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18 YEARS TO PRESTIGE!

LexusAdmirer submitted on 04/06/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 1:23 AM
from: www.sys-con.com

[247] user comments | category: Misc News

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Tags: Luxury, prestige, Porsche, Lexus, Mercedes, BMW.

Tag Links: Luxury, prestige, Porsche, Lexus, Mercedes, BMW.

18 YEARS TO PRESTIGE!

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david999 - 4/6/2007 7:00:57 AM

+4 Boost

This just confirms what evrybody already knows, those that actually buy luxury vehicles view Lexus as a tier 1 brand.

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dav256 - 4/6/2007 8:06:46 AM

-10 Boost

The remarkable thing is that it only took Lexus 18 years to gain prestige. Whereas, it took the Germans about 100 years.

Mercedes-Benz has always been an icon for luxury, in the 1920s, 1930s, 1960s... and today.
Lexus is a prestigious brand in North America, but not in Europe or Asia.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 10:19:58 AM

-5 Boost

lexus builds some very high quality, luxurious cars.
but economics don't lie.
there's a reason the S-class bases 42% higher than the LS: it's far more prestigious.

one survey can't negate economics.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 10:20:00 AM

-8 Boost

lexus builds some very high quality, luxurious cars.
but economics don't lie.
there's a reason the S-class bases 42% higher than the LS: it's far more prestigious.

one survey can't negate economics.

EL34 - 4/6/2007 12:15:44 PM

-5 Boost

LexusAdmirer, you keep forgetting Lexus is a glorified Toyota.

Even the LS460/600 has the clock form the Corolla.

jmrA480 - 4/6/2007 1:02:05 PM

-3 Boost

lexusadmirer- your the biggest idot on this site. So what your saying is that the germans just became popular in the last year or so? Yea thats sounds about right, what a jackass! 100 years my ass, where were for the past 70 years.

2JZSoarer - 4/7/2007 12:34:39 AM

+6 Boost

EL34 slap your self monkey boy for saying such a dumb comment!!
You say the LS and the Corolla have the same clock,the only thing in commen is that they are both digital!!
Did you ride the short bus when you were younger??

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jmrA480 - 4/7/2007 6:33:38 PM

-3 Boost

So according to your math then MB just started to gain prestige in 1971, you said it took 100 years for it to happen. Im pretty sure they were considered a prestigious company way before that.

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IZZIE06 - 4/9/2007 3:22:22 PM

0 Boost

Mercedes was not founded in 1871

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truecarlover - 4/6/2007 7:12:14 AM

+1 Boost

It is interesting they didn't include the "Ultra-Luxury" brands (Aston Martin, Bentley, etc.) Still -this is why Porsche is my favorite company. People say they are bland because they don't change - but is why I respect them even more. They only built the Cayenne because the market would buy it and it would enable them to stay independent (that is also why they are investing in VW). How could I not love the rest of their vehicles. I only wish they would produce a true successor to the 959!!!

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truecarlover - 4/7/2007 3:28:59 PM

0 Boost

Do you work for Porsche? I don't recall them ever saying the Carrera GT was a successor to the 959...? That said the Carrera GT is still wonderful - just comment sensibly next time.

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SixxFive - 4/6/2007 7:49:41 AM

+3 Boost

LexusAdmirer: your post comparing "Lexus 18 years to prestige vs. 100 for the Germans" is overly simplistic and uneducated. The world was a much different place (affluence) 100 years ago than it is today and the words Lexus and prestige can for the most part only be measured in the USA - even in Japan, the 'Lexus' name has been used for approx. two years; and market share/sales in Europe are minimal.

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rg12345 - 4/6/2007 8:49:11 AM

+2 Boost

I was gonna say that ... Lexus only exist in the stupid US market. Nowhere else is Lexus viewed as a luxury car, actually no where else people really buy lexus cars.

