German cars take top spot in 7 of 8 classes in reliablity statistics

TheSailor submitted on 06/19/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 8:15 AM
from: www.adac.de

[87] user comments | category: Misc News

Tags: ADAC, reliability, Germany

Tag Links:

ADAC

reliability

Germany

German cars take top spot in 7 of 8 classes in reliablity statistics

Due to the fact that I'm moving and that i'm off to Singapore on monday, I haven't had the time to post on here for the last week or so, but yesterday I stumbled over this very interesting report from the German version of the AAA, ADAC and I thought I'd just share it with everybody.

Each year ADAC release statistics showing the number of times they have responded to break downs. The numbers are divided into 8 different classes ranging from Small cars to MPVs and have been calculated as the number of breakdowns per 1000 vehicles sold of that specific model.

Here are the most reliable cars in each class:

"Kleine Klasse" - Sub compacts
Audi A2

"Untere mittelklasse" - compacts
BMW 1-series

"Mittelklasse" - Compact sedans
Audi A4

"Obere mittelklasse" - Large sedans
Audi A6

"Sportwagen/cabrios" - Convertibles
Mercedes CLK

"Geländewagen" - SUVs
BMW X3

"Kleine Vans" - Small MPVs
Mazda Premacy

"Grosse Vans" - MPVs
VW Sharan

Click the link to see the statistics (PDF): Read Article

Comments:

Images hosted in your AgentSpace can now be posted in the comments section using the following syntax (case matters):
[img]IMAGE URL[/img]
Example: [img]http://agent004.myautospies.com/users/150/Sample-Gallery/sample1.JPG[/img]

Will_ - 6/19/2007 8:39:09 AM

+2 Boost

It's never been a secret that European cars have better reliability statistics in their home countries than in the rest of the world. Maybe European workers just take more pride in assembling automobiles?

reply to this comment

EnnNorak - 6/20/2007 10:50:56 AM

+1 Boost

German workers take pride in their work but I'm not so sure about all the workers that were imported from less developed countries. Hopefully the German work ethic has rubbed off on them. Maybe the reason for Mercedes' qualitiy woes in recent years was due to the slow transfer of the traditional German work ethic to some elements of the foreign work force.

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 8:39:16 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Sorry... Forgot to mention that the report doesn't include the "überklasse" with cars like the S-class, A8, 7 series and Jaguar XJ because they are not sold in large enough numbers to provide proper data. The report only includes the 87 most common models.

reply to this comment

Will_ - 6/19/2007 8:47:33 AM

0 Boost

Well, everyone I'll go ahead and spoil the turmoil: they didn't even bother to test a Lexus vehicle...

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 9:07:28 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

TEST?! They didn't test anything... These are statistics. Statistics don't lie... I chose not to mention the LS, not ADAC... Last year, Lexus sold 105 LS last year in Germany, Mercedes sold 11.000 S-class... The same applies to both the GS and the IS. Lexus sold 1000 GS and around 2000 IS... Mercedes sold 56.000 E-classes and 62000 C-classes (In the last year of the old model!) and the E and C-class aren't even the leaders in their segments. (Audi sold 64k A6s and BMW sold 115k 3-series)... That is the reason why you don't find any Lexuses on that list!

http://www.autobild.de/aktuell/meldungen/artikel.php?artikel_id=13018&artikel_seite=1

Will_ - 6/19/2007 9:20:35 AM

+1 Boost

So they didn't "test" them? Oh, so this is based off of a survey of people who actually own those cars then?

And no need to get touchy! I know Lexus sells very few cars in Europe, I knew you or some other goon would clear that up though, lol.

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 9:35:54 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

NO... This isn't a survey either... This is an actual statistic of how many times ADAC responded to a car stranded at the side of the road. Not how many people experienced breakdowns, how many people who knew somebody who once heard of somebody who had a car which might have broken down. This is hard facts... No room for interpretation and no posibility for the famed german bias.

Will_ - 6/19/2007 9:59:54 AM

+1 Boost

I think the fact that only European cars (alongside a Japanese one that Europeans just love to death) topped this study done in Europe automatically instills a bias. Let's see the Germans pull this off in any other region of the world...

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:14:18 AMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

So the cars are biased? Less german cars simply choose to break down on german roads? Is that what you are saying? Because that is the only way these numbers can be biased! And the reason why there is only german and japanese cars (didn't know KIA was japanese though) is because american cars are generally to crappy for the european market!

