46 Votes

Lexus RX 400H vs BMW X3 3.0sd

BMW530i submitted on 12/5/2006 Official Bell & Ross Timestamp: 7:49:00 AM

110 user comments | Category: Reviews | Source: | SOURCE: www.germancarzone.com

Conclusion:
Hybrid against power Diesels.

The decision precipitates here clearly to favour of the new BMW X3 3.0sd. The BMW with that impressing strong twin turbo-Diesel unites sporty road performances with a justifiable consumption and exhibits besides outstanding handling characteristics. There the Bavarian SUV - up to easy losses with the travelling comfort - no further weaknesses affords, wins it with clear projection/lead. The complex hybrid system in the Lexus works perfectly and reliably. But against the Diesel of the BMW the drive of the RX 400h does not have a chance - it needs nearly three litres fuel more. Sparpotenzial shows the Japanese only with very deliberated driving fashion, but its environmental balance is positive.

Found on Germancarzone. The diesel is quicker than the hybrid and beats it in overall fuel economy too.

-BMW530i

Lexus RX 400h BMW X3 3.0sd
272hp / 286hp
0-100 km/h (s) 7.8 6.3
0-120 km/h (s) 10.6 8.6
60-100 km/h (s) 3.9 3.4
80-120 km/h (s) 4.9 4.3
Höchstgeschwindigkeit (km/h) 200 240
Handling (min.) 1:58,9 1:51,1
Slalom (km/h), Pylonenabst. 18 m 61.1 63.7
Brake distance: 39 m 37.8 m
Fuel consumption (l/100 km): 12 L 9.3 L

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About the Author

BMW530i
— BMW530i (View Profile)

User Comments

This is true!
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:31:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

Was there really any doubt who would win? German engineering....
— BimmerFan (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:16:58 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

What about pollutants? How do the 2 stack up in emissions?
— Ironman273 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:42:13 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 7

We better get Al Gore on the phone!!
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:31:40 PM | | Votes: 1

The Bluetec diesels will be just as clean as other vehicles when they come next year.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 7:45:34 PM | | Votes: 4

This is not a good comparison. Lexus is geared more for luxury than sport. The main reason why BMW created the X5 in a diesel version is because thats what people want in Europe. I guess the gas vs. diesel prices in Europe is pretty dramatic.
Honestly, I think BMW competes directly with Audi.
Of course, because they're both German who would compare them, right?
Lexus is better compared against MBz.
— SSP350 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:18:10 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 7

"Lexus is geared more for luxury than sport."

Woah, woah, woah!

All the Lexus fans have been saying is that these are supposed to be "performance hybrids"! That they don't deliver better fuel mileage, but better performance! I'm confused. What's the excuse now, Will?
— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:26:50 PM | | Votes: 6

But why are they even comparing the RX to the X3? They are not even aiming for the same market. I believe that all they are trying to do is to show "German superiority". I can understand that, it is a German article you know...
— cynic (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:18:14 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 7

in europe, they have very similar prices.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:42:54 PM | | Votes: 4

They have just about the same price here as well.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:16:37 PM | | Votes: 3

Compare the BMW X3 to the Acura RDX Baby, then we can crunch el numeros.
— blueice4589 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:24:47 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6

But will the BMW be available for sale in CA? The Mercedes Blue-Tec was exciting until I noticed you can't buy them here in CA.
— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:36:29 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

probably the most direct competitors on the market. diesel vs. hybrid is direct competition.
— 1995e34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 12:33:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

What bullshit. These Krauts took the inferior car (the BMW) and gave the victory to it because its faster. What bullcrap.

The Lexus is the true winner of this comparison. More reliable, cheaper, better equipped and it looks better to and is also more fun than the BMW.

This review is crap.
— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:44:50 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Hope I sounded like a fanboy!

Ok, seriously now, I agree with Will and Wilco. This comparison is invalid because the two cars don't compete.

Both are good at what they do, but they don't compete. Period.
— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:45:50 PM | | Votes: 3

in the spirit of the testers, now how about a comparison between a lincoln town car and a 3er? they're both in the SAME PRICE category...
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 4:53:39 AM | | Votes: -3

You guys are funny, when Lexus looses you said they don't compete. HAH. Aren't these two in the same market, ie luxury SUV 5 seats and about the same price? If they are about same price and same category then they competes. Also didn't Lexus claims that they can get good performance and uses less gas with Hybrid? This is just to show that when it comes to fuel economy and performance, Hybrid is all hype when compares to good diesel design.
— middleman (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:49:07 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

For the record, I am not a Lexus fanboy. I have an appreciation for all kinds of cars.

It's true however, the Lexus RX and BMW X3 don't compete. The true competitor is the BMW X5. I think this magazine was just testing the hybrid and diesel concepts to see which one fares better in everyday driving.

I do agree with you that hybrids are overhyped in the US. They're most efficient in the city.
— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:52:49 PM | | Votes: 8

but since the x5 got 7 seats, surely the rx now competes with the X3, like how the q7 wasn't in the x5s class before.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 5:28:43 PM | | Votes: 0

The BMW is faster by a whooping 40 km/h! I found the article online and they said that the Lexus begins to become unstable at 180 km/h. Clearly not a car for European roads.

Glad the BMW won. The Lexus RX is a joke if you ask me.
— Bill (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:56:47 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

That is why wagons are so popular over there. Once you get on the 'bahn, doing over 180km/h in a SUV is approaching crazy.

I miss driving in germany :(
— jeffy210 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 3:20:23 PM | | Votes: 3

This is absolutely mot true Bill. The RX is quiet stable on 180/h.
— AUDBMLEXMRC (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 5:54:44 PM | | Votes: 1

Willis, you're back!
— Bill (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 12:59:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

Curiosity got the better of me. I won't stay though.
— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 1:01:07 PM | | Votes: 0

cutie, would like some cheese with your whine?
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:01:02 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

it woudl obliterate any competitor. it alwasy does. thats why BMW is the best.
— AmazingBimmer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 2:22:57 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

The X3 & RX are more combarible than the X5 & RX...Don't make us bring out the big guns Lexus boy's, or the result would be even worse!
— MunichRob (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 2:52:59 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Oh, please don't scare us MunichRob.

By the way, are you an engineer or designer for BMW? You seem to take a whole lot of pride in something you had nothing to do with other than (maybe) purchase.
— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 3:26:28 PM | | Votes: -1

So basically you have a compact SUV with a twin turbo posting faster numbers than a mid-size luxury SUV? Why not just compare the Cayenne as well? You know I think the 335i might be faster than the RX400h as well. German fans are ridiculous in their comparisons. There is no other SUV in the road right now to directly compare to the RX, with it high performance, low MPG and miniscule emissions, at a reasonable price. The perfect balance. Which is not to say anything negative about the X3 twin turbo diesel. I cant, since the article requires registration, so basically I have no mor info on it. Like price, emissions, luxury content. All we know, from the numbers posted, is that it is faster than the RX400h. Big f-in deal.
— 1970toyotamarc (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 3:19:06 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

The DIESEL DESTROYS the hybrid in PERFORMANCE and FUEL ECONOMY. Both are in the same basic class, both have 5 seats, the Lexus is a bit bigger but the X3 is the closer competitor than the X5 is.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 3:24:11 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

HAH!

the X3 has a bigger boot than the X5, so it is the more practical one!
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 5:30:19 PM | | Votes: 2

The RX is above the X3 in class. This fact was made concrete when BMW put unpainted plastic bumpers on the X3 at its inception.

— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 4:26:25 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

The BMW destroys the Lexus.

hahahahahahahahahahaha!
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 5:57:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

The RX 330 is electronically limited at 215Km/h in the gulf, im sure the 400h would do better, these stats seem wrong to me. On the other hand, the RX does compare to the X5, and i can't believe they're comparing a twin turbo car to a naturally aspirated one. Germans should be ashamed of that as a naturally aspirated is that close! Artice is very irrelevant.
— ToyotaLexus (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:01:37 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

Now I will never be able to buy an RXh because it is slower accelerating. I'm so glad this was put into perspective for me, because you know, that's what eveyone looks for in an SUV, speed, which is probably why the Cayenne is a great seller. (sarcastic of course)
— lexusis350 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:06:58 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

You should teach a master class in sarcasm, you're so good at it.

Wait. I think I've got the hang of it.
— audiot (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 7:53:06 PM | | Votes: 3

what's wrong with sarcasm?

sarcasm is meant to point out STUPIDITY, with the object of sarcasm not sure whether he is being insulted or complimented.
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 5:09:47 AM | | Votes: -2

Now I will never be able to buy an RXh because it is slower accelerating. I'm so glad this was put into perspective for me, because you know, that's what eveyone looks for in an SUV, speed, which is probably why the Cayenne is a great seller. (sarcastic of course)
=======================================

Funny, I believe you were the same person who said you'd take the Lexus RX400h over the Mercedes ML320 CDI because the Lexus is faster. Sounding DEFENSIVE about the RX aren't we?
— BMW530i (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 6:44:26 AM | | Votes: 2

I really don't know where these sites get the bad stats from (top of their heads maybe)? BIAS is crazy. Jealousy and fear???
— ToyotaLexus (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:15:03 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

i've driven the X3 the latest one and liked it. It' s very pleasant car. But i found lot of cheap plastics inside and the rear seats not very confortable. The handling was very pleasant(outstanding is a big word). I would take the X3 over the RX400h. I've also driven the RX350 and it's another story! The RX 350 is also a very pleasant car to drive with quality interieur materials. If you take the X3
take it with sport interieur option with the M3 steering wheel(in europe we can order this option, don't know in US) This steering wheel is so sweet.
I've always defend BMW and liked it but i admite that this comparision doensn't realy make sense. But RX330 VS X3 V6 benzin yes makes sense.
— AUDBMLEXMRC (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:16:39 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6

Might make a bit more sense but it should be with the X5
— ToyotaLexus (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:19:18 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

I meant ARTICLE is irrelevant in my first post, sorry mistype.
— ToyotaLexus (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 6:20:33 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

It makes PERFECT sense to compare these two to examine whether a diesel is better than a hybrid. Why you ask, because the BMW X3 with the American gasoline engine weights 4,067 pounds and the Lexus RX 350 weights 4,090 pounds. This means that the two weight the same so the fuel economy/acceleration is determined mostly by the powerplant.

Milage achived during the test:

BMW diesel: 25.3 MPG

Lexus Hybrid: 19.6 MPG

So the facts are: the Lexus hybrid is 24% slower but uses 29% more fuel. I think the diesel easily wins this one.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:00:15 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3

What'd the Germans do, have the RX towing a trailer during the test? Even against a larger class vehicle, the Germans barely win, and they needed a turbo diesel to do it.
Here's how a proper test is done.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdrives/06rx400h.htm
Woah, the RX uses only .7L/100km more. Now factor in diesel (the old dirty cheap stuff) costs 25-30% more to buy in free-market N.America, and it takes 25% more oil to make diesel. Yup, great bargain and so environmentally friendly. btw, I have the link, just ask.
On top of that, the RX outweighs it by about 350lbs. Must be them batteries eh MDalle?

Oh, and in the RX you won't have to worry if the gas station has diesel or not.

I've love to see a V6 RAV4 vs RDX vs X3. Of course, the Germans would never dare to try that one.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:17:04 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

Truth was definately absent if your post. Diesel is NOT 25% more expensive or take more energy to produce, refineries in America are set up to produce the most possible amount of gasoline. This can be adjusted. Face the facts, in the real world the BMW got 25.3 MPG and the Lexus hyrbid only 19.6. Like I said the regular version of these cars are withing 23 pounds in weight so comparing the two is perfectly reasonable.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:27:55 PM | | Votes: 3

BTW, diesel is not even close to being 25-30% more expensive, but the Lexus hybrid did use 29% more fuel than the BMW diesel, or yes, the Lexus was also 24% slower. So it is slower and uses more fuel.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:29:56 PM | | Votes: 3

diesel is usually only about 13-17% more expensive. oh, but did we forget that lexus recomends premium fuel...making the difference in price even smaller...
— 1995e34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 3:55:24 PM | | Votes: 2

For some reason, people think the X3 and RX do compete. I've had to correct them a few times- the RX is actually LONGER than the current ('06) X5. The new X5 is probably marginally longer than the RX, but they're still similarly sized.

The X3 is just overpriced, which lends to comparisons like these. Spring for an X5. If you can't afford that, just get the better-looking, better-driving, lower-fuel-consuming, more comfortable, cheaper 3 Series Touring with xDrive!
— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:29:35 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6

But as I said before the weight of the gasoline only version of the two [with AWD] is within 23 pounds so the comparison in fuel economy and acceleration makes plenty of sense.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:32:04 PM | | Votes: 5

By your logic, it would be fair to compare a Honda streetbike with a golf cart.
— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 8:58:39 PM | | Votes: -1

Well, considering that both are CUVs with 5 passanger seats and just about the same horsepower, all wheel drive, and four wheels, and the same weight I think it makes sense to compare the two. You think so?
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 9:10:58 PM | | Votes: 4

Chewy,
How do you know truth is missing from my comments when you didn't even read it? 10L/100km was their real world test, EPA is 7 and 8L.

It's probably because it's Canadian right? Here's another real world link. Normal driving gives you 24mpg, 22 if you floor it.
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontainers/do/vdp/articleId=105527/pageNumber=1
Now where's your real world proof?

Diesel does require 25% more oil to make. 3rd paragraph from the bottom. Refute it if you can.
http://www.ucsusa.org/clean_vehicles/fuel_economy/the-diesel-dilemma.html
You'll probably discount it like MDalle because it doesn't agree with your precious diesels.

Gas in my area has been around $0.75-0.80/L since September. Diesel has been ranging at around $0.89-0.99/L.
Here's the US avg, about 20% more.
http://www.fuelgaugereport.com/index.asp
Toronto is generally a 5-10 cents cheaper than us.

Note: Lexus recommends premium, but regular is fine (just like my Jeep), same as the Highlander hybrid.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 9:29:00 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

That website certainly looks anti gasoline. It is just one claim, and like I said that most refineries can be turned to make more of one fuel than the other. Diesel does have 10% more energy per gallon, but it gets 30% more fuel efficiency. Again, in my area diesel is not even close to being 25% more expensive.

BTW, your 1994 Jeep is much worse for the environment than any Bluetec diesel, you polluter.

Also, we are comparing this particular test of the two vehicles that followed each other. The Lexus used up a lot more fuel (29% more) and needed 24% more time to reach 60 mph.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:08:53 PM | | Votes: 4

I meant anti diesel. Also there is no scientific evidence brought up. Just a claim.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:14:19 PM | | Votes: 4

why would you put regular in your car when it explicitly tells you to put premium in it? very trashy.
— 1995e34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 4:26:58 PM | | Votes: 2

Can't compare the Lexus RX 400H to the BMW X5 because the X5 is an SAV and the RX is simply an old school SUV.
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:06:36 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Not really, the RX just like the Toyota Highlander that it rebadges (it is true, both are the same vehicle but the Lexus does change a lot) are unibodys just like the BMW X3/X5. So yes, both are just regular wagons that are made to look like an SUV.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:10:37 PM | | Votes: 4

Actually, the RX isn't a truck-based SUV. It's a crossover, based off of the Toyota Camry.
— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:44:25 PM | | Votes: 7

Couple things,

Rebadging, if you insist on calling it that, has levels. On one end you have the old Nissan Maxima/Infiniti I30 and prior gen Yukon/Escalade. On the opposite side you see the Lexus ES and Camry or Phaeton/A8.

What the Highlander and RX do is share a platform, which is a different thing altogether.

And if you think an SAV is a different animal than an SUV then please give the marketing department at BMW a call. I'm sure they'll send some flowers and chocolates your way.
— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:45:34 PM | | Votes: -2

That's right the RX is based off the Camry.

What in the hell was I thinkin'?
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 12:47:38 AM | | Votes: 2

The RX isn't an SUV. An SUV has offroad capabilities. The RX can't go offroad if its life depended on it.
— BMW530i (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 6:42:02 AM | | Votes: 3

My uncle has one and he let me try the steering the car in the driveway and the steering feel is so direct, you get the feeling that you're driving a Lexus LS-F, the best upcoming sports car the world has ever seen.
=================================================

Your fictional uncle let you steer his fictional RX in a fictional driveway?