Sorry guys, but as they say in the article, this test was done only in US. As for me, I understand that this is how US market is, I totally disagree with it's opinion, not only based on Lexus as a winner (second/third place) but on sooo many different factors. One poped out just a few days ago when Mercedes won the best GREEN car with their first car designed to do that, when so many others where trying to produce it from more than 10 years ago with different stupid weak hybrids. Another one is how the US government can't do any smart regulations on fuel/emanations - in (probably) the country with the most cars/SUVs in the World. Or maybe because I keep seeing to stupid old people driving 20mph with huge 4-5L V8 engines behind the hood. Nowhere else in the world is so much stupidity when talking about cars. And so on ..

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 10:22:51 AM

+4 Boost

lexusadmirer:

it's not an excuse to point out the fact that lexus is not a global luxury brand.
it has done VERY well in the states.
but that's where it ends.
18 years in europe without much success. sales in japan 50% below the targets they stated...

valentino - 4/6/2007 8:43:51 AM

+2 Boost

DAV265 is right.
It's a prestigious brand in the US.
In europe it's almost never even brought up when people are discussing about Luxury Sedans.

I think that the people who buy lexus in europe were ricers 20 years ago :)

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david999 - 4/6/2007 9:27:26 AM

-3 Boost

Lexus will eventually be the icon Mercedes used to be in the 20's, 30's 60's, etc.

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theman - 4/6/2007 4:03:33 PM

-1 Boost

Used to be? Mercedes will be an icon forever, it will always be remember as the first company to INVENT THE CAR...Mercedes can serve a plat of sh*t to the world and it will still be remembered as the undisputed king of automobiles...

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 10:24:19 AM

-5 Boost

it's true...advertising is far more powerful here than in most of the rest of the world.

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Will_ - 4/6/2007 10:22:01 AM

+3 Boost

Let's take a look at the definition(s) of "prestige:"

1. The level of respect at which one is regarded by others; standing.
2. A person's high standing among others; honor or esteem.
3. Widely recognized prominence, distinction, or importance: a position of prestige in diplomatic circles.


Lexus fits all three. What's unique and remarkable about Lexus is that they've shown that it's not just about how long your company has been in existence, but it can also be how great your product is. Brands like Mercedes came to fame from super-innovative technology and cars with literally impermeable quality. In 18 years, Lexus has been able to get the latter down...

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 10:31:04 AM

-6 Boost

nice try. but it's not that simple.

the value of a brand is equal to the premium it can charge over competitive products. that's prestige in economic terms, not just the opinion or random people who may not even be able to afford the car.

so what's the premium the LS commands over the S-class? premium for the IS over the 3-series? premium for the SC over the SL? let me know.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:56:01 AM

-4 Boost

nice try. but it's not that simple.

the value of a brand is equal to the premium it can charge over competitive products. that's prestige in economic terms, not just the opinion or random people who may not even be able to afford the car.

so what's the premium the LS commands over the S-class? premium for the IS over the 3-series? premium for the SC over the SL? let me know.

Anthony - 4/7/2007 12:03:37 AM

+5 Boost

You call it a "premium" for "prestige." Many others would call it ridiculous and badge prostitution.

enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 12:52:38 PM

+1 Boost

anthony:
so why buy a lexus over its toyota sibling? is that even worse badge prostitution? you can get the same quality, reliability and mechanics for less yet you pay more.

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TheSailor - 4/6/2007 10:35:39 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

LOL... That is actully pretty funny... First, the Lexus fans say that Lexus became prestigeous in 18 years, a feat they claim no other have done. Then someone comes out with the argument that Mercedes was prestigeous in the 20's and suddenly, Lexus will become that kind of icon... Uhmm NOPE! The Mercedes became that kind of icon because it was the first car! Only one car can claim to be the first car... When Lexus comes out with the first "mass market" hovercar with an anti gravity device they will get the same kind of iconic status.