Will_ - 6/19/2007 10:29:54 AM

+2 Boost

That implies a bias to me. American cars are "too crappy" and Lexus "isn't cool enough."

I'm not saying the cars, or the people are "biased" in the infamous sense of the word here, I'm just saying since the study is based in Europe there is automatically a bias towards their makes.

What do you want from me? I don't doubt that those cars are reliable. Good job Germany for making cars that don't leave your European customers stranded on the side of the road! ;)

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:47:57 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Well... People might be biased towards the european and japanese cars because they are better suited to europe if that is what you mean... But that is because american cars are crappy (well, it might be an overstatement, but their quality isn't up to european standard)... The European Ford Focus interior has a better look and feel to it than the old CTS or the 300C even though they both cost at least twice as much as the most expensive Ford Focus...

As to the Lexus, Lexus are seen as cool among young people in europe, because it is different, but due to our high car prices and the lack of a proper engine line up in the cars, they have a hard time here! We get a bad diesel in the IS (trust me, it is bad and the fuel economy is appaling compared to the competitors) but we don't get the IS350... And the GS is only offered with the 430 or the 450 engine... And the LS only has a single engine to choose from... That doesn't cut it in europe! People want the luxury of the big cars, but since gas prices are so high, they don't want to pay for the consumption of those big engines...

S4cabriofoxone - 6/19/2007 12:06:31 PMView My AgentSpace

-3 Boost

"What do you want from me? I don't doubt that those cars are reliable."

Will, you were the one who started this argument, and you also have been fighting what Sailor has been saying. How in the hell is this biased? Why is it that if a Lexus doesn't win, it's BIASED?!

Will_ - 6/19/2007 12:38:55 PM

+3 Boost

I didn't start any argument, but I'd expect you to place all blame on me here.

TheSailor's the one who went off the wall with his responses.

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 5:58:45 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

How did I "go off the wall" Will? You made a claim that Lexus wasn't on there because they were uncool, trying to get an argument out of it and you got it! But I don't see how I went off the wall... I just explained to you why Lexus isn't in the survey... And why does it matter anyway? Why did you have to bring up Lexus? I even chose not to mention it trying to avoid fanboys crowding me with those stupid "bias"-arguments... Seems like I failed...

Anthony - 6/19/2007 6:45:44 PM

+2 Boost

Judging from the girth of your comments I'd say you're pretty happy he did bring up Lexus. Haven't you learned the art of Will's sarcasm yet anyway? Not all of it requires a response...

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 7:05:34 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Art? There is no art to it... Just a bitter man who think that everybody is out to get his beloved Lexus and each time somebody fails to mention it in a good way (or mention it at all), he is there to toot the Lexus-horn. That is not art, that is arrogance and bitterness. His "sarcasm" is misplaced and if you haven't read lots and lots of his posts, it is completely impossible to spot. Rather than making him look better and more intelligent than the people he is trying to make fun of(which is obviously what he is trying to do), it makes him look exactly the opposite... And I don't see why he had to bring up Lexus... So yes, I jumped at the opportunity to force him into a corner... Looks like I succeeded...

Will_ - 6/20/2007 11:12:09 AM

+1 Boost

Yes, this corner is quite nice.

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 9:11:13 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

You got me... Yes it is...

I am actually the grand son of Propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels!

reply to this comment

r_driver04 - 6/19/2007 4:27:59 PM

-3 Boost

Pass some of that stuff you've been smokin homie. Lets be honest with ourselves and state the facts. Japanese cars have less problems compared to european cars. Consumer reports noted a 1998 Lexus LS had less problems than a 2006 E Class Benz. CS is not gospel but lets be honest. BMW has to literally throw in a 4yr Maint. plan just to get people to buy 'em.

I'm not biased, just realistic. This forum keeps having the same stupid discussion over and over again.

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 9:38:45 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

It is anything which makes you grind to a hault requiring professional assistance to get the car to a workshop or going again...

