Audi R8 leads to a response by Lexus, Merceds-Benz and BMW.

GermanNut submitted on 10/25/2006 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 3:00 PM
from: www.autospies.com

[103] user comments | category: Spy Shots

Tags: R8, LF-A, Lexus, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, M10

Tag Links:

LF-A

Lexus

BMW

Mercedes-Benz

M10

Audi R8 leads to a response by Lexus, Merceds-Benz and BMW.

With Larry stating that Audi is trying to create a CLS competitor, and a 6-series competitor. I pose to him the fact that Lexus, Mercedes-Benz and BMW do not have a competitor to the Audi R8, but are scrambling already to create one.

One could argue that the BMW M6 is a competitor. Although priced in the same general area as the R8, the M6 simply weighs too much to have a chance at catching a car like the R8 on the Ring. The same goes for the Mercedes-Benz SL55 AMG. Although the SL55 AMG costs above $115K, and offers 0-60 times in the low 4 second range putting it in the same cateogry in acceleration as the M6 and R8, it too weighs too much to offer the same handling and dynamic capabilities as a light weight mid-engined sports car. The R8 is a mid-engined sports car offering exotic performance for a not so exotic price.

Lexus, on the other hand, has already started to develop the LF-A in response to the R8. Mercedes-Benz has been rumoured to be developing a competitor and word is out that BMW is going to hit the drawing board again for a supposed M10 two seat mid-engined car to take on the R8.

The Lexus LF-A has already been spotted in testing. Will BMW's and Mercedes-Benzes' responses actually become a reality or will the Audi R8 and Lexus LF-A be in a class all by themselves?

Comments:

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Ironman273 - 10/25/2006 3:35:14 PM

+8 Boost

In response to the R8? Wasn't the LF-A announced way before the R8?

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 5:58:09 PM

0 Boost

No, both were concepts, and I believe the LeMans concept came out first.

RefuG - 10/26/2006 7:20:06 AM

0 Boost

What does it matter who "announced" it first. The fact reamains that R8 came into production first.

G

luvmybmr - 10/26/2006 10:33:11 AM

+1 Boost

is the LF-A midengined?

S4cabriofox - 10/26/2006 6:50:29 PM

+1 Boost

No, rear engined I think.

Lexus fans, can you back me on this?

luvmybmr - 10/27/2006 11:18:46 AM

+1 Boost

actually it is a mid-engine car. so i guess r8 competition ... now they just need to make it look as futuristic as the r8

rom64 - 10/25/2006 3:45:49 PM

+1 Boost

Yes it was announced before the R8, but the R8 was in the designing process long before the LF-A and was given the concept name of 'Le-Mans'. In truth, the LF-A was not announced way before the R8 if you consider that the Audi Lemans = R8.

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 5:59:30 PM

+4 Boost

The SL is actually surprisingly fast, with perfectly capable handling. 0-60 in 4.8-5.0 seconds. Who needs an SL55? But I agree, it's more of a GT.

And no, the LF-A was not a response to the R8. Both were developed around the same time, and happen to be pretty direct competitors.

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IamEvilHomer - 10/25/2006 10:52:09 PM

-1 Boost

Lexus is going to do the same thing that VW did and try and step out of what they do well. Lexus the gost of the Phaton is calling you

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IamEvilHomer - 10/25/2006 10:54:34 PM

-2 Boost

ghost :)

why am i in a german nut lost anyway? You are always trying to start a fight with the Audi/bmw/mb/lex croud

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BMW530i - 10/25/2006 3:59:57 PM

+4 Boost

But the R8's interior will be so much better than all of those other's combined!!!

Right, Germannut?

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 6:00:12 PM

+2 Boost

Oh, please... he's done with that phase now. That was pretty stupid. He only did it to logical, though.

528i - 10/25/2006 6:52:11 PMView My AgentSpace

-5 Boost

LOL.....

xnmuller - 10/25/2006 4:10:09 PM

+3 Boost

Has everyone forgotten about the aging Mercedes SLR McLaren? One could argue that Audi was a few years behind.