50 years ago, it was just as prestigeous ALL AROUND the world to be a Mercedes owner as it is today, today, Lexus is still only considered truly prestigeous in the US! But Lexus' salvation in Europe will be my generation, the "iPod" generation where making a fashion statement and standing out, a little, matters more than heritage and prestige. Lexus is special in the same way that an Apple iMac or MacBook is it is new and relatively unknown and a little different from the rest of the packbut it basically does the same. Hell, I'll say it: Lexus is hip in europe!

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1970toyotamarc - 4/6/2007 10:45:01 AM

+2 Boost

Month after monh, year after year, Lexus increases its presence and respect throughout the world. Lexus astonished even themselves with the amazing reaction Japan had to the new LS. and in Europe, Lexus hybrids have been embraced as an ultimate expression of luxury.

As for marketing, it's always considered a slam on Lexus....they only sell because of marketing. that is b.s. No one beats BMW when it comes to marketing, the way it turned a poser yuppie mobile (3) into the ultimate driving machine. Do you remeber what the 3 was like for its fisrt 10-15 years? Slow, cramped, cheap interior, over-priced. (Some of those attributes might still be accurate, but I digresss....) Because of marketing, the 3, now, is coveted by performance guys (even tho it has often been slower than the competition), secretary types (even tho they they have to all be leased due to being outrageously expensive), gays (even tho BMW has no marketing or interest in the gay community), and virtually everyone else who wants to take that first step into luxury ownership (even tho there are many decent options). Quite simply, if you buy the 3 you get the instant acceptance of you peers that 25 years of relentless marketing affords. No one, not even the superb folks at Lexus can touch this. That's marketing. So I'm tired of hearing that Lexus's success is only due to marketing.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:58:17 AM

-5 Boost

um...no.

lexus outspends bmw and mercedes on marketing in the US by nearly 4 to 1.

1970toyotamarc - 4/6/2007 12:54:27 PM

+1 Boost

no one said anything about money, it's about effectiveness. but nice try.

TheSailor - 4/6/2007 4:52:21 PMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Now there is something we can agree on! Where did you make up that bull 1970?

Because as far as I have heard, it is seen as an utter waste of money in Europe! People either buy a big diesel because they are cheaper to buy and cheaper to run, the brands that sell them are more prestigeous (uhh... The dreaded word) and everybody knows them! And if you aren't satisfied with the power, you just "chip" it! A Mercedes is seen as the ultimate expression of luxury! An Audi is considered as the sensible choice and the BMW people who care about handling!

But if you have something to support the opposite, that a Lexus (any Lexus) is seen as the ultimate expression of luxury anywhere in europe I'd like to see it! As I've stated, Lexus is "hip" among young people, but unfortunately, young people aren't the ones with the most money, so Lexus is seriously, and i mean SERIOUSLY, lagging! Expecially their hybrids (they are GD expensive)!

1970toyotamarc - 4/6/2007 10:09:02 PM

-1 Boost

Autospies doesnt do the best job of reporting Euro sales, but every time they do, Lexus shows an increase, and a large percentage of those are hybrids. Just because you dont like them does not mean that others dont as well. Europeans are embracing hybrids, slowly, but it is happening. And they are also enbracing Lexus, much to your chagrin.

TheSailor - 4/7/2007 6:05:58 AMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

Excuse me? When did I say I didn't like Lexus? I like the IS very much... I was considering buying one! Actually, I have said numerous times that I like all their cars except their SUVs and the SC... But I also like to be right and I usually am. Especially in this case!
Because unlike you, I speak german, english and spanish fluently I understand all and speak some Swedish and Norwegian and I am Danish... Meaning that I can read most of the European auto statistics... And none of them support your little thesis!

http://www.autobild.de/aktuell/meldungen/artikel.php?artikel_id=13018&artikel_seite=3

scroll to #215... The Lexus GS... In ALL of germany (that is something around 80 million out of EUs 400 million citizen) they sold 971 Lexus GS and unlike what you would like to make us think, there is no statistic showing how many of these were hybrids! What it does show is that the sales didn't improve but actually decline (by 11%) compared to the year before! The same goes for the LS... It only sold 105 in all of last year (against 122 the year before 13,9% decrease)! In comparison Audi sold 65k A6's and BMW 50k 5-series and Mercedes 57k of the aging E-class, Audi sold 5.558 A8s, Mercedes sold 10.985 S-classes and BMW sold 5.837 7-series! So as you can see, it isn't looking too good for Lexus in Europe... The only car that is doing well is the IS which sold 2183 (a 217,3% increase) and the RX which sold approx. 1800 units (with decreased taxes because of van status)...