Things such as blown tires or crashes are not included. Whether they include dead bateries I don't know.

reply to this comment

Htay7500 - 6/19/2007 9:59:22 AM

+3 Boost

terrible maintenence/care = terrible and a unreliable car.

these days cars are getting the same reliability.

reply to this comment

Will_ - 6/19/2007 10:08:37 AM

+2 Boost

Also, someone (Sailor) explain why there's not a rating for the specific year of 2006 for the Audi A2? Looking at the data table, there's nothing even under '2006' for the Audi A2. The Mazda doesn't have specific ratings from 2004, 2005, or 2006!

Are these results an average corresponding to model year or not?

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:11:32 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Because the A2 wasn't sold in 2006... The last year of the A2 was 2005... But it is still the car with the least breakdowns pr 1000 A2s...

S4cabriofoxone - 6/19/2007 12:08:01 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

Will, this obviously doesn't only include new cars, like American tests.

SevorbeupstryIsBack - 6/20/2007 7:39:57 AM

0 Boost

I can confirm this. The Audi A2 is a very reliable car. My Audi dealer gave it to me as a replacement car for when the A8 was is the shop maintance.

He claimed that it is the most reliable small Audi ever made.

Htay7500 - 6/19/2007 10:12:59 AM

-1 Boost

anyways, sailor why are you moving to Singapore?

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:42:01 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

I'm not... I was moving to another place in Denmark and I am going to Singapore to embark the Regina Mærsk, a danish container vessel... Then I'll be going to China then Los Angeles, Vancouver, Yokohama, Beijing, Shanghai, Kaohsiung, Hong Kong, then Singapore again, Malaysia (just outside of Singapore actually), Dubai, Colombo (sri Lanka) And then I'll start from the beginning again (singapore, LA etc) and hopefully, I'll be back home primo October...

Htay7500 - 6/19/2007 11:58:13 AM

0 Boost

ohh you are pretty much my dad in the 70's and 80's (cause he was a merchant sailor. but went to different places minus singapore and la.

SevorbeupstryIsBack - 6/20/2007 8:24:41 AM

0 Boost

That must be a very exciting job. You see alot of places and alot of people.

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 8:52:38 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

It is very interesting... But it's the job that is interesting, most of the time it is just a lot of water. A whole lotta water and then a little land. Usually, the ship isn't along side more than 12-18 hours in any given port and the terminals are usually situated 1-2 hours from the cities, but on this route there is a lot of inner city harbours like Hong Kong (fantastic place), Dubai (fantastic place), L.A. (fantastic place - if you like ghettos) and Vancouver (never been there)...
But yes, it's a very very interesting and challenging job. And the best thing is that I have six months payed vacation each year...

Htay7500 - 6/20/2007 9:40:43 AM

+1 Boost

where did you first start? my dad went to yangon (cause hes from there)

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 10:23:42 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Where I started? I'm not sure I follow you here... Where I went to school? In a little town in Denmark called Svendborg (www.simac.dk)... You don't just go to a ship and get a job today... No matter what your function, you have to get some kind of education before you are even allowed onboard a merchant marine ship. So I was hired by A.P. Møller - Mærsk (a danish ship owner and the worlds largest container ship operator) and went to school in Svendborg for a coulpe of years. I then embarked my first ship in Algeciras in Spain...
But I am not one of the "old school" sailors who was either a marine engineer or a navigator... I'm both, which means I get more money! :D What company did your father sail for?

Htay7500 - 6/19/2007 10:20:30 AM

+1 Boost

BTW: Mazda Premacy= US Mazda 3 (Mazda was awarded w/ the best quality in Germany btw)

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:38:28 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

I'm not sure about that... We have the Mazda 3 here as well... The Premacy was a small compact MPV that looked really bad...

Will_ - 6/19/2007 10:47:40 AM

+3 Boost

They may be based off of each other, but the Mazda 3 is actually a fun-to-drive, sporty hatchback and sedan with good styling for a car its size here in the States.

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 10:48:46 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

The european and american Mazda3 is the same car...

Htay7500 - 6/19/2007 5:46:37 PM

+1 Boost

my bad mazda 5 = mazda premacy in Europe. I was totally asleep.

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 8:46:46 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Hmm... That sounds more plausible... Because we got the Mazda Premacy until a few years ago when the old model was discontinued...

S4cabriofoxone - 6/19/2007 12:13:05 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

You just sound like a broken record to me, GS300: "blah, blah, blah... unreliable... GERMAN... broken down, blah, blah blah..."

