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Blackmail?: Venezuela President Threatens To Halt Oil Sales To US
President Hugo Chavez on Sunday threatened to cut off oil sales to the United States in an "economic war" if Exxon Mobil Corp. wins court judgments to seize billions of dollars in Venezuelan assets.

Exxon Mobil has gone after the assets of state oil company Petroleos de Venezuela SA in U.S., British and Dutch courts as it challenges the nationalization of a multibillion dollar oil project by Chavez's government.

A British court has issued an injunction "freezing" as much as $12 billion in assets.

"If you end up freezing (Venezuelan assets) and it harms us, we're going to harm you," Chavez said during his weekly radio and television program, "Hello, President." "Do you know how? We aren't going to send oil to the United States. Take note, Mr. Bush, Mr. Danger."

 

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Blackmail?: Venezuela President Threatens To Halt Oil Sales To US



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enthusiastx11enthusiastx11 - 2/11/2008 12:20:22 PM
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this man is the worst thing to happen to latin america in a generation. he's destroying venezuela. and once oil prices come down (they always do), the country will be left in tatters.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 12:58:33 PMView My AgentSpace
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Nahh... His the worst thing which could happen to Latin America seen from an US americans POW!

Actually, I think that Venezuela and indeed most of the Latin world is quite happy with Chavez. Especially because he has basically been one of the first with the balls to say "we don't need the US, they need us". And you really do! You could ofcause try to half your consumption making you self sustaining, but then again, that's probably gonna take quite a few years, so your best bet is just to get down on your knees and beg Hugo for forgiveness...

Now, FLAME ON

Ohh, and BTW: WELCOME ECONOMIC RECESSION!




w209w114w209w114 - 2/11/2008 1:11:29 PMView My AgentSpace
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Sailor,

Your hatred and envy towards America just became transparent in your reply. I wish you would have been born in Cuba and lived there your whole life under a totalitarian oppresive regime like the one Venezuala is becoming. Perhaps you would have a better understanding as to what those individuals stand for. It is because of people like you that the world is so messed up.

And btw... Already the British Pound Sterling and the Euro have dropped as last week the President of the European Central Bank announced that a US recession will stunt European growth. Looks like Europe needs the US too :-)

For someone who claims to be so "educated" you sure make the most ignorant claims.


enthusiastx11enthusiastx11 - 2/11/2008 1:52:00 PM
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really sailor?

have you been to venezuela? i have.
do you have close friends who are venezuelan? i do.

so nationalizing industries and placing economic AND political control in one man is good for the people? have you heard of stalin? castro? peron? suharto? didn't work out so well for them, and it is NOT working out for venezuela.


enthusiastx11enthusiastx11 - 2/11/2008 1:53:38 PM
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by the way sailor...

since when can europe function without oil? it can't. thank the US for securing the middle east oil flow since the british empire left the region a mess in 1945.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 2:04:09 PMView My AgentSpace
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What? Where do I say that I hate the US?

I don't like the fact that you seem to think that everybody are so dependant on you, yes... And I don't like the fact that you seem to think that you just consume as much energy as you want without caring about anybody (the US consume twice the energy pr capita that we do in the europe)... Fortunately, that seems to be changing now.

As to Chavez, I'm just saying that he isn't as bad for Venezuela as people in the US would like the world to think.
Public health care, free education, free vaccinations, housing projects are just some of the things he has done for Venezuela... So he might be socialist and doesn't exactly like the US, but what he is doing does seem to work for Venezuela.

As to the fact that the US is more dependant on Venezuela than the other way around, that is, well, just that, a fact... Your export to Venezuela is only 1/4 of your import FROM Venezuela...


cdokecdoke - 2/11/2008 2:10:36 PMView My AgentSpace
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You don't even have to go that far back. Europeans should be pleased with the weak U.S. dollar, and not for investment potential, I mean when it comes to oil.

Why?

Oil is priced in U.S. dollars.