Now where were those statistics showing hybrids as the ultimate expression of luxury?

TheSailor - 4/7/2007 6:08:49 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

BTW: In comparison, the class leading 3-series sold 115k cars in 2006... So even the IS still has a long way to go... But it looks like it is getting there... Eventually

enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 12:57:05 PM

+3 Boost

it's not marketing but product that's made BMW successful. oh and i'm happy to know per your explanation that BMW is for secretaries and gays. do you have a problem with either of those two groups of people? and what the hell does all that blather have to do with this discussion?

Will_ - 4/6/2007 10:58:43 AM

-1 Boost

Where have all of you been? Lexus is no longer the "cut price Merc" as Rupert was trying to enforce to me earlier. Lexus's best-selling models are entry-level luxury sedans and SUVs...that goes for all luxury brands! 3-Series, C-Class, etc are all among the best-selling vehicles for their respective brands. Now we will hear the redundant and totally lame excuse that the ES and RX are no more than rebadged Camrys. You know that it is not just that simple, there is a higher level of engineering, luxury, technology, design even safety among the ES than there is the Camry. They simply share a suspension, does that mean the car is not worthy of respect?

"the value of a brand is equal to the premium it can charge over competitive products. that's prestige in economic terms, not just the opinion or random people who may not even be able to afford the car."

Let's stop with this. Mercedes is able to gouge their customers out of thousands of extra dollars because their customers do not mind it. Their customers feel that they get more "prestige" for their dollar; quite simply, the badge allows the thousand-dollar mark-ups. I guess what's truly upsetting to the majority of you is that Lexus is so highly-regarded here without even having to incorporate "prestige pricing." Have you ever thought of the backlash Mercedes would have if they lowered the fixed prices of their vehicles in North America? Remember, there's a reason North America will never get the A- and B-Classes, Mercedes is worried about its North American image just as much, if not more than Lexus.

I have no problem with this, but don't go around waving your finger because the competition is able to offer a damn near similar product for less money. Is this really true? If a Ford Focus costs $1,500 more than an comparably-equipped Mercedes A-Class in Europe does that mean that the Focus has more "prestige?"



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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:52:26 AM

-3 Boost

you can rant all you want. doesn't change the economics of branding.

prestige is about the willingness of consumers to pay a premium over a competitive product.

lexus is luxury and good value. they wouldn't survive at the prices of their german competitors.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:55:17 AM

-3 Boost

and for the record, toyota is not a charity.
they're a powerful business with profit as their top motivation.
they wouldn't leave money on the table if they could "gouge" it out of their customers. they're customers just won't pay up for value luxury.

TheSailor - 4/6/2007 12:10:59 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Ohh come on Will... I know lots of the Lexus fans are brain washed, but you don't seem like one of those! Yet you claim that the ES only shares suspension with the Camry?! They share all the major mechanical components! only the body panels and the interior is different... They are just like the VW Golf and the Audi A3. They might look different and one might be more prestigeous than the other, but underneath, they are just the same! That isn't a bad thing, and since only we "enthusiasts" know it, it doesn't matter that much, but it doesn't change the fact that the ES is very much a Camry...

TheSailor - 4/6/2007 4:43:02 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

No mr. "F1 specialist"... Look up the PQ35 platform. Don't come here... I hate to be wrong, and I hate people who try to correct me just because what I say don't suit them! If you had been right though I would admit it!