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ATrip - 10/25/2006 4:31:16 PM

+7 Boost

the SLR is at least 3x's the price. Completely different class

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GermanNut - 10/25/2006 5:21:51 PM

-9 Boost

BMW530i any comments besides interiors?

Performance perhaps....it will be better than any BMW's right 530i?

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BMW_DRVR - 10/25/2006 5:26:49 PM

-4 Boost

Isnt the BMW supposed to be the Z10. Anyway no matter what the name is it will still beat the R8. Dont bother to mention AWD because the F430 beat the Gallardo on the track with less hp. RWD 4 life.

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 6:01:02 PM

-1 Boost

Wow, what an idiot.

You are a complete badge-whore.

Another to add to the list...

iown1 - 10/25/2006 5:51:08 PM

-1 Boost

I sat in the R8 at the Audi Forum on PArk Ave. The interior is typical Audi. Great. But you can't even imagine how beautiful the skin on that car is. Can't even imagine.

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matt635 - 10/25/2006 6:11:51 PM

+10 Boost

oh wow germannut, you know everything, you are so clever and I really love the insightful non-biased well educated way in which you sucessfully manage to compare cars from completely different classes without sounding like a total idiot. I think you should run your own car company, car review magazine and auto related website because you knowledge is so supreme.

oh no, wait I was thinking of something else. You are a dick - and you only post articles to start flame wars. Well, lets hope nobody accidentally runs you over any time soon.

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 7:18:45 PM

+7 Boost

LOL!

AmazingBimmer - 10/25/2006 6:17:10 PM

-4 Boost

here we go again. the bmw competitor will kill it as it does every other car from audi. I do like a few benz products these days, much as my screen name does not suggest. the s and gl are really nice as is the sl (alwys has been). nice to see thm finding their way again. bring on the fight. it wil lonly push BMW to make better products and we all win.( well.. other than audi fans!!)

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 7:19:39 PM

+1 Boost

Ha!

Does RS4 > M3, A8 > 7 Series, or A3 > 1 Series ring a bell?

Mark - 10/26/2006 7:11:12 AM

+6 Boost

Right Amazing....because those stories are posted all over the internet and printed in the magazines that BMW is so superior to Audi that they should just close their doors and go home. What was VAG thinking keeping Audi alive for so long?

I can't believe that we spend our entire day chatting on a car enthusiast Web site about BMW and that there is no one out there to compete against them and try and topple they ever so wonderful company that they are.

BMW is sooo perfect they don’t do anything wrong and 100% of every car they make and every model they put out is perfect and no one does it better……………………………………………………did I get your point right?

Secretly this is called BMWSpies, though some from the Lexus camp would say it’s also called LexusSpies.

Rupert - 10/27/2006 6:22:26 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

its audispies, you only have to change 2 letters then.

NARunner - 10/25/2006 6:47:16 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

kill is such a strong word...i think what you meant is that the bmw competitor will fall just short of the audi, but it will come close enough so that we can continue to argue about it on this site.

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JUGNU - 10/25/2006 7:01:21 PMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Lexus is having very big plans about the LF-A,as u can also see their Convertable variant is also out there testing.They r pretty serious about it and will launch it in their style......means they have already studied/they know their Market,coustomers,targets,AUDIences....etc

Unlike Audi,for whom the job was easier as the R8 is just based on the gallardo,the V8 version got the whole RS4's mechanicals,and the upcoming V10 will be getting the current gallrdo's(not the refreshed one's).

By the way i agree with the Post's author,German nut,but not on Lexus issue.
They r not behind Audi at such a decision,but yeah late at bringing it to the market.

R8 will be followed by the LF-A very soon in late 2007 then it's going to Mercedes Mclaren P8 and BMW's Z10/M10 debuting nearly at the same time in 2009.

All in all,We should aplaud and appreciate Audi for bringing these new niche of Exotic-type of cars first at the MARKET.