But really? Have you owned a German car that is newer than 1986? Because not once have any of my German cars broken down, nor have they had electronic failures- not even small inconveniences. The worst thing I can think of is the headlight washer cap coming off at high speeds on my 2000 A6 2.7T. That's not really a reliability issue, though- it's because whoever put on those headlight washer caps didn't do a good job.

Judging by the experiences I've had with these cars, it's less about how "reliable" a car is, because that can't really be measured. It's about how you maintain it. It's been the same with our Lexii- the worst thing that happened was the speedometer freezing in our '98 RX300. It's because we take car of our cars. In fact, I've had a much better experience with our four Audi models than I did have with two Acuras.

reply to this comment

carfan444 - 6/20/2007 5:55:19 PM

+1 Boost

What is "perogative"? If you mean prerogative, then thank you for clearing that up...I wasn’t sure if people had the right to choose their car. Also, I'm not sure of "everyone" knowing that German cars are unreliable. Last time I checked, (c.a. 20th, 21st century) German engineering as a whole was the most reliable and admirable. German cars have always been the best example of German engineering, and the companies that build these cars have been emulated by every other car manufacturer (esp. Toyota). I think you have to look at the big picture, 06GS300: The Japanese have indeed mastered the technique of copying - to the point where they now build a good car. If it is too difficult for you to see that your GS300 is merely an imposter (although a good one), then perhaps you should look at the values of your carmaker, and their origins: Luxury mixed with performance, safety and design, technological innovation - all of these come from one place: THE GERMAN AUTOMAKERS

reply to this comment

chuck717 - 6/19/2007 11:47:18 AM

+1 Boost

Although my choice for car is German not because of they are better i just like the class the cars have going down the road. But i must say when we sold a used Luxus,Acura or Infiniti we rarely had to worry the cutomer would come back and call it a lemon.
The Euro cars are a different story, buyers of them pretty much knew that they may have some problem down the road they were much more ready to ask if the German cars are still under factory warranty then the Japanese cars.
To be fair though, any car passed 60k could be suspect and Lexus and Infiniti are just as expensive to repair, for the most part in the luxury end of the business people want what they want even if they may have problems, the status thing is big for them.

reply to this comment

hieneken - 6/19/2007 11:56:32 AM

-2 Boost

Nobody in America are buying this bull shit you GERMAN FANS.We all knew that the GERMAN cars are rank the last of the list every year consumer report in America.THe Newspaper show it, the News show it.even a 5 years old knew about it period

reply to this comment

Rupert - 6/19/2007 12:11:53 PMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

Wow you insightfulness has really contributed to this site, you should have a medal.
What about The A8 and S class coming top in the JD power initial quality survey this year? Or Mercedes coming top in 3 categories?
Your ridiculous bias is, well, ridiculous.

S4cabriofoxone - 6/19/2007 12:14:38 PMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

No, Rupert, WE'RE obviously the biased ones. Lexus is the best at everything, remember? And if a German car wins, it's just not true. Impossible!

Will_ - 6/19/2007 12:41:41 PM

0 Boost

He said NOTHING about Lexus. You are a hypocritical INSTIGATOR S4Cab...

r_driver04 - 6/19/2007 4:33:02 PM

0 Boost

Initial Quality sure, I expect the S Class to be on top. But check back with them in 30K miles, if they even still own the car.

Rupert - 6/19/2007 4:20:23 PMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Well I don't see Toyota up there either...

reply to this comment

Will_ - 6/19/2007 12:44:45 PM

0 Boost

Why aren't any German fans trying to discredit the source? Oh wait, 'cause their cars did well...

reply to this comment

silent_power - 6/19/2007 1:17:38 PM

+3 Boost

Congrats fanoz, you 've done unbelievably well in reliability.

small cars
Total results
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15138&admin=1

engine crap
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15140&admin=1

suspension, brakes, steering wheel crap
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15141&admin=1

electric/safety equipment crap Beware of electric shock...Also keep singing "You light my <<dashboard>> fire"
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15142&admin=1

Car-shop Lovers...
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15143&admin=1

C
-

Total results
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15139&admin=1

engine crap
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15144&admin=1

suspension, brakes, steering wheel crap
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15145&admin=1

electric/safety equipment crap Beware of electric shock... Also keep singing "You light my <<dashboard>> fire"
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15146&admin=1

Chassis crap
http://www.autotriti.gr/autotriti/_magazine/viewthema_autotriti_admin.asp?id_thema=34732&link_id=15147&admin=1

reply to this comment

cdoke - 6/19/2007 1:20:53 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

"Statistics don't lie..."

