18 YEARS TO PRESTIGE!

This just confirms what evrybody already knows, those that actually buy luxury vehicles view Lexus as a tier 1 brand.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:00:57 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

EL34 slap your self monkey boy for saying such a dumb comment!!
You say the LS and the Corolla have the same clock,the only thing in commen is that they are both digital!!
Did you ride the short bus when you were younger??

— 2JZSoarer (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:34:39 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

So according to your math then MB just started to gain prestige in 1971, you said it took 100 years for it to happen. Im pretty sure they were considered a prestigious company way before that.

— jmrA480 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 6:33:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

Mercedes was not founded in 1871

— IZZIE06 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/9/2007 3:22:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

It is interesting they didn't include the "Ultra-Luxury" brands (Aston Martin, Bentley, etc.) Still -this is why Porsche is my favorite company. People say they are bland because they don't change - but is why I respect them even more. They only built the Cayenne because the market would buy it and it would enable them to stay independent (that is also why they are investing in VW). How could I not love the rest of their vehicles. I only wish they would produce a true successor to the 959!!!

— truecarlover (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:12:14 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Do you work for Porsche? I don't recall them ever saying the Carrera GT was a successor to the 959...? That said the Carrera GT is still wonderful - just comment sensibly next time.

— truecarlover (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 3:28:59 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

LexusAdmirer: your post comparing "Lexus 18 years to prestige vs. 100 for the Germans" is overly simplistic and uneducated. The world was a much different place (affluence) 100 years ago than it is today and the words Lexus and prestige can for the most part only be measured in the USA - even in Japan, the 'Lexus' name has been used for approx. two years; and market share/sales in Europe are minimal.

— SixxFive (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:49:41 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

DAV265 is right.
It's a prestigious brand in the US.
In europe it's almost never even brought up when people are discussing about Luxury Sedans.

I think that the people who buy lexus in europe were ricers 20 years ago :)

— valentino (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 8:43:51 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Lexus will eventually be the icon Mercedes used to be in the 20's, 30's 60's, etc.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 9:27:26 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

it's true...advertising is far more powerful here than in most of the rest of the world.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:24:19 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5   

Let's take a look at the definition(s) of "prestige:"

1. The level of respect at which one is regarded by others; standing.
2. A person's high standing among others; honor or esteem.
3. Widely recognized prominence, distinction, or importance: a position of prestige in diplomatic circles.


Lexus fits all three. What's unique and remarkable about Lexus is that they've shown that it's not just about how long your company has been in existence, but it can also be how great your product is. Brands like Mercedes came to fame from super-innovative technology and cars with literally impermeable quality. In 18 years, Lexus has been able to get the latter down...

— Will_ (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:22:01 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

anthony:
so why buy a lexus over its toyota sibling? is that even worse badge prostitution? you can get the same quality, reliability and mechanics for less yet you pay more.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:52:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Month after monh, year after year, Lexus increases its presence and respect throughout the world. Lexus astonished even themselves with the amazing reaction Japan had to the new LS. and in Europe, Lexus hybrids have been embraced as an ultimate expression of luxury.

As for marketing, it's always considered a slam on Lexus....they only sell because of marketing. that is b.s. No one beats BMW when it comes to marketing, the way it turned a poser yuppie mobile (3) into the ultimate driving machine. Do you remeber what the 3 was like for its fisrt 10-15 years? Slow, cramped, cheap interior, over-priced. (Some of those attributes might still be accurate, but I digresss....) Because of marketing, the 3, now, is coveted by performance guys (even tho it has often been slower than the competition), secretary types (even tho they they have to all be leased due to being outrageously expensive), gays (even tho BMW has no marketing or interest in the gay community), and virtually everyone else who wants to take that first step into luxury ownership (even tho there are many decent options). Quite simply, if you buy the 3 you get the instant acceptance of you peers that 25 years of relentless marketing affords. No one, not even the superb folks at Lexus can touch this. That's marketing. So I'm tired of hearing that Lexus's success is only due to marketing.