JUGNU----->THE CARMAN

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S4cabriofox - 10/25/2006 7:21:28 PM

+1 Boost

"Unlike Audi,for whom the job was easier as the R8 is just based on the gallardo,the V8 version got the whole RS4's mechanicals,and the upcoming V10 will be getting the current gallrdo's(not the refreshed one's)."

That's not saying much. Audi took twice as much time developing the Gallardo, RS4 and R8 as Lexus took developing the LF-A. I mean, do you think the Gallardo platform and RS4 engine just magically appeared out of thin air, and they just happened to use them in the R8 without trying? No, they developed them.

iown1 - 10/25/2006 7:40:08 PM

0 Boost

But Will, honestly would you rather have a rebadged Toyota or a rebadged Lamborghini? Be honest.

luvmybmr - 10/26/2006 10:39:04 AM

+2 Boost

hey, im not going to say its a rebadged supra. i have a lot of respect for the supra twin-turbo. it was way ahead of its time. so the LF-A better be real nice to even be considered named a rebadged supra

S4cabriofox - 10/26/2006 6:53:02 PM

+2 Boost

The Supra was a very cool car. Not QUITE as cool as a Lambo, but cool, nonetheless.

The LF-A will have no relation to the Supra, unless it comes back from the dead based on the LF-A, and all sane people on this site will realize that.

Rupert - 10/27/2006 6:24:28 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

will, if the lf-a is any good, i'll like it. if however it has lots of fake metal-plastic (why is that in the LS? it ruins it for me) and handles like a a mercedes, then :(

S4cabriofox - 10/29/2006 1:24:48 AM

+1 Boost

Rupert- exactly!!! Will doesn't realize how ugly the plastic is on the LS's dash!

There's a difference between "comfort" and "style", Will. The LS460 will surely be comfortable, but its cabin isn't all that special, or stylish, in this company.

I've seen two on the road- an LS460L yesterday and a normal LS460 today. Boring, just as I thought. I was excited to have seen one, but not necessarily impressed. Then I saw the S550 later and my happiness was regained, because there are interesting luxury sedans in the world.

GermanNut - 10/25/2006 7:28:40 PM

-2 Boost

I should be the biggest BMW fan boy on this site based on our lineup of cars. I like to give credit where credit is due. The Audi R8 at this point in time, will slaughter any BMW around the ring.

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phantom330 - 10/25/2006 8:24:14 PM

-2 Boost

gosh this site is retarded. Are there any posts out there that don't go into brand wars? Anybody that argues on any of them is an immature imbecile.

Anyways, the R8 is a sweet car, and I can't wait to see the competition it springs, should make for an interesting group of cars.

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justinT - 10/25/2006 8:45:23 PM

+2 Boost

I still love all the comparisons between the RS4 and the current M3. V8 vs I6. That's great that audi has a car that's faster and handles better than a car that came out 5 years. great comparison. can we focus on the R8 and how it's driving the other brands to put something into production. Until the next gen. M3 is released, who cares.

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smshnick - 10/25/2006 8:50:08 PM

-1 Boost

My guess is that the Mercedes P8 (once it gets off the drawing board), will be over $150,000. Of course it will have a supercharged 7.5422 liter blah blah blah engine.. etc, etc.. Mercedes should stick to what they do best; fat, heavy, gt's that cost too much.

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S4cabriofox - 10/26/2006 6:54:26 PM

+1 Boost

LOL!

No, it will have an 8.5L supercharged V16 with 7,500hp.

XYZZ - 10/27/2006 6:01:27 AM

+1 Boost

it will have a Zeppelin motor!

(Maybachs used to power zeppelins)

Larry - 10/25/2006 10:36:38 PM

+5 Boost

BMW is working on a Mercedes SL type car, Z8 replacement, i saw it on the CAR magazine website, they voted against a mid-engined M1 replacement there is smaller market for mid-engined with competition like Ferrari, Lamborghi, Porsche, Lotus, etc. Audi can afford to have a R8 it shares the platform with the Gallardo, with the Gallardo making a profit, All audi R8 sales are a bonus. This is good I am happy audi has a car to raise their profile.

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Tillo - 10/25/2006 10:53:15 PM

+2 Boost

Don't forget about the upcoming Nissan GT-R, with AWD it should be a great rival to the R8, cheaper too.

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IamEvilHomer - 10/25/2006 10:57:07 PM

-6 Boost

Tillo-- I now vote that last coment as bigest idiot comment of 2006. Anyone to 2nd that ?

sulev - 10/26/2006 1:22:17 AM

+2 Boost

Homer,
have you not heard the legendary Skyline? it was so good, it is said you're able to squeeze 1000 ponies out from the stock engine with little bit of fine tuning. The GT-R is supposedly the long awaited replacement for the Skyline. I think it has all the POTENTIAL in the world to be a worthy competitor of the R8, LF-A, or the SLR. I can't wait to see the real data when it's out, I bet they're gonna be awesome!

Homer008 - 10/26/2006 1:57:39 AM

0 Boost

I agree with sulev on this. Nissan GT-R is indeed LEGENDARY in Japan and germany's test tracks - after GT-R beat the living crap out of a Porsche 911 turbo around 10 yrs. ago!

Homer008 - 10/26/2006 2:03:34 AM

-8 Boost

VW's dismal reputation for quality (i.e. MB, BMW and Audi) with noisy brakes has ranked awesome 35th out of 37 nameplates in its latest survey of initial vehicle quality. J.D. Power ranks btw. VW are actually being predicted by some to go belly up in the U.S. soon.

So my Question is..Ricemaster..how dare you to insult a Toyota with a VW? How dare you to put a POS VW with a Toyota on a same sentence??? Please DO NOT piss me off like this again. Do NOT put a crappy VW, KIA, BMW etc on a benchmark i.e Toyota on a same sentence.

Thank You.

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Willis - 10/26/2006 8:19:12 AM

0 Boost

Ricemaster, the LF-A isn't even out yet. How do we know it will even outhandle the SL?

Last time I checked, Mercedes' generally handled better than Lexus' cars.

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justinT - 10/26/2006 10:52:53 AM

0 Boost

put a crappy POS BMW, Kia, VW on the Benchmark that is Toyota, what are you smoking? And don't piss you off like that again...what are you going do to Mr. Hardass, make another post and we're all going to be shaking in our skivies?

Come on, seriously, tough guys on the internet, nice try. Halloween is next tuesday, go scare some kids in your neighborhood.

can you even get leather on any toyota model...not Lexus, toyota. Can you get DVD entertainment or navigation? what about heated/air condiditioned rear seats? what about camera so you can see what's going on when you reverse?

On price and available luxury and options, toyota (not the lexus models, just the toyotas) are more in line with Kia, Hyundai than with VW and BMW.

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justinT - 10/26/2006 11:35:54 AM

0 Boost

it's about time. A friend of mine has a Camry, it's a nice car. but it's a pretty basic car. no heated seats, nothing entertainment, except for the AM/FM/CD/Cassette. i does have cruise control and electric windows and power door locks though. It's a nice car, but it's definately not an Audi, Mer., or BMW. The lexus is a really nice step up on that car, I just personally don't like the look of the ES.

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justinT - 10/26/2006 1:45:19 PM

-1 Boost

ok, i was wrong about what's available from current toyotas. I still disagree with throwing Mercedes, Audi, VW, and BMW in the same mix with kia, etc.

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adoptgreyhounds - 10/26/2006 5:55:29 PM

+2 Boost

nicehomer you're a DICK

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XYZZ - 10/27/2006 6:26:38 AM

+1 Boost

not only can you get leather even in the corolla, with the new upcoming model, there'll be a backup camera available.

AND... the self-parking feature offered on the lexus.

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S4cabriofox - 10/29/2006 1:27:08 AM

+1 Boost

Actually, in an odd twist of events, for the 2007 model year, just before the new Corolla comes out, leather seats aren't available on the current model any more.

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MPowerDK - 10/26/2006 2:10:47 AM

+5 Boost

R8 and how many of you are going to buy one?