What!?!

I guess the book "How to Lie with Statistics" is full of it. Benjamin Disraeli too, "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." [via Mark Twain]

It is exceptionally easy to lie with statistics. One of the most important realizations is that whenever you use the mean you are assuming in most cases a Normal distribution. Let's assume that you take all the cases for car life of a certain car in terms of time and plot them and it generates a log-normal distribution [which is probably the case with the real data- such is very common in nature] and the average [arithmetic mean] is some number. Here is the caveat- if you go buy that car your car probably won't reach the mean. The place that your car will most likely fail is the Mode: before the mean and before the Median as well.

Now, there are certain instances where the Median is used for permeability in single value flow equations, but this is has to do with the geometric configuration of the permeability heterogeneities given laminated permeable strata. But that situation is different in what the distribution actually represents.

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/19/2007 5:29:53 PMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

Well... We have to make a distinction here... One thing is lieing another thing is twisting facts... You can twist facts using statistics, but they don't lie! You can lie about statistics, but that isn't the statistics fault...

reply to this comment

S4cabriofoxone - 6/20/2007 1:49:49 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

"Why aren't any German fans trying to discredit the source? Oh wait, 'cause their cars did well..."

Real true, Will. Especially when your camp does the EXACT SAME THING. It's human nature, can you accept that?

When Toyota/Lexus win reliability awards, the source is "OBVIOUSLY" un-biased and 100% truthful. But now, when these German cars come out on top, you're trying to come up with excuses for why Lexus didn't win and why this survey is biased! If not you, your Lexus friends! Take a peek!

reply to this comment

SevorbeupstryIsBack - 6/20/2007 7:37:18 AM

-1 Boost

"Well, everyone I'll go ahead and spoil the turmoil: they didn't even bother to test a Lexus vehicle..."

WHAT??? This isn't a test or enquete!

You are not making any sense!

reply to this comment

xj13 - 6/20/2007 10:04:27 AM

-1 Boost

Don't mess with German cars, they have pedigree, Japanese cars only started copying in the early 60's fullstop

reply to this comment

Loki123 - 6/21/2007 3:01:11 PM

+2 Boost

I wouldn't touch a German car with a 10 foot pole. Can't polish a turd.

Will_ - 6/20/2007 11:15:43 AM

+2 Boost

I've tried being nice. That doesn't work.
I've tried being honest. That doesn't work.
I've tried being sarcastic. That works, but then my allies start hating me...

Looks like I'm just going to have to be mean.
German cars suck, and are in no way superior than even Chinese cars.

End.

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 11:55:59 AMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

Work? What are you talking about?

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 11:57:01 AMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

BTW: That is not being mean... Just plain stupid and ignorant!

answer - 6/20/2007 11:20:59 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Here is the cool thing: you don't just use one study/survey to form an opinion on vehicle reliablity. You take a study like this, research data from Consumer Reports, and owner reviews from places like Edmunds.com and come to a logical conclusion.

If you do that, you see that Japanese cars have faired better than most in terms of both short term and long term reliability, AND German car companies are generally doing better than ever with their reliability.

There are too many variables for one study to be the foundation for anything.

People shouldn't get pissed because one study shows one thing, or one review has a .01 second faster 0-60 time.

Relax.

reply to this comment

flozel1 - 6/20/2007 1:01:55 PM

+3 Boost

A "breakdown" of the mental variety was something that a moron named formula1diot had happened to him in his formative years.

The only thing of this imbecle that breaks down these days is his donkey-drawn carriage, which he fixes with his crooked donkey-$hit stained teeth.

reply to this comment

justbrown - 6/20/2007 4:28:23 PM

+4 Boost

"People shouldn't get pissed because one study shows one thing, or one review has a .01 second faster 0-60 time."

RELAX!