So, the result of a relatively weak dollar is decreased oil price volatility in continental Europe and the U.K.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 2:10:36 PMView My AgentSpace
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Yes... I have been to Venezuela... Several times...

As to the oil, you secured what? Iraq... Iraq isn't exactly exporting all that oil... Most middle eastern oil comes from Saudi Arabia, Iran, the UAE and Kuwait... And we also have quite a few pipelines to Russia (the second largest oil producer in the world).


w209w114w209w114 - 2/11/2008 2:10:43 PMView My AgentSpace
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You heard it people. The Sailor is a self declared communist. Venezuela awaits you Sailor. What is it? you would't move there? LOL guess that makes you another cynical hypocrite who idealizes what he would never commit to.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 2:20:05 PMView My AgentSpace
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xdrive...

inflation...

http://www.latin-focus.com/latinfocus/countries/venezuela/vencpi.htm

Anyway, I wasn't saying that what is happening in Venezuela is all good, but they are actually seeming to be getting back on their feet... Or at least that is the way it looks from europe... But maybe our media is just scewing things in a different direction than what the american media is doing!


EnnNorakEnnNorak - 2/11/2008 2:40:00 PM
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Sailor and Chavez are both losing their marbles. They should have themselves voluntarily committed at the nearest psychiatric hospital.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 2:54:37 PMView My AgentSpace
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The thing is, the article you posted is the one using selective facts... The Inflation in Venezuela was more than 100% pro anno before Chavez came to power, now it is at 22%... Still a high inflation, no doubt about that, but that is still a hell of alot better than 100%


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 3:12:06 PMView My AgentSpace
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I'm just trying to say he might not be as big a "bully" as people in the US have been told.

You see this all the time, and to be honest, it really pisses me off! it is the same thing as with the middle east.

No he isn't doing a perfect job, no I don't think it is right to just take possession of foreign companies properties and sure things could be doing better in Venezuela, but what you have to remember where they came from!


1995e341995e34 - 2/11/2008 6:11:58 PM
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sailor is right, no matter how much it hurts.


1995e341995e34 - 2/11/2008 6:15:09 PM
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chavez has been very generous to americans. we all should be thankful.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 3:31:52 PMView My AgentSpace
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soze... Honestly, could you please stop telling me what I think... I'm quite aware of that! But ofcause, if I am and your wrong, that would mean that there might some truth to what I'm saying... Once again, I didn't say I hate America or that Americans are stupid... Could you point me to where I've EVER said that? Because I'm quite sure that I haven't said that ever as I don't think that...

I was saying that you are more dependant on Venezuela and indeed Chavez than you like! I didn't say that I condole what he did in stealing those international companies assets, but looking at hard facts, Chavez have done good things for Venezuela... If you really think that saying that Chavez isn't ALL bad, is ignorant, well, I'm affraid I'm not the most ignorant one of us...


IamEvilHomerIamEvilHomer - 2/13/2008 11:56:45 PM
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sailer Hitler turned around Germany


cdokecdoke - 2/11/2008 12:45:11 PMView My AgentSpace
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Oh yes, piss off and threaten to cut off the country that pays you for 60% of your oil exports, what and excellent idea!

Capitalism is a two way street- don't screw the market; it will reciprocate in the end. That is why OPEC does not like high prices- it errodes their market share.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 1:00:41 PMView My AgentSpace
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You think they'll have any problems selling their oil to other countries? Hardly...

Everybody need oil, not just the US. This is not going to be a problem for Venezuela as much as it will be a problem for the US...


w209w114w209w114 - 2/11/2008 1:14:42 PMView My AgentSpace
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Chavez is all talk. He's an attention whore whos just trying to get publicity but making far out statements. From an economic point of view, this isnt a very good deal for him.

The US could retaliate with a trade embargo towards Venezuela. Then they would be begging for mercy just as Cuba has.


cdokecdoke - 2/11/2008 1:18:41 PMView My AgentSpace
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Of course he won't- that isn't my point. The point is that within the U.S. the immediate effect is rising prices. These unleash a set of countervailing forces designed to reduce the use of that product.