— 1970toyotamarc (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:45:01 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Where have all of you been? Lexus is no longer the "cut price Merc" as Rupert was trying to enforce to me earlier. Lexus's best-selling models are entry-level luxury sedans and SUVs...that goes for all luxury brands! 3-Series, C-Class, etc are all among the best-selling vehicles for their respective brands. Now we will hear the redundant and totally lame excuse that the ES and RX are no more than rebadged Camrys. You know that it is not just that simple, there is a higher level of engineering, luxury, technology, design even safety among the ES than there is the Camry. They simply share a suspension, does that mean the car is not worthy of respect?

"the value of a brand is equal to the premium it can charge over competitive products. that's prestige in economic terms, not just the opinion or random people who may not even be able to afford the car."

Let's stop with this. Mercedes is able to gouge their customers out of thousands of extra dollars because their customers do not mind it. Their customers feel that they get more "prestige" for their dollar; quite simply, the badge allows the thousand-dollar mark-ups. I guess what's truly upsetting to the majority of you is that Lexus is so highly-regarded here without even having to incorporate "prestige pricing." Have you ever thought of the backlash Mercedes would have if they lowered the fixed prices of their vehicles in North America? Remember, there's a reason North America will never get the A- and B-Classes, Mercedes is worried about its North American image just as much, if not more than Lexus.

I have no problem with this, but don't go around waving your finger because the competition is able to offer a damn near similar product for less money. Is this really true? If a Ford Focus costs $1,500 more than an comparably-equipped Mercedes A-Class in Europe does that mean that the Focus has more "prestige?"

— Will_ (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:58:43 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Unfortunately, in Canada we are able to purchase the B class and be subjected to its low quality. BMW will be doing the same with the 1 series. As time goes on, the prestige factor of these marques will be reduced while Lexus's moves ahead.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 11:32:25 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

completely agree.

lexus are very good cars for the money. but not a premier brand.

economics are the end all be all. go ahead and get outraged guys. fight ecomomic principles.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 12:01:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

According to this survey, the people that actually purchase luxury automobiles already consider Lexus and Mercedes on par. As far as discounts are concerned, Mercedes is heavily discounting many of their models, B class, C class, R class.
I guess the prestige factor and great styling is not enough.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 11:55:27 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

That's not true. The GS450h is on a waiting list, and the IS model is no way near leasing rates that the C class or BMW 3 series are. Have some self respect, please.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 12:17:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

lexus are cheaper to buy genius.
but leasing isn't buying duh.
and bmws are still more expensive to buy when they're 3 years old.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:27:47 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

the GS450h is selling far below expectation. according to a current article on hybrids here on autospies they sold 181 of them last month. way off goals. and there definitely isn't a waiting list...they have several months of supply on the lots. call any lexus dealer and ask for one.

there is, however, a list of buyers for the LS600h that comes out in june.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:59:15 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

enough with the lies david. please back up your claims with data.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:00:18 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Yesterday I saw a brand new Bentley Continental Flying Spur and believe me the LS460 can't touch the quality it has.

el34
Irvine, Ca

— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 12:18:17 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

What is the point of this article?

Especially when so many of the Lexus fans discount prestige as "superficial?" Suddenly, now othat they're "tied" with Mercedes, it's amazing?

BTW, I agree with them. "Prestige" is nothing. I don't buy a vehicle based upon what others think of it.

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 12:24:09 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

I think that’s the hidden meaning behind this article.

I wouldn’t go as far as say Lexus has reached Benz or BMW prestige.

And people are kidding themselves if they spend 70-100K on a car, and claim prestige is not a factor.

— weaponX (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 2:16:25 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

It's amazing with the kind of bashing I read when it comes to any luxury euro brand vs. Lexus or any other Japanese brand for that matter. We read it all with the level of prestige one supposedly lacks vs one with that much more definition. But one thing I respect is all your responses, b/c you guys show support with the brand you believe in. This is what keeps this industry running strong. Otherwise it will be a very boring auto world. But no matter what you look at Lexus to be(good or bad, or call it a glorified Toyota). You gotta give them credit that they are only Japanese company to challenge the Luxury segment with continuous improvement and success.(soon to follow Infinity and possibly Hyundai?!?! in the near future) It will take some time to get to that "level of prestige acceptance". True they may be the level of "affordable luxury" but why start higher than that? Even when you still have to earn the stars and stripes of luxury pricing? So they will get there...it's just time working their way up. Remember they are going up against companies that have been in the luxury game for decades or a 100 years(and that's amongst all euro brands with heritage, so yes you have to respect that). But it does not mean that the Japanese can't do the same. Just like all of us, we want to be successful with wealth and happiness. And we have to earn the stars and stripes to get there. The simple truth of the matter...Japanese luxury(Lexus/Infinity) is growing more and more, there is no sign of them going down, no matter which way it's compared and all of you I'm sure is well aware of that. You can either accept or deny, at the end of the day it's very simple facts...

— BigShow50 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 1:12:51 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

In response to mromar1, that's like saying Mercedes did a good job rebadging the Chrysler Crossfire into a MB SLK, or a Chrysler Pacifica into a MB R500. That only took me 3 seconds to figure that out...

— BigShow50 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 1:21:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Prestige is stupid. Lexus builds good quality cars that suit North American tastes.

— lizthevw (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 1:32:13 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

so i'm ignorant because i value different things than you. and have different opinions.

that's your closed-mindedness showing through. were you brought up in a fascist country?

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:31:04 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

Prestige is MB, BMW, Rolls Royce, Porsche, Ferrari, Bentley, Lamborghini, Maserati, Aston Martin, Jaguar.

— 07mcs (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 1:47:40 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

I've never heard of these people before. So, quoted directly from their site:

"The Luxury Brand Status Index is another proprietary survey methodology and index developed by The Luxury Institute that guides our company-based subscribers."

Proprietary means we cant see how the survey was done. "Guides our company-based subscribers" leads me to believe this survey tends to invent better findings for those company based subscribers who "subscribe more" if you know what I mean.

Maybe this is a credible survey but I tend to be suspicious of what looks, walks and quacks like a marketing firm.

— Threepoint1415926 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 2:19:05 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Rating brands on badge status and not car quality is like awarding the super bowl to a team without playing the game.

— chewy (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 2:19:53 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Want to know what is more prestigous than a Lexus in Japan.
The Toyota Century. Even with cloth seats, it smokes the LS460. Dignitaries, CEOs of large Japanese industries only want to be seen in a century.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Century

Too bad the rabid fan boys can't have it here. They don't want any Gaijin to spoil there goods.
Products like the Century and other high end stuff (Seiko Credor) won't be sold to lower class americans.

— speedmaster (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 3:27:49 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

I brought it up because the japanese do value provenance, pedigree, heritage.

The century may be butt ugly but it is a status symbol vehicle mainly due to the V12 and the hand made craftsmanship.


The retail is $92K

— speedmaster (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 5:31:00 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

I think Lexus sales in the US speak for itself. It took Lexus 18 years to acheive what it took Germany decades.

— no1listensanyway (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 4:53:12 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

and all the lexus fans interpret success in the US to mean that lexus rules the world.

a little ethnocentric there. the most powerful brands are global.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:33:58 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

prestige isn't what you make it.

i'll say it again...it's the ability to charge a premium over competitors.
opinions are nice, but economics are irrefutable.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 6:54:40 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

The value of prestige:

Being able to smile arrogantly and tell people you have a Mercedes when your car is really an old-ass diesel E from 1982.

Bragging about your Z4's German heritage when it was made in the good ole' U.S.A. just like every Ford Taurus.

Impressing chicks at a bar by placing your Mercedes car key on the bar. They don't know it's that p.o.s. C230 hatchback they laughed at on the way in.

If who you are is based upon the false perception others have of you, then the whole concept of prestige is pretty important. It does make you quite pathetic however.

— answer (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 6:53:57 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

reliability does affect reputation. but marginally better or worse reliability (i.e. minor problems) doesn't have a dramatic effect at the high end of the automotive market. how do you explain the success of all the italian brands? the british brands?

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:38:40 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

status isn't built on air. it's built on reputation, design, innovation and--to a lesser degree--general reliability (less so today because all cars are pretty damn reliable).

in fact, status/prestige/reputation is what makes brands powerful. and enables them to command premium pricing. for example, armani can charge far more for a suit than banana republic even though banana republic is good quality. likewise, rolex can charge far more for a watch than seiko despite seiko's great quality. same thing goes for mercedes vs. lexus.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:40:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

A Porsche is a Porsche is a Porsche. They should drop the Cayenne. What's the point of having the Touareg, Q7 and Cayenne all vying for the same customer pretty much?

enthusiast,
When you make that much money, a few thousand doesn't matter. The point is that those who can afford both are choosing Lexus more often now.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:06:24 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

Nobody is saying Mercedes hasn't produced good cars in the past, just that the prestige factor is not exclusive to them. According to this survey they rank in the top 3, however, 20 years ago they would have been #1. The people that buy luxury cars in North America see Lexus at or near the top, and sales enforce this view.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:09:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

enthusiast,
I couldn't help but notice some inaccuracies about why you like MB, namely your priorties.

Design
MB = Mitsubishi fenders, RX headlights, Concorde silhouette. The Maybach trunk is the only thing original on it.
LS = L-finesse, looks like nothing else on the road.

Innovation = although a uselss feature, the S can't even park itself and doesn't have a fully redundant powertrain which the LS600h does/will.

Performance
According to Edmunds, the LS460 is a smidge faster than the S550 and both have equal braking ability, plus the LS does it with 1 less litre of displacement and better mileage as a bonus.

Reliabilty
You must be joking.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:14:40 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

agreed. reliable cars but design is totally derivative. it's easy to mistake an LS for an ES or an ES for a camry....

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 8:38:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

huu76! You are a lunatic!

I can't believe you would argue with what someone thinks about a car!

And L-Finesse? NOTHING ELSE ON THE ROAD?!

I'm not even going to begin!

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 11:18:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

there are no innaccuracies in my opinions. they're MY OPINIONS. you have your priorities and, as i have so clearly stated, i have mine.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:50:41 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Well you know what?? the 2007 merc S-class JUST looks like the poor and ugly 2006 asian version Nissan Sentra, Wahahahaha!!!!! go look for it and prove it to yourself...

— breh760li (View Profile)

Posted on 4/18/2007 5:46:31 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Where as Mercedes brought about one of the first gasoline powered internal combustion automobiles and was and still is regarded as a luxury brand does not say anywhere that it took 100 years for it to earn its prestige, being the pioneer Karl Benz was for the automobile earned the company prestige from the get go.

Good for Lexus to tie Benz, but don't bring your B.S. about Merc taking 100 years for prestige, the car company will always have my respect...well except for the A,B, and the C hatch class..

— VinnyP (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 7:42:50 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Sing all the lullabies you want, "prestige pricing" doesn't make any brand "better." You don't consider it "marketing" when you charge more for your products so people believe it is better than the competition? In the luxury car segments, this type of reverse economical thinking is very powerful. This same type of thinking was realized by Lexus recently. When you want to be taken literally in the luxury car segment, you charge more. This is exactly what Hyundai is doing with their new luxury car.

— Will_ (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 8:21:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

innovative design (you never mistake an S-class for a $35,000 C-class like you do an LS for an ES), great ride/handling balance, powerful engines, etc.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:32:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

lol

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 11:23:42 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

anthony:

you're right. who couldn't see the MASSIVE differential between the 191 inch ES and the 198 inch long LS? especially since their front ends look nearly identical, the body shape is the same, they both have that lexus hallmark hofmeister kink in the rear side windows and nearly all of them are sold in silver.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:47:56 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

All of you people are kidding yourselves if you don't believe that people cross-shop Audi, Mercedes, and Lexus. I did, and will continue to as long as the product is good. It's definitely nice to have a car from a brand with 80+ years of experience, but that is not the only thing I look for in a quality luxury car. Anyone who blindly buys a car due to its "prestige" without considering other important aspects I consider a fool.

— AudiLexus (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 8:54:12 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 10   

you people are ridiculous. buying a MB because its more prestigious is the most stupid reason to buy a car. a brand's prestige is a highly subjective metric based on what rich people have a taste for. obviously not everyone is rich, but they aspire to join that elite club (why i dont know, but the europeans make a big deal about it). people want to give off an image of themselves and having a three pointed badge helps them front. ask any person of worth why they bought the AMG or S600. im willing to put money down that its not because of the badge. thats what cars like the C230 are for. its for the badge whores who cant afford the AMG but want to be linked to the guy who can.

people are shallow as most of you probably are. go ahead, buy that S class with a V6! buy an audi with that 4 cylinder, front wheel drive! yah prestige wooo! i roll like the guys with bentleys and V12 mercs.

— gsh23 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:09:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

bunch of fascists in here.
i can't even say i like something without getting deboosted.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:24:02 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

i don't favor mercedes for prestige. i favor them for the all the things (mentioned above and below) that they do so well....

love them.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:25:13 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

many bmw/mercedes/audi fans in here have no problem admitting what lexus does well....reliability, quality, comfy interiors. we even congratulate the LS throughout the post regarding its win of world car of the year.

why can't lexus fans do the same? isn't it just POSSIBLE that another brand could do something better than lexus? such childish behavior....

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:36:26 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

on a separate note, i just drove a friend's new CL550 today. stunning car. the interior (in cognac) made the LS interior look pedestrian. and the technology/features in the car....phenomenal. distronic, 4 different massages for the driver, amazing logic 7 sound system, active seats (including drive dynamic), beautiful ambient lighting, stunning stiched leather dash and door panels, night vision, and on and on and on....the car made you feel like you were on top of the world.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 10:40:31 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

I agree. It's a totally difference ambiance. Japanese Luxury and European Luxury is totally different. Each have their strong points respectively.

— Agent63 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 2:22:54 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

yes, just different interpretations of style.

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:11:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

enthusiast,
You're a riot. The S and C don't look alike. Whatever.

gsh23,
Image is important in Europe because they can't dream about home ownership like we do in N.America. They can't afford a $600,000 home so they pay $100,000 for a $50,000 car instead. The same home in N.America is 1/2 the price so we can aspire to own both home and auto (or three).

Internal combustion engine 100 years ago. So what has MB done lately that wasn't already invented for another purpose?

MB does prestige (still #1 of the Germans) but intelligent ppl require more than that. Rich ppl might now, but rich ppl have their bases covered with one of everything.

I like American cars too btw, you just can't see that because you're hell bent on assuming I only like Japanese. The difference is Japan is #1 right now, the US knows they screwed up but they're working on getting back the title. The Germans think if they just deny their not #1, it becomes true.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/6/2007 11:19:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

huu35 somehow links how much he likes a car to European home ownership.

He truly is a genius.

— Matthew1 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:28:04 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

"benz reaches far higher than lexus. there are more than a dozen models that START over $100,000. lexus doesn't have one."

Actually, it's been discussed for months now that the Lexus LS hybrid was to break the $100K barrier. And...voila...

U.S. base pricing for the LS 600h L was just announced: $104,000.

RSES, Exec. pkg. extra...

The LF-A is supposedly to be priced around $125K.

So, like it or not, Lexus is moving upmarket. And the LS hybrids already are virtually sold out for 2006-2007, 1,850 preorders.

— Dan8288 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:18:56 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

A8 better than the LS,7,S put togher.

— AudiKing (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:36:58 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6   

A8 better than the LS,7,S put togther.

— AudiKing (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:37:23 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -7   

Why? Because Lexus marketing is very aggressive, they have reinvented the idea of product placement, product association, and promotion..they just do it better than ANYONE. Lexus has essentially bypassed the heritage issue by buying their way to the table. Its very clever and the rest of the auto industry needs to learn from this incredible success.

— markusck (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 11:23:43 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

To add to other points about marketing, engines, etc...

Acuras are boring. They have no direct sell-point, except the price. That doesn't excite me.

Want performance? Go buy a BMW, Audi or Infiniti instead.

Want luxury? There's Lexus, Audi and Mercedes-Benz waiting for you.

Reliability's your top priority? Hmm. Lexus is pretty good there, too.

"Prestige?" All of the above.

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:31:30 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

Lexus makes really good cars.In Europe Lexus is not considared prestigeous because it is not very long on the scene.Another problem for Lexus in Europe is that German cars(lexuss main competitors) are considared to be the best cars.But eventually lexus will gain prestige in Europe even though it will take at least few decades.

— AUTO_UNION (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 5:40:51 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

Whats 'Lexus'?

— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 11:15:59 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Agent63,
The SC sells nearly as well as the 6, granted there's a $10,000 diff but shouldn't matter to the wealthy.

Those who want to deny that Europeans cars are overpriced and Lexus is passing them on all fronts can call me whatever they want. Doesn't change the cold hard facts, nor the painful truth.

Hey, why shouldn't the German car companies cash in on European need to show off what little they have. Paying an extra $50K on a car is easier than a few hunder thousand on a shack of a home. We in N.America are much more sensible.

But as they say, land, last time anyone checked, God wasn't making anymore.

momar,
As usual, you think there's safety in numbers. Well, everyone take a number, I'll get around to you all.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 11:23:17 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -7   

Nah, let me explain what lexus is....

Lexus is a german car wannabe, made by the japanese for the american market. Its just a rebadged toyota with some extra features and leather. You can also say its an M-B POS. If you cant afford a german car, and you only want a car that can move..... Lexus is your choice.

— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 11:48:58 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Silly fool. Lexus isn't a "german car wannabe." Lexuses are much more reliable than those POSs.

— Will_ (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:02:00 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

"Marginally better?"

lol

— Will_ (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:26:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

Consumer Reports says Audi is the closest German brand to Lexus.

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:41:50 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

yes, marginally better reliability.

many german cars make almighty consumer reports short list of recommended cars:

audi A3, A4, A6 and S4
BMW 3, 5, 6 and Z4

— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/9/2007 9:42:25 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Hahaha, Will and M3KILLER, easy guys!

I still didnt lose my mind to make such a silly statement, but I just wanted to try the FANBOY talk.... I was only joking, and you 2 took it seriously. At last, Will shows his true face.... ;)

P.S reliability doesnt make a car better than the other....

— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 12:14:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Yes isnt it sooo easy! Difference is at least I was making sense :D ..... the truth hurts sometimes ;)

— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 10:11:27 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Where did you get this information?

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:43:59 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

formula,
Sort of like how all those LS's were supposed to sit and rust? Seems to me they're flying off the lot.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:13:45 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3   

M53,
Toyota or not, it's still proving too much to handle for the Germans.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 1:15:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6   

As long as Lexus,Infiniti,and Acura continue to raid the parts bin (and design cues)from their parent companies to the degree they do, they will not have the prestige or cache of MB,BMW,Audi etc. That is not saying they don't make good products, its just stating they are all derivitives of lower cost products and that reduces their prestige in comparison.Sorry Fanboys, but you guys are very defensive....

— ICON (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 2:05:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

Well, although Lexus will be a staple in the luxury car industry by then, you must undestand that the German companies do not sit still. They are perhaps the most ravenously competitive in the car industry (between the "big three" Germans), always one-upping each other and bringing more advanced engine and suspension technologies to the table. They will always be gaining prestige in the industry, if this remains true. Their foothold will only increase.

— S4cabriofoxone (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:47:02 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

Enthusiust, Where did I ever say "Lexus rules the world"? If you knew anything about consumer behavior it is all about thier perception of a brand. BMW's and Mercedes are overpriced and don't have the same value as a Lexus would. Thats the appeal. For example, my dad immigrated from Italy to NY, he would only drive European cars. After going through a handful of them in the matter of years he bought a Celica. He drove the Celica for 400,000 miles before the car finally died of rust. It was that ownership experience that provoked him to stick with Japanese cars until this day. And guess what he owns? A Lexus LX470. Toyota is deeprouted in the babyboomer generation. These were the cars that have been getting them and thier families, from A to B with no problems, for a whole generation. Lexus was created so these people could have the same qualites of Toyota with a luxury name on the hood. Toyota saw the oppurtunity to create a luxury brand and it did. It took the Germans quite some time to achieve that perception in the US market. Ill agree that the Lexus doesn't nearly have the same history as the German brands but ultimatley, luxury is what people percieve it to be.

— no1listensanyway (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 2:46:02 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

http://www.autospies.com/news/Lexus-Announces-Pricing-for-2008-Lexus-LS-600h-L-Luxury-Hybrid-Sedan-14024/

http://www.autospies.com/news/Which-Lexus-is-so-popular-that-there-is-a-one-year-backorder-13277/

— Dan8288 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/7/2007 3:02:43 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5   

LOL

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 2:56:30 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

Generally well said. Lexus is a great marque, but they're only perceived as on par in North America. Everywhere else, a Lexus does not stand for anything and hence cannot be considered prestigeous.

I know I will get deboosted for this but hey, it's the truth.

— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 7:28:48 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

He lives in Belgium, I think.

— Willis (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:40:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

well does mercedes started as a global brand? sure it didnt like others, second, mercedes is the first and original, well then BMW, Audi are wannabe's?? 4 sure owners of the 2 brands or the brand themselves wont agree in the first place, Lexus is recognized in Asia as a premium luxury brand FYI, and take note that the ultimate LS 460 has NO toyota equivalent no matter how you research, so how come its a rebadge toyota? And look at the Escalade, its a rebadge chevy SUV right but does it matter?? Its just so hard to accept that a japanese brand could kick the asses of these german sedans, and its a fast pace world now so i wont be surprised if Lexus dominates the world a decade or so from now,

— breh760li (View Profile)

Posted on 4/18/2007 5:23:40 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

"LexusAdmirer" I hate to break it to ya, but Lexus's prestige level is nowhere near that of BMW's or Mercedes.

Take a trip around the world and see how prestigious Lexus really is, in fact if you'd taken that trip 3 years ago, you'd have discovered that Lexus existed as Toyota in Asian parts of this world.

Aside from all that though, you don’t even consider how much times have changed! You think 100 years ago BMW had an Automobile giant like Toyota to give birth to it & wipe it’s ass? No because there wasn’t any major established automotive companies at that time. It wasn’t about who had the first automatic parking system, it was about who could actually build the first reliable but affordable automobile!

I could go on but hopefully you get the point that the two companies histories are incomparable, as is the soul of these car companies for which Lexus’s doesn’t even have one.

— MunichRob (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 5:38:35 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

Sailor,
Nice excuse. I thought German egos said if it had a star, propellor or rings bolted to it, it was luxurious. Even an A-class, 1-class or A1 (sounds like steak sauce) gave drivers snob appeal.