Best thing i've read in this forum to date. Everyone has had a different experience and there will always be one person who had a flawless experience with the "statistically" most unreliable car. The truth is that in the states, Toyota/Lexus is seen as having great reliability. Mercedes/BMW have a less positive reputation when it comes to reliability due to their shaky past. This aside, I think that most of these car companies are taking great strides (see GM) to improve their reliability and in the end, it is the consumers that benefit from this progression. I say it is a welcome contribution to see so many reliable German cars, but my viewpoint may be skewed because unlike the rest of you, I don't work at BMW/Mercedes/Lexus/GM..etc

reply to this comment

no1listensanyway - 6/20/2007 6:53:48 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

I have never heard of German cars lasting that long without tons of matinence and repairs. German cars are simply built too complicated and parts are expensive and hard to find. On the other hand, my friends dad has a Toyota Avalon with 380,000 miles on it and the only non - matinence issue he had was replacing the power steering system.

My first car was a 92 Toyota Camry that was salvaged and welded back together in 12 places. The damn thing wouldn't die after 220,000 miles on the clock. I still sold it for $800. My dads 04 LX470 has 120,000 on the clock and still looks brand new and never had a problem. I know Bimmers are damn reliable, one of my friends had a 525 for like 200,000 miles. But Audi's are simply disasters...

reply to this comment

TheSailor - 6/20/2007 7:10:33 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Diesel mercedes' have been known to go more than 400.000 miles with no issues at all... That is why they are so popular in Europe! And I don't think you know just how many old BMWs, Audis and even VWs we have here in Europe easily clocking up both 250.000 and 300.000 miles, granted, they might need some routine maintenance... Actually, In europe, japanese cars (along with french cars, but that is another story) are the ones known for not lasting more than 150.000 miles tops... But that is because we get a lot of small and cheap japanese cars because of the high car prices here!

jon21 - 6/21/2007 11:59:13 AM

0 Boost

Hey sailor-kid...my gas car have known to go over 9.9 Trillion Miles before I have to change the oil and filter. In the USA...german makes crappie automobiles. I cannot believe a few people still buying them every year.

Htay7500 - 6/21/2007 11:41:02 AM

+1 Boost

"Where I started? I'm not sure I follow you here... Where I went to school? In a little town in Denmark called Svendborg (www.simac.dk)... You don't just go to a ship and get a job today... No matter what your function, you have to get some kind of education before you are even allowed onboard a merchant marine ship. So I was hired by A.P. Møller - Mærsk (a danish ship owner and the worlds largest container ship operator) and went to school in Svendborg for a coulpe of years. I then embarked my first ship in Algeciras in Spain...
But I am not one of the "old school" sailors who was either a marine engineer or a navigator... I'm both, which means I get more money! :D What company did your father sail for?"
cant reply to my own comment, autospies is screwd up.

after my dad graduated from mechanical engineering in his country, he was recommended to take training for the Burmah shipping and trading company (thts what i thought it was called) so he can evalute shipping engineering to take his studies further as well as being a merchant sailor. then he visited bangkok (his first stop) ventured with other shipping companies (never told me about them though but it had the word "maersk", giving me a sense of what it was like) bringing him into s. africa, france and britain as well as the panama canal, central america and LA. when he reached the port of baltimore, he depatured there to continue his education at johns hopkins.

reply to this comment

Loki123 - 6/21/2007 2:57:46 PM

-1 Boost

Hahaha when Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW have top honours for reliability you know the stats are skewed!

Germans wouldn't know "reliability" if it bit them in the ass.

Give me a break!

reply to this comment

Porschinator - 6/21/2007 4:36:33 PM

+2 Boost

BIAS is huge. Europe prefers european cars and Japan prefers Japanese cars so no surprise there. I would question European based reliability reports, this goes for Japan. Reliability is relative. German automakers ar infamous for over engineering and the vehicle as a whole will run well but little glitches will appear. Does it make the car unreliable? Depends on the persons/owners perspective.

reply to this comment

TybeeZ4 - 6/21/2007 11:07:25 PM

+2 Boost

Interesting since Porsche is the top brand in J. D. Power and the Cayman is the top car in the US. And there is no mention of Porsche whatsoever.

reply to this comment

huu76 - 10/8/2007 10:23:59 PM

+1 Boost

What constitutes a service call? Hey, I locked my keys in the car. Hey, my battery is dead. Hey, my car doesn't have run flats.

I'm guessing BMW drivers are too embarassed to call when they have a problem (i.e. they banged a fence somewhere because "ultimate driving machines" doesn't necessarily equate to "ultimate driver").

reply to this comment

To post a comment for this story, you must first Login.

If you do not have an account, you will need to Register (It's Free!).