Chavez will also face pressure from OPEC not to do such a thing.

In addition, oil is probably the most global commodity (one coudl argue that coffee is). We may not get oil directly from Venezuela but that does not mean we won't be getting Venezuelan oil. If there is, indeed, this price bubble in the U.S. if you are a company why would you sell oil domestically, when you may (or may not) be able to get a higher real price for it in the U.S? That all depends on transaction costs and currencies.


EL34EL34 - 2/11/2008 1:27:46 PM
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TheSailor, there's one problem and that is those countries already have all the oil they need and Hugo Chavez will be stuck with all that oil and no money in Venezuela's pocket.


cdokecdoke - 2/11/2008 1:29:40 PMView My AgentSpace
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...hm ...I'm going to have to think about that paragraph. This could be a part of a multi-plant monopolist facing facing a partial monopsonist. This isn't just as simple as him sending the oil somewhere else.


Bmw8terBmw8ter - 2/11/2008 12:59:48 PM
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If they cut off the oil, we'll cut off the hygiene products. Hygiene products are one of the hardest things to come by over there; people would riot within a day or 2.

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EL34EL34 - 2/11/2008 1:19:58 PM
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What this Socialist pig fails to understand is if we don't buy from Venezuela's Citgo then we'l will buy the oil from someone else, and then the Venezuelan economy will suffer greatly ;-)

BTW, Venezuela has been a good friend of the USA for many decades until this mole came along!

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EL34EL34 - 2/11/2008 1:25:30 PM
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There are reports out of Venezuela that under this wannabe dictator Hugo Chavez people are having trouble buying bread, milk and toilet paper.


Sounds like the old rusty Soviet Union to me!

But hey, Communsim/Socialim has only killed 150 million people, so why don't they give it the old college try one more time? ;-)

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WhelanWhelan - 2/11/2008 1:38:59 PM
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Somebody call up the CIA and get a sniper down there stat. He's like Kim Jong Il with a tan. He takes over all the oil producing areas of his country, kicks out business like Shell and others. Then practically enslaves their workers by keeping them in country and paying them nil. But yet he offers free oil to US families in need, so we can be happy for him. Please.

Another person who needs to stop using up oxygen on this plant.

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RupertRupert - 2/11/2008 2:44:38 PMView My AgentSpace
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Asia???
Venezuela is a country in South America.
You're not so good on geography huh?

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Bmw8terBmw8ter - 2/11/2008 3:42:23 PM
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You have buried a huge nail into the coffin of the "American Image", with that statement.

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Htay7500Htay7500 - 2/11/2008 4:18:56 PM
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"I hate it when these little countries in Asia think they are so though."


please tell me thats a joke.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 2:08:12 AMView My AgentSpace
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HEY! Once again, I would like to emphasize that NOWHERE have I said that americans are stupid (even though this josh-character makes for a pretty convincing argument)... You were the one who brought that on because you didn't like what I was saying and is trying to convince yourself that I just want to call americans stupid and that there is absolutely no grain of truth in what I'm saying... What ever...

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S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 2/12/2008 9:48:20 PMView My AgentSpace
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I'm hoping Josh is a fake persona...

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rockerrocker - 2/11/2008 2:11:52 PM
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He wants his country to be like his best friend's country. That friend would be Fidel Castro and the country would be Cuba. Both men are idiots no matter how you slice it. They will both in the end ruin beautiful and great countries.

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w209w114w209w114 - 2/11/2008 2:38:36 PMView My AgentSpace
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Well said rocker. In 1950, two years before Batista's second access to power, the Cuban peso had the same value as the U.S. dollar. This alone should give venezuelans something to think about as far as the direction their country is going.




1995e341995e34 - 2/11/2008 6:19:27 PM
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castro has done quite well in cuba considering the strongest nation in the world has him in their cross hairs.


EL34EL34 - 2/11/2008 7:48:51 PM
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1995e34, you said Fiddle Castro has done quite well as dictator of Cubert!

No kidding!

lol


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 3:24:16 PMView My AgentSpace
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Ohh boy e34... You might not be in the cross hairs of the worlds strongest nation, but you have just put you in the cross hairs of the entire community here... Welcome!


1995e341995e34 - 2/12/2008 3:38:33 PM
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somebody has to challenge the mobthink.


SteveLSteveL - 2/11/2008 2:59:00 PM
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I hope he does quit selling oil to the US. We should not be buying oil from that freak in the first place and no we do not need it. We can get by just fine. As far as the person named TheSailer. To you I say nothing but this. It would be wastes of my time to try to change you’re mind because you only see things from you're point of view and it will never change.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 3:19:50 PMView My AgentSpace
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You know "SteveL" maybe it isn't my point of view which is wrong...

Sure they are not doing a perfect job, but they are doing alot better now than before Chavez, so I think that maybe, people in the US should try to study some foreign news sources as well... Our national news sources are very limited, so I get news from Denmark, all major european countries and the US and the funny thing is that the news from each different country are very different and the funniest thing is that whatever you read from the US, there is always something wrong with it if it doesn't share their exact view on things. Then you read the same story from a different country, and suddenly, the story is quite different, I'm not saying that the US version is wrong or any less correct than the other versions, they are just different...


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/11/2008 4:35:39 PMView My AgentSpace
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LOL... You think what you want...

I said that I didn't condole of what he did when they seized all those assets already, but that was not was I was refering to in the first place... I was refering to the fact that you guys took a cheap blow at a country which is on the way up, in no small part due to this "common thief"...


Someone then went on to make this a personal matter saying that this is all down to the fact that I hate america WHICH I don't! This has nothing to do with me or my personal thoughts towards america, but with the smugness of some of these comments...


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PorschinatorPorschinator - 2/11/2008 6:13:50 PM
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Well I can commend Sailor for trying to win a winless argument. More on Chavez:

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSN1023172220080211

Chavez is positioning himself to be just another Dictator with a President name tag.
"Chavez frequently issues conditional threats against the private sector without following through on them. But last year, he nationalized swaths of the economy, including the oil and utility sectors, in a drive to build a socialist state."

"Venezuela Threatens `Economic War' Over Exxon Freeze

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez threatened to halt oil shipments to the U.S. and wage ``economic war'' in retaliation for Exxon Mobil Corp.'s bid to freeze state oil company assets held overseas.

Chavez is a tool.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601101&sid=aUuvp.aEJwM4&refer=japan

``Listen to me, Mr. Bush, Mr. Danger,'' Chavez said yesterday during his weekly television show. `If the economic war continues against Venezuela, the price of oil will reach $200. Venezuela will take up the economic war and more than one country is inclined to join us.''

Exxon last week said it won court orders blocking Petroleos de Venezuela SA from selling assets as part of a legal battle over the seizure of operations. Chavez held U.S. President George W. Bush partly responsible for the freeze and worsening relations between the two countries.

Exxon's move may cut into Chavez's popularity by forcing him to cut back spending. Venezuela counts on oil income for 90 percent of its foreign exchange and half of federal tax revenue. PDVSA, as the company is commonly called, also provides social services outside the budget, such as the company's sale this month of 252 tons of powdered milk."


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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 3:46:34 PMView My AgentSpace
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Porschinator

Do you read spanish? Because there are several spanish (as well as portuguese articles from brazil) articles where the views on Chavez is quite different to the ones in these US-stories! Even european newspapers have quite a different take on Venezuela than the US... Maybe both the european and the south american newspapers are the ones with all the wrong views...

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PorschinatorPorschinator - 2/14/2008 10:36:34 AM
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True. Any view can be biased and I am no expert on the issue. I do not thinnk any of us are. But my experience is that most countries bash the US for the sheer fact that it IS the US and no other reason.

The World has a "what have you done for me lately" mentality. One time the US gave Aid to Venezuela but stopped since the country had good resources and became the richest Latin American country due to its OPEC status. But due to corrupt and/or poor leadership Venezuela continues to not allow its people to prosper. Screw Chavez!!!

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PorschinatorPorschinator - 2/11/2008 4:38:06 PM
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Venezuela owes Exxon big time so they have a right to seize assets. If you owe and do not pay then there is a debt. Debt not paid then seizures occur, typically through court. That is BUSINESS! Basically the Pres in Venezuela is trying to screw over US companies.



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rockerrocker - 2/11/2008 4:54:47 PM
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Greed and Corruption. That is what all of this is about. Or at least let's hope so. Let's hope he is not another idiot dictator like Hitler and such that think they can take over the world and reform it into their vision. I believe in the end they will work out a deal not to kill him or remove him from office and let him earn millions on the talk show and lecture circuit.

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without_exuberancewithout_exuberance - 2/12/2008 11:57:39 PM
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how come it was not greed and corruption, when the corrupt and greedy Venezuelans before Chavez were robbing the country blind. Now that Chavez has decided to help the people instead of funneling billions into a swiss bank account. now he is greedy and corrupt.

the american view of itself and the world is very devilish and demonic. your due will come in time.


rockerrocker - 2/13/2008 5:32:41 PM
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That's funny. In my view as an American, most of the world views the US as the devil until something goes wrong in their own country and then they want our money and help. I do not condone any govt benefitting off the poor in their country. Chavez and Castro still function even under the thumb of the US but it is at the expense of their own countrymen and women. Don't preach ethics when talking about a tyrant.


chuck717chuck717 - 2/11/2008 5:10:35 PM
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Matter of fact one reason America is always chastised by our partners is because we lend a helping hand to the people of dictator nations who steal the money which the folks never see.
The USA is far from perfect in a very unperfect world, but i can assure the good citizens of Venezuela if you were attack and your country was in peril the USA would be there in a NY minute with human efforts and the military if need be to help restore order, Chavez and this guy Sailor would on a fast boat to China???

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EL34EL34 - 2/11/2008 7:53:32 PM
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Anyone here Chavez the other day when he admitted he's a coke head?

Hugo is a big fat bloat and one of these days the good people of Venezuela will blast him out of office!

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krackerhatesmekrackerhatesme - 2/11/2008 8:09:12 PM
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If Chavez hates America so much why doesn't he just take his oil and sell it somewhere else. If his people love him so much why did they vote against his resolution to make him a dictator for life. He suffered "a stunning defeat in a referendum that would have let him run for re-election indefinitely and impose a socialist system" in Venezuela.
At the very least, they would grant Chavez direct control over the central bank, allow his government to detain citizens without charge during a state of emergency, and empower the president to redraw the country's political map and handpick provincial and municipal leaders"

"Other proposed changes - such as shortening the workday from eight hours to six, creating a social security fund for millions of informal labourers and promoting communal councils where residents decide how to spend government funds" - yet the people did not want this because they know how much of a crazy #$%$% he is.

Its the foriegn oil companies that built the infrastructure for the Venezuelan oil industry not Chavez. How would Chavez feel if Mobil took over all his Citgo stations?
Chavez I think you smoked too much of Castro's cigar!
Other than Iran who in OPEC would care to join Chavez?


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huu76huu76 - 2/11/2008 9:06:38 PM
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I don't have a link but I do recall reading before that only 5% of Venezuela's oil is fuel grade, the rest is only good for industrial use such as plastics etc. So really, no big whoop.

It's pretty evident President 'No-domestic-policy' has never been to Canada, or else he wouldn't be making retarded threats. We have more oil than Venezuela has dirt.

It's too bad Liberals (specfically Europe) has made anti-Americanism a failsafe strategy to get attention off the fact you have no clue whatsoever of how to run your country.

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M1k3M1k3 - 2/11/2008 9:34:02 PM
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Does anyone know how much Venezuelan oil makes up our oil market? I wonder if it would really affect our economy which is already pretty bad, anymore and we could be in the second great depression.

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cdokecdoke - 2/11/2008 10:12:10 PMView My AgentSpace
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10.