We dont need cars like that, nor M and AMG cars.

We need cars that run more miles/KM on the gasoline.

In Europe where i am from, we drive cars with smaller engines than you in the states. You dont even get BMW, Audi or MB with smal engines. But anyway i get around in my BMW 316i, of course it would be fun do drive the 335i turbo coupe, but i get to my goal anyway.

USA should think more of the environment. Remember where the oil comes from? middleeast, have you seen their houses sorry palaces? they dont know what to do with all the money they earn from the oil. If we just could use less of it.

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matt635 - 10/26/2006 4:06:57 AM

+4 Boost

Out of the steaming pile of bullshit that is this thread comes an intelligent honest post... well done mpower

Gennissen - 10/26/2006 5:58:03 AM

-2 Boost

Dude, go sleep.

Rupert - 10/27/2006 6:30:08 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

318d. with hubcaps. cloth. etc.
a3 1.6. 116d. c180. e200. 520i. a6 2.0 tdi. golf 1.4.

we get them all here in europe.

S4cabriofox - 10/29/2006 1:31:02 AM

+1 Boost

Yes, but you also get better cars than us, such as:

From Audi: RS4 Cabriolet and Avant, A8L 4.2TDI, A6 4.2 Avant, S3 (those are all I know of that are better)

From others: 335d/535d/735d (if that even exists, is it the 740d?), Range Rover diesel, S450 (that's a perfect medium between not enough performance and too much performance), etc, etc, etc...

But we get the Cadillac Escalade! In your face!

(-;

Rupert - 10/29/2006 6:01:12 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

we don't get an s450, it is a US only motor, i think. but hah, you don't get the gl420cdi too, but then again england doesn't get the s420cdi. mainland does.
and its a 730d, and for continental europe a 740d too.
and i'm not too proud about the clk 200k, or e 200k. and the S280....
but you get all those 4x4 saloons like the 330xi and 4matic stuff. the uk doesn't get that, because when it snows here, its only about 1 inch and the government scares us all into sitting at home.
and cadillac are now beginining to import to the uk. i can get left hand drive srx and xlr. for the same price as an ML and an SL. why would i want them?

Homer008 - 10/26/2006 6:47:06 PM

-2 Boost

white ladies in Japan is in reference to many poor eastern european ladies and russian ladies working at niteclubs. Its best $ they ever could make w/their nice hot white bodies..I know what he is talking about.

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justinT - 10/26/2006 2:05:56 PM

+4 Boost

I agree on the pricing of VW, my brother-in-law is looking to buy his first car at 16, and i was looking at vw's - jettas, used for 25,000. i dont know what they've done to them since i bought one back in 96 that had leather and all the extras on it to have their prices up close to 30 grand.

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XYZZ - 10/27/2006 5:58:09 AM

+1 Boost

i agree with wilco.

rice is even more radical in his political views than i am, which is saying something!

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answer - 10/26/2006 11:22:29 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

Shouldn't EL34 have posted something amazingly stupid by now?

I hope he's OK.

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BMW_DRVR - 10/26/2006 12:08:34 PM

-1 Boost

All of you people who were comparing a GT-R to the R8 are idiots. Compare it with cars like the M3.

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answer - 10/26/2006 1:53:16 PMView My AgentSpace

+6 Boost

I think when his mom is driving him to Chuck E. Cheese in her minivan he pretends he is driving a cool car. Maybe the R8 is a far superior vehicle in his daydreams.

S4cabriofox - 10/26/2006 7:00:29 PM

0 Boost

M3?

The R8 is faster than the M6, you numbskull!

smshnick - 10/26/2006 8:32:30 PM

+2 Boost

Until Lexus, BMW, and MB come up with something besides a drawing or a concept, there's nothing to really talk about here. On the other hand, we don't even have a road test of the R8 yet, the car could turn out to be a disappointment(though unlikely)

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S4cabriofox - 10/26/2006 9:55:35 PM

+2 Boost

All of that is true.

But I highly doubt that it will disappoint (I know you weren't bashing Audi). A mid-engined, AWD, 420hp, seductively styled supercar. What's not to like?

Willis - 10/27/2006 9:46:29 AM

+1 Boost

Mercedes had that P8 concept car long before the Audi R8 came out. The idea was canned though.

S4cabriofox - 10/29/2006 1:32:49 AM

+1 Boost

The LeMans concept debuted around the time the P8 rumor was exposed, so no, not really.

luvmybmr - 10/27/2006 12:49:59 PM

+1 Boost

"Lexus LF-A is front engine y'all!! "

=======================================================

WRONGGGGGGGGGG

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watisthat - 10/27/2006 1:56:12 PM

+1 Boost

Are u sure its not front engine because that back trunk is too small to fit a engine.

luvmybmr - 10/27/2006 3:34:11 PM

+1 Boost

its stil a toss up with toyota, they might change it to a front-engine, but as of right now the concept was a mid-engined car.

http://autos.msn.com/as/minishow/article.aspx?contentID=4023522&s=Tokyo2005

Rupert - 10/27/2006 3:48:30 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

might change it? when is this car coming out? if they still "might change it" then its probably like 6 years away.

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luvmybmr - 10/27/2006 5:02:14 PM

+2 Boost

http://www.windingroad.com/news-page/update-news-rumors-6-page/

S4cabriofox - 10/29/2006 1:35:18 AM

0 Boost

"might change it? when is this car coming out? if they still "might change it" then its probably like 6 years away."

True. There's no time for "changes" when it's already going around the Nürburgring, especially if they want it to compete with the R8 soon. But I doubt they'll be able to upstage it- it looks like every other sportscar, whereas the R8 is so different, in a good way. I mean, look at that EVO cover! Stunning!

2JZSoarer - 10/27/2006 10:53:18 PM

+1 Boost

I don't think the LF-A and the next Supra will share platforms,one reason is that they will not offer a V10 in a Supra,only V8 and a High output V6....
Many of you say that LF-A will on have the F1 V10 engine in it,but Car and Driver said that they heard the LF-A testing at Fuji speedway,and it sure sounded like a F1 vehicle...I think it will have a F1 enigine,but they will lower they HP in order to make it street legal..

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2JZSoarer - 10/27/2006 10:56:46 PM

+1 Boost

Mistype:
I don't think the LF-A and the next Supra will share platforms,one reason is that they will not offer a V10 in a Supra,only V8 and a High output V6....
Many of you say that LF-A will not have the F1 V10 engine in it,but Car and Driver said that they heard the LF-A testing at Fuji speedway,and it sure sounded like a F1 vehicle...I think it will have a F1 enigine,but they will lower they HP in order to make it street legal..

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XYZZ - 10/29/2006 7:47:04 AM

+1 Boost

are you just naturally dumb or do you have to WORK at it?

who made a rule saying one must have a "motor sports pedigree" to make a sports car? what racing history did mazda have, before bringing out the Miata? and way before that, the RX-7?

in any case, everyone KNOWS toyota's history. and almost everyone knows lexus is part of toyota.

if a NEW sports car came out from brand X with no racing history, and it just happened to have a de-tuned Formula One engine in it, would you say Brand X is NOT ENTITLED to make a sports car?

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Rupert - 10/29/2006 3:29:00 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

like pagani or koenigsegg. correct me if i'm wrong, but i don't think they have a scrap of history.

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2JZSoarer - 10/29/2006 4:11:41 PM

+1 Boost

What about the 2JZ-GTE,that was well ahead of it's time with 320 hp in 1993,and capable of well over 1000hp with a stock block !!!

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2JZSoarer - 10/29/2006 4:29:35 PM

+1 Boost

Oh lets not forget the Rolex Series where Lexus has won a championship over BMW,Porsche,Infiniti,Pontiac and ect,with a smaller engine than it's rivals!Toyota is the richest company in the world,I'm sure that they can spend the money to R&D a high performance supercar to beat the other supercars,it's just that Toyota works smarter than the others somehow!!

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