For the rest of the world, Toyota was seen as on par with the 3 stooges from Germany, that tells you something. America ran into the 80s, so Lexus had to be created initially to meet US materialism (which originated from Europe of course as they still prove to be more materialistic today). Now Lexus has a mind of its own.

Hasn't Audi been around just as long as BMW, the 4 rings representing the original 4 companies.

Someone start playing a violin.

Look at you go, with all those big numbers. Atleast I give proof.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:21:05 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

Probably what bothers fans the most is that they've finally come to the realization that BMW/MB/Audi for the most part sell emblems, nothing more, and they were had.

Lexus sells real cars, and subconsciously they know what happened in the US will happen in Europe.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 1:23:08 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

Within 10 years, they'll hold significant marketshare (2% right in BMW/MB/Audi's own backyard). Right now % increase is high because of lower volume, but it'll even itself out.
Toyota already has the ball rolling and the sales will translate over to Lexus in time.
http://www.businessweek.com/globalbiz/content/jan2007/gb20070119_132541.htm

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 6:48:12 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Some of you guys are complete morons. You sit around talking about how stupid Americans are and then you comment on how Lexus offers a lot of car for an affordable price. I think what you just said is that Lexus offers a product comparable to Mercedes, Audi, and BMW for less money. In your mind that makes Americans stupid? I don't get it...we get the same car for less money and you are calling us stupid? Wow, some of you need to reevaluate because it seems to me that getting a great car, with great technology, and fantastic reliability at a great price is pretty darn intelligent.

— LJ745 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 7:35:23 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

Giving up so soon sailor?

The rest of the world, if you need a top quality SUV, you go Landcruiser, sedan, you go MB.

When there was only Toyota, Toyota high end models outsold BMW and MB in Japan.
http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/01/06/bloomberg/sxtoyota.php

What Toyota expects this year.
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2007/03/06/039252.html
What's happening this year. A tax hike in Germany moved sales forward, so don't be surprised if there's a decline or slow growth in the following months.
http://press.arrivenet.com/autos/article.php/914167.html

The new LS (3100 units) outold the 7-series more than 2 to 1.
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2007/04/03/042398.html
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2007/04/03/042379.html
You may not, but other Europeans will notice and start to wonder.

If I was like the French gov't, I'd give up after seeing your link, but well...
It might look bleek, but Lexus looked the same in 1990 in North America. You have to start somewhere and w/ the LS, Lexus is finally putting in a serious effort in Europe.

At the very least, with 10% annual growth (being extremely conservative), Lexus will hold enough market share by 2015 (taking away 200,000 units from them is a big enough hit) to make the big 3 take note.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/8/2007 10:42:40 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

This is a survey for God's sake. Not only that a survey for wealthy consumers who can spend their money on whatever they want. They are a totally different demographic than most of us here are. I partially agree with Fabian555's comments as Porsche is not a luxury brand but the word has multiple meanings. Where Porsche may not make a direct hit with providing an abundance or great ease and comfort with lavish options the brand delivers indulgence of pleasure and satisfaction in ownership, whether it be driven or sitting lazily in the garage. There is a difference between "My Porsche is a luxury car" to "I had the luxury of driving my 911 through a handful of B-roads this morning."

— richardp996 (View Profile)

Posted on 4/9/2007 3:56:23 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

"LexusAdmirer" you didn't even hear half of what what I said. That's ok though...I mean I must just be another rabid fanboy right? Like you havn't heared that one once or twice.

— MunichRob (View Profile)

Posted on 4/9/2007 4:11:00 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

haha Lexus just keeps its awards and merits coming and th list will just go on.. these just prove what Lexus haters deny all these time! Unbiased judgement from LBSI survey, well i guess the survey says it all no more B.S. blahblah...hahaha Lexus no.1!

— breh760li (View Profile)

Posted on 4/13/2007 3:23:36 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1