The A3 is just as much a Golf as the ES is a camry... The ES might look more like the Camry than the A3 looks like the Golf, but they share the same platform constructed by VW! The platform is used in a wide variety of VAG cars ranging from the Skoda Octavia over the Seat Altea to the second gen. Audi TT! As with the ES, it is not a bad thing most of the cars on the PQ35 are very well handling! I own one on that exact platform myself (Seat Leon Cupra)...

So actually, if anything, the A3 must be more of a parts sharer than the ES since i can come up with at least 8 cars straight off the top of my head that share that very platform!

Would you like another wack at me? Go ahead, but make sure you are right this time! This is the second time in a very short time span where I have made a mockery of you by exposing your utter hate towards anything that does well or has anything to do with the USA (last time you called everybody stupid because you were sure some JC list was made up, but the americans was obviously too stupid to see it was a hoax, or you was too stupid to see it wasn't)... Even if it is a Japanese car made for the US.
Don't let it happen a third time, because then I'll have to give you a wedgy!

TheSailor - 4/6/2007 4:58:36 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

BTW: I just took a real good look at the ES and the Camry to make sure, and I can't find a single angle where you can see that the ES is "just a very nice camry". I can see a passing resemblance in some of the lines, but i don't think that a single body panel in the two cars are the same, not even in the interior could I find similar instrument panels! Unless you park them side by side, they don't look that alike! If the ES looks like a camry, the Jetta looks like a Corolla sedan, the LS looks like a 5-series, the 3-series sedan looks like a Nissan from the back, the A4, the A6 and the A8 looks totally alike (just like the RS and S series cars). I can mention more if I want, but I think I've made my point pretty clear!

david999 - 4/6/2007 11:32:25 AM

+1 Boost

Unfortunately, in Canada we are able to purchase the B class and be subjected to its low quality. BMW will be doing the same with the 1 series. As time goes on, the prestige factor of these marques will be reduced while Lexus's moves ahead.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 5:54:15 PM

-5 Boost

and why will lexus move ahead? do you have some insight into their product strategy?

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 12:01:20 PM

-4 Boost

completely agree.

lexus are very good cars for the money. but not a premier brand.

economics are the end all be all. go ahead and get outraged guys. fight ecomomic principles.

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david999 - 4/6/2007 11:55:27 AM

-4 Boost

According to this survey, the people that actually purchase luxury automobiles already consider Lexus and Mercedes on par. As far as discounts are concerned, Mercedes is heavily discounting many of their models, B class, C class, R class.
I guess the prestige factor and great styling is not enough.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 12:04:38 PM

-3 Boost

everyone discounts in the car business.

especially at the end of a mode's life....like the current C class that's being replaced in a few months, like the ES330 before the ES350 came out last year, etc.

regarding the R-class. well, it's just ugly and expensive so they have to discount.

by the way, lexus is currently discounting the IS and the GS450h because those cars aren't moving.

david999 - 4/6/2007 12:17:22 PM

-1 Boost

That's not true. The GS450h is on a waiting list, and the IS model is no way near leasing rates that the C class or BMW 3 series are. Have some self respect, please.

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S4cabriofoxone - 4/6/2007 12:24:45 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

The GS450h has been selling below expectations.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 5:57:16 PM

-3 Boost

the GS450h is selling far below expectation. according to a current article on hybrids here on autospies they sold 181 of them last month. way off goals. and there definitely isn't a waiting list...they have several months of supply on the lots. call any lexus dealer and ask for one.

there is, however, a list of buyers for the LS600h that comes out in june.

enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:21:56 PM

-3 Boost

regarding leasing rates david....

they are running deals on the IS. despite that, full list bmw leases are often a better deal. that because leases are based on something called residual value (i.e. how much the car is worth at the end of the lease). since bmws retain their value better than lexus, the portion of the car that a lessee has "used" is smaller. so surprise: better lease prices! hope this was helpful for you.

Anthony - 4/7/2007 12:01:23 AM

+2 Boost

But I thought Lexus wasn't as prestigious as BMW, therefore their cars are cheaper!