Buddy, lay off the fucking crack. Someone ban this clown.
— BMW530i (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 8:06:58 AM | | Votes: 2

hahahaha jake you are such an IDIOT.

toyota actively say "do not take the rx off road". you know why? the electric motor over heats, and drive the rear wheels is lost! so then your stuck in a fwd vehicle! and direct steering? yeah at low speeds, because it's ELECTRIC! there is no feel at all! turn and the wheels turn, sure, but the rx does not handle better, go off road better or drive better than the X5!
and as for your driving experience...i'm 16, and have driven (only slightly illegally) 7 cars. i can tell when steering is light, or what brake pedal feel is like, and acceleration, and to a small degree handling, but steering accuracy and feel? i have no idea. i turn the wheel, the car turns that way. while the mythical rx you drove may have had "direct" steering, that is at low speeds, where suprise suprise steering is always direct!
Just to remind you
TOYOTA SAY DON'T TAKE IT OFF-ROAD, EVER.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 3:24:01 PM | | Votes: 1

changing sheetmetal is a part of rebadging. if they have the same platform, theyre pretty much the same car.
— 1995e34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 7:59:32 PM | | Votes: 2

regarding electric power steering.

SECOND generation is a considerable improvement.

most of you young pups never experienced it, but the ORIGINAL p/s systems felt like they were connected to the front wheels with rubber bands. we've come a LONG way since.

electric steering, and ALL drive-by-wire controls, will likewise improve with time. (the most advanced aircraft today are all d-b-w)
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/7/2006 5:45:26 AM | | Votes: 0

oh electric power steering is good now, bmw use it on the z4 ( i think) and maybe on the 3 series, so that it can work with DSC+.
it doesn't have as much feel as no electric power steering though, but that doesn't have as much feeling as no asstance at all steering.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 12/7/2006 6:23:42 PM | | Votes: 2

X5 is an SAV because they didn't want anyone to know they copied Toyota's idea of a car-based SUV. It's amazing what 1 letter can do to sheep.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 10:09:15 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

Which, in itself, Lexus copied from Mercedes.
— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:44:49 PM | | Votes: 3

Although the release of ML was slightly prior to that of the RX it was not that big of a gap. The ML and RX were in development at the same time. Clearly Lexus went a different path than the Alabama-made ML as the RX was not released with cheap plastic bumpers and a underpowered V6.

I would say the only good ML was the one with the manual transmission, true low-gear range, and chopped top. Sadly it was destroyed by a couple of T-Rex's in the second Jurassic Park film.
— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/5/2006 11:53:36 PM | | Votes: -2

Let me try and spell it out.
If 1L of oil can make 1L of gasoline, it takes 1.25L of oil to make 1L of diesel. Yes it does have more energy per litre, but that energy is most efficient if you need torque to pull. Straight highway driving wastes all that extra energy. That's why gas engines of similiar displacement are starting to catch up to diesels (not equal, but damn close enough).

You get 30% more mileage, but you have to pay anywhere from 20-30% more for the fuel. Basically your extra mileage isn't free, unless you're in Europe where they foolishly subsidize the stuff for some reason. Lows ulphur w/o Bluetec only reduces emissions by 10%, w/ Bluetec, it's on par, maybe a little better than reg unleaded gas but nowhere near hybrids.

btw, my Jeep's a 2004 and yes, it is a polluter. That's the reason why my next vehicle will more than likely be a hybrid Camry (for the summer). Inexpensive (relative to the Jeep), fuel efficient, clean, and still a large vehicle, decent performance and it looks good. I'm still hoping for a hybrid IS by that time, as I prefer RWD.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 12:09:28 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

Again, the link you provided has no scientific proof. Come again. And no, diesels are still far more efficient, they always will be. They most efficient at low RPM such as highway cruising.
— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 12:50:45 AM | | Votes: 3

Anyone else here think the VW Phaeton and Lexus LS460 from the front could be brother and sister?
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 12:46:20 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

The Phaeton came out before the current Lexus LS. And now that you bring it up, yes, the LS460 front does look a little Phaeton inspired. Not the other way around you dumb shit.
— BMW530i (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 8:10:25 AM | | Votes: 0

What about emission!!I bet the RX400h had much lower emissions!!!
— 2JZSoarer (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 3:00:47 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

emissions, schmimissions! diesel exhaust ENHANCES the health of lungs. AND brains.
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 6:32:03 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

Well well well...... look wat we have got here! A lexus RX400h beaten by the mighty X3 :P. If i was a lexus fan, i ll burry myself :p.

I ll just summary ... diesels r better than hybrids! no need to argue coz u ll sound stupid.
— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 8:43:29 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

I just don't understand you americans!!!!!!!!!!!! :-)

In US --> A lot of lexus' and bmw's

In EU --> A lot of Bmw but VERY VERY little lexus.

You see in europe a lexus is almost an exotic car.

That's why I would chose a lexus over a bmw anyday! Because bmw is as common as ford with you guys! LOL

xxxx
— valentino (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 10:09:44 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

well, lexuses ARE superior in quality, reliability, and ALL other automotive virtues except maybe "magic touch" (which impresses SOME folks; NOT everyone).

AND, they ARE more distinctive and EXCLUSIVE on top of this.
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/12/2006 3:25:16 AM | | Votes: 0

Commonsense,
Hmmm, whatever happened to the German prestige argument? Out the door when entry level and sub $30,000 models arrived?

Chewy,
This link was posted on autospies earlier before. YOu may remember it as the article that showed the epitome of driving excellence is determined by trunk size.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2914359

MDalle,
There's no safety in numbers. You're wrong whether there's one or ten of you. Tell me, don't you ever get tired of being wrong?

Anyone else want to take a shot at the title?

Get ready to wet yourselves ladies.
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/04/rumors_rampant_.html
http://www.leftlanenews.com/2006/04/10/next-prius-to-offer-113-mpg/
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/66260/prius_hits_113mpg.html
Anyone else hear anymore on this? Achieving 2/3 of that would be amazing by itself. Europe will probbably still keep diesels while they hold out for the VW HTFC in 2020. Anything to avoid succumbing to an off-continent product.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/6/2006 10:08:56 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

diesel exhaust ENHANCES the health of lungs. AND brains.
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/7/2006 5:52:01 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

"...the car manufacturers aren't stupid, they know that if people knew that gasoline cars will damage your lungs as well, they would have to fit filters on those as well, so they sort of just don't mention it!"

it is not the manufacturers, but the gov't (EPA) which determines what levels of ANY pollutants are hazardous to peoples' health.

the car companies DO try as much as they can, to have gov't use LOWEST standards possible.

particulate matter is filtered out from the air cleaner up front. ANY car maker who also has a filter downstream, can make the claim they emit less PM than they take in.

another maker (volvo? honda?) also claimed their exhaust was cleaner than the air their experimental car takes in. i suppose costs are why this is not on ALL production cars.
— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 12/9/2006 3:52:45 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

As opposed to the morons who know diesel will kill them, but buy them anyway because it's European?

The hybrid won't produce PM to begin with, especially in the city (well, they'll produce muuuuuuch less becuase you get ZERO emissions on electric). Let's see a diesel do that, rather than trying to hide it in a soup can and calling it revolutionary.

So MDalle, what do you think of the 113mpg Prius? All the batteries and smaller parts and "technology will find a way" arguments I've put forth are coming to fruition. Let me guess, didn't read it for fear of the cold, hard truth of reality?
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/7/2006 9:57:07 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

well i am currently getting 9.2 l/100 km from a LR dico 3, 2.7 td i used to get 12.4 from my 1998 hilux surf (4 runner) with a 3.0 Ltr Td...so while the lexus might be cleaner than both its certainly far from being fuel friendly...
— kurtismac (View Profile)

Posted on 12/8/2006 3:03:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Why are you comparing 2 diesel cars?

We're comparing a hybrid to a diesel, and a small vs mid-size CUV.

If they really wanted to do a level comparison, they would ante'd up the X5.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 12/8/2006 8:19:08 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

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