2003."

"today announced that its Pre-Collision System, the world's first such system, now is available in North America on the Lexus LS 430."

9/15/2002
Pre-safe debuts at 2002 Paris auto show
2003 Sclass
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=5278

Quote:
What's in the works? One of the most immediate goals is to develop technology that can sense what's going on outside the vehicle, notes Bachmann. In current form, Pre-Safe cannot detect a wide variety of common accidents - another car running a red light, for example, and slamming into the side of your vehicle.

"For this," Bachmann adds, "we need radar sensors to see what is going on around you."

Some Mercedes products already come with onboard radar as part of a system Mercedes calls Distronic. Generically known as active cruise control, it lets the driver set a preferred speed, but then adjusts the vehicle's actual speed automatically depending on the traffic flow. Distronic, Bachmann says, "is not precise enough," so an even more sophisticated radar system is under development."

5/16/2005
Pre-Safe upgraded to Lexus standards.
http://www.worldcarfans.com/news.cfm...lass-uncovered

Quote:
The next evolution of Mercedes-Benz accident avoidance, PRE-SAFE uses two complementary radar frequencies to detect vehicles up ahead, warn of a likely impact and prime the braking system for faster response when the driver brakes the car.

reply to this comment

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 11:47:29 PM

+4 Boost

Now, Lexus pushed it even further by introducing an advanced obstacle-detection system, which is able to detect both metal and non metal objects through using the combination of millimeter-wave radar and infrared stereo camera.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:55:38 PM

-3 Boost

who is DENSO?

and if you read carefully you note that they talk about introduced THEIR versions of things...

"In 1986, we introduced our Anti-lock Brake System (ABS) (MERCEDES IN 1978). In 1989, it was the Air Bag (MERCEDES PATENT IN 1971). In 1995, we
unveiled key components for our Vehicle Stability Control Systems (VSC)."

find me a lexus reference with a date. good luck.

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/21/2007 11:57:30 PM

+4 Boost

denso is the company that kinda works for Lexus and they make all lexus gadgets including nav and apparently the PCS

enthusiastx11 - 5/22/2007 12:03:22 AM

-1 Boost

got it. thanks for clarifying.

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/21/2007 11:40:54 PM

+1 Boost

enthusiast your answer to everything is legal concerns...lol

i agree, even though im a lexus fan, that Mercedes invented the Pre-safe that lexus kinda mooched off from and took the credit. However, in japan models, not US models for legal concerns, the LS will brake (not steer) right before the crash so that the crash is not as strong. However, it will tighten up the steering response as seen in that video, where turning the wheel slightly will make a bigger impact.

watch this http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZHbkNYFam1w

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LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/21/2007 11:45:25 PM

+4 Boost

start around the 6 minutes range

SupraNeverBack - 5/21/2007 11:50:12 PM

+2 Boost

Read my post above. Many people were just wrong to think Mercedes was the first. ^0^

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/21/2007 11:56:42 PM

+5 Boost

Supra...dont get your post

you have 2004 for the LS430 and 2002 for the s class. as much as i would love you back you up...that doesnt work

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:57:06 PM

-5 Boost

but that is the reason. i have friends at toyota who i learned this from.

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:58:28 PM

-4 Boost

why do you think you have to hit "agree" on the nav every time you start a lexus?

and why do you have to agree to all the corners on the touch screen before the self-parking will engage?

legal, legal, legal.

enthusiastx11 - 5/22/2007 12:02:00 AM

-7 Boost

thanks for the deboosts supra. love ya.

SupraNeverBack - 5/22/2007 12:22:15 AM

+5 Boost

LexusKindaGuy12, you can back me up for sure
Please read carefully. That Mecedes "pre-safe" was not radar based.

http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=5278

The world's first radar-based pre-collision system used Toyota Harrier in Feb. 2003.

Mercedes introduced a non-radar-based concept in Sept.,2002, and Toyota had a radar-based system in a production car in Feb., 2003.

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/22/2007 12:29:50 AM

+3 Boost

ah got it now. Oh yeah! i remember watching a video on google that showed the S class previous generation (i think somebody hear posted it). anyways, it only works if the stability control or w/e electronic devices sense wheel spin etc. So yeah, your right, lexus introduced the radar, but Merc introduced the seatbelt tensioners etc etc

enthusiastx11 - 5/21/2007 11:59:39 PM

-8 Boost

supra et al.

you can deboost me all you want. mercedes created this technology. just google "mercedes pre-safe" and you'll find tons of references from the automotive press and beyond.

reply to this comment

SupraNeverBack - 5/22/2007 12:10:57 AM

+8 Boost

I may boost people, but never de-boost anyone.

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/21/2007 11:59:57 PM

+3 Boost

back to the post, how is this the precollision system in action...its a simulation. I was expecting real life demonstrations

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enthusiastx11 - 5/22/2007 12:05:35 AM

-4 Boost

you're the best supra!

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sewingmachine - 5/22/2007 12:11:31 AM

+4 Boost

dont mess with enthus11, he has multiple passports and travelled several continents too, lol.

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enthusiastx11 - 5/22/2007 12:21:22 AM

-5 Boost

lol. your humor is so sharp and witty!

Designer1 - 5/22/2007 1:39:03 AM

+2 Boost

This technology also steers the car away from the obsticle if the surrounding area is clear, I believe?

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LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/22/2007 2:08:08 AM

+3 Boost

seems a bit risky...maybe in the next generation...caues then there would have to be the sonar/blind spot detectors that we see on the volvo and audi cars. I havent heard lexus say anyting about it

TheSailor - 5/22/2007 4:31:20 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

What? You just posted this in every thread?! Please stop doing that!

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SupraNeverBack - 5/22/2007 6:02:45 PM

0 Boost

You should read how IIHS does its "tape measure rear crash test" rather than to post this on very Lexus thread.

Obviously, no automaker (maybe Volvo ^0^) gives a crap about this test. Help yourself to check iihs.org, most models from BMW, Mercedes, Audi, VW... got poor to acceptable ratings.

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TheSailor - 5/22/2007 4:40:13 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

Very clever function... But I'd like to see a test where they test it in real life... With some styrofoam mannequins at least...

I'm still not convinced of the efficiency of a radar based system for a car... Again, the power has to be very low and the frequency very high to avoid frying people and get a proper resolution. But the biggest problem is that fiber glass panels have become more normal, and even our 3-4 MW radars on ships have a hard time picking up fiber glass hulls at any distance... And "soft" targets without any metals or hard surfaces are even harder to pick up as they absorb radiation rather than reflecting it.

I also have another concern, which is actual general to all active safety systems. They have nothing to do with the car or the technology involved, I think both the car and the technology is very cool, but I fear that people will take greater risks with these systems because they think the car will save them from any dangerous situation... Kind of like people who think they are safer in their SUVs which makes them drive faster and more aggresive!

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Rupert - 5/22/2007 9:46:45 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

I'm worried - you can put the LS on a highway, and it will keep the speed, stop you crashing and keep you in lanes. If it wasn't for the face recognition thing you could just fall asleep and let the car drive itself, and I don't think technology is advanced enough for that.

And imagine - you're on a mountain road, no side fence, goat/other animal runs out in front, LS decides "must avoid" steers the car straight off the mountain and you all die as opposed to having a dent on the bonnet. Or it brakes itself and a lorry goes into the back of you...
I might be getting this wrong - can it steer itself or brake itself if the cruise control isn't on?

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SupraNeverBack - 5/22/2007 12:25:21 PM

-1 Boost

No, it won't steering itself, but just tightens up the steering ratio to prepare for emergent maneuver. Steering itself is doable, but then Lexus would be sued to bankruptcy. ^0^

mopar4dodge - 5/22/2007 4:42:05 PM

0 Boost

Great, wonderful.... now those idiot yuppies that drive these things can use their brain even less when they are driving, forget the fact that 90% of them pay too much for these cars and forget that they have a turn signal. Now they can do their hair, nails, talk on the cell phone, eat breakfast and have their lawyer on hold when they get in a wreck. Just another way to cater to lazy drivers that don't pay attention to the road.

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Will_ - 5/22/2007 5:47:52 PM

+3 Boost

I agree. Safety features like PCS, ABS, TRAC, Airbags, etc. are all useless features that just allow drivers to forget that they're driving a car. Forget the fact that they actually make cars safer, that's clearly not the point...

SupraNeverBack - 5/22/2007 5:54:10 PM

+2 Boost

This is just one step closer to Toyota's dreaming accident-proof vehicles.

TheSailor - 5/22/2007 6:04:41 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

LOL... Will, you better get off that high horse! You were the one who claimed that Self parking was a more important feature than ABS not so long ago...

Will_ - 5/22/2007 6:51:20 PM

0 Boost

I said it was more useful, as in getting more usage on a daily basis, not more important. You still are taking that argument out of context...

TheSailor - 5/22/2007 7:09:49 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

And you still don't have any idea how many times ABS have saved your a**... Even though you don't think so! Making it infinately more usefull...

TheSailor - 5/22/2007 6:44:11 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

BTW 001... When will you guys test this out for real? Try driving it down the free way in the wrong direction and see how long you'll get before someone gets killed! Some idiot did that (after drinking about 20 beers) here in Denmark a few days back killing four innocent people... And he didn't even have the decency to kill him self in the process! I hope he'll rot in prison with his cell mate "Tiny" for all eternity! I wonder if the same thing would have happened, had he driven an LS600... Hmm...

reply to this comment

LJ745 - 5/22/2007 7:41:05 PM

+1 Boost

Systems for altering a cars response prior to a collision were first introduced by Mercedes in 2002. Lexus introduced Pre-Collision in 2004 on the LS430. Mercedes was still first with this technology and was presented with the Traffic Safety Achievement award in 2003 for this technology.

reply to this comment

LexusKindaGuy12 - 5/22/2007 9:29:14 PM

+1 Boost

yes, we've established this. However, lexus was the first to use a radar based one while Mercs safety gismos (closing windows, seat position) only turned on when the ESP felt something was slipping

bevisroy - 5/24/2007 10:06:23 PM

+1 Boost

Lexus ALWAYS understates their 0 - 60 times by at least .5 seconds. Here are the results of the 5 Top Luxury Cars in this test which was reported in the January Issue of Car and Driver. Please note these tests were all done on the same day at about the same time and at the same altitude. The results reflect the average of 3 runs and all cars are the 2007 vintage.

Mercedes S550 5.6, 0 - 60 quarter mile in 14.1 (Benz show 5.4 in their specs)
BMW 750iL 5.7, 0 - 60 quarter mile in 14.2
Jag XJ Super 6.0 0 - 60 quarter mile 14.5
Lexus LS460L 6.2 0 - 60 quarter mile 14.6
Audi A8 6.8 0 - 60 quarter mile 15.2

Note that Lexus, as usual, is more than the 5.4 the manufacturer CLAIMS to get by .8 seconds.

Also note the LS430 (prior model the LS460 replaced) was rated at 295 HP and was actually 278 when Lexus corrected their rating. And there were no refunds or apologies from the so-called "quality" car company. ABC - Always Be Careful what you buy from the Lexus people.....

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