Lexus also has above average resale value. The difference is, luxury consumers aren't scared to finance a Lexus like they are a BMW due to quality issues.

enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 12:27:47 PM

0 Boost

lexus are cheaper to buy genius.
but leasing isn't buying duh.
and bmws are still more expensive to buy when they're 3 years old.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 12:59:15 PM

0 Boost

the GS450h is selling far below expectation. according to a current article on hybrids here on autospies they sold 181 of them last month. way off goals. and there definitely isn't a waiting list...they have several months of supply on the lots. call any lexus dealer and ask for one.

there is, however, a list of buyers for the LS600h that comes out in june.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 1:00:18 PM

0 Boost

enough with the lies david. please back up your claims with data.

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EL34 - 4/6/2007 12:18:17 PM

-3 Boost

Yesterday I saw a brand new Bentley Continental Flying Spur and believe me the LS460 can't touch the quality it has.

el34
Irvine, Ca

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S4cabriofoxone - 4/6/2007 12:26:04 PMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Considering it's three times the price...

answer - 4/6/2007 6:58:40 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

It sure is some talent you have to be able to examine the quality of a car from across the street.

S4cabriofoxone - 4/6/2007 12:24:09 PMView My AgentSpace

-3 Boost

What is the point of this article?

Especially when so many of the Lexus fans discount prestige as "superficial?" Suddenly, now othat they're "tied" with Mercedes, it's amazing?

BTW, I agree with them. "Prestige" is nothing. I don't buy a vehicle based upon what others think of it.

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david999 - 4/6/2007 12:34:24 PM

-2 Boost

sure you don't.

S4cabriofoxone - 4/6/2007 11:10:56 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

I live in America. According to the BMW fans on this website, Audi is not as "prestigious" as BMW, Merc or Lexus in America. Do I care? Why would I? I love my car, and bought it for that reason. If Lexus made a car I loved, I'd buy it.

I'm currently in a convertible phase, and Lexus just doesn't make a convertible I like... SC430 is a joke. I'm sure it will be much-improved for the (overdue) next generation, though.

weaponX - 4/6/2007 2:16:25 PM

-1 Boost

I think that’s the hidden meaning behind this article.

I wouldn’t go as far as say Lexus has reached Benz or BMW prestige.

And people are kidding themselves if they spend 70-100K on a car, and claim prestige is not a factor.


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BigShow50 - 4/6/2007 1:12:51 PM

-3 Boost

It's amazing with the kind of bashing I read when it comes to any luxury euro brand vs. Lexus or any other Japanese brand for that matter. We read it all with the level of prestige one supposedly lacks vs one with that much more definition. But one thing I respect is all your responses, b/c you guys show support with the brand you believe in. This is what keeps this industry running strong. Otherwise it will be a very boring auto world. But no matter what you look at Lexus to be(good or bad, or call it a glorified Toyota). You gotta give them credit that they are only Japanese company to challenge the Luxury segment with continuous improvement and success.(soon to follow Infinity and possibly Hyundai?!?! in the near future) It will take some time to get to that "level of prestige acceptance". True they may be the level of "affordable luxury" but why start higher than that? Even when you still have to earn the stars and stripes of luxury pricing? So they will get there...it's just time working their way up. Remember they are going up against companies that have been in the luxury game for decades or a 100 years(and that's amongst all euro brands with heritage, so yes you have to respect that). But it does not mean that the Japanese can't do the same. Just like all of us, we want to be successful with wealth and happiness. And we have to earn the stars and stripes to get there. The simple truth of the matter...Japanese luxury(Lexus/Infinity) is growing more and more, there is no sign of them going down, no matter which way it's compared and all of you I'm sure is well aware of that. You can either accept or deny, at the end of the day it's very simple facts...

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BigShow50 - 4/6/2007 1:21:38 PM

0 Boost

In response to mromar1, that's like saying Mercedes did a good job rebadging the Chrysler Crossfire into a MB SLK, or a Chrysler Pacifica into a MB R500. That only took me 3 seconds to figure that out...

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 6:00:05 PM

+1 Boost

incorrect. they didn't rebadge a crossfire into an SLK. when the new SLK came out, they used the OLD SLK platform for the crossfire. get your facts right.

TheSailor - 4/7/2007 5:47:48 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

The same goes for the R500... They aren't even related! The R-class shares it's platform with the ML... You aren't too fast if you figured out that the Pacifica is the same car... Since it isn't! Chrysler use several old (keyword: OLD) mercedes platforms for their new cars! The 300C is built on a 10-year old E-class platform!

lizthevw - 4/6/2007 1:32:13 PM

+1 Boost

Prestige is stupid. Lexus builds good quality cars that suit North American tastes.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 11:18:29 PM

-2 Boost

nobody is arguing that lexus doesn't build top quality cars.
they're just boring.

Anthony - 4/6/2007 11:36:38 PM

+2 Boost

That's not the argument at all "enthusiast." That's your ignorance shining through.

enthusiastx11 - 4/7/2007 12:31:04 PM

0 Boost

so i'm ignorant because i value different things than you. and have different opinions.

that's your closed-mindedness showing through. were you brought up in a fascist country?

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07mcs - 4/6/2007 1:47:40 PM

-3 Boost

Prestige is MB, BMW, Rolls Royce, Porsche, Ferrari, Bentley, Lamborghini, Maserati, Aston Martin, Jaguar.

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Threepoint1415926 - 4/6/2007 2:19:05 PM

+2 Boost

I've never heard of these people before. So, quoted directly from their site:

"The Luxury Brand Status Index is another proprietary survey methodology and index developed by The Luxury Institute that guides our company-based subscribers."

Proprietary means we cant see how the survey was done. "Guides our company-based subscribers" leads me to believe this survey tends to invent better findings for those company based subscribers who "subscribe more" if you know what I mean.

Maybe this is a credible survey but I tend to be suspicious of what looks, walks and quacks like a marketing firm.

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markusck - 4/7/2007 11:06:48 AM

0 Boost

This is the most astute observation on this thread!

..more info is needed as to who this group is, and who is subscribing...

chewy - 4/6/2007 2:19:53 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Rating brands on badge status and not car quality is like awarding the super bowl to a team without playing the game.

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enthusiastx11 - 4/6/2007 6:08:59 PM

0 Boost

status isn't built on air. it's built on reputation, design, innovation and--to a lesser degree--general reliability (less so today because all cars are pretty damn reliable).

in fact, status/prestige/reputation is what makes brands powerful. and enables them to command premium pricing. for example, armani can charge far more for a suit than banana republic even though banana republic is good quality. likewise, rolex can charge far more for a watch than seiko despite seiko's great quality. same thing goes for mercedes vs. lexus.

speedmaster - 4/6/2007 3:27:49 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Want to know what is more prestigous than a Lexus in Japan.
The Toyota Century. Even with cloth seats, it smokes the LS460. Dignitaries, CEOs of large Japanese industries only want to be seen in a century.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Century

Too bad the rabid fan boys can't have it here. They don't want any Gaijin to spoil there goods.
Products like the Century and other high end stuff (Seiko Credor) won't be sold to lower class americans.


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TheSailor - 4/6/2007 4:45:08 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Yearh... It is sort of like a Japanese Maybach 62... It might be a good car, but it looks silly, so lets hate it!

no1listensanyway - 4/6/2007 5:02:39 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

That car looks like a Volvo gone wrong. They wouldnt sell in the US because people would mistake it for a used car.

speedmaster - 4/6/2007 5:31:00 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

I brought it up because the japanese do value provenance, pedigree, heritage.

The century may be butt ugly but it is a status symbol vehicle mainly due to the V12 and the hand made craftsmanship.


The retail is $92K


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no1listensanyway - 4/6/2007 4:53:12 PMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

I think Lexus sales in the US speak for itself. It took Lexus 18 years to acheive what it took Germany decades.

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Agent63 - 4/6/2007 5:57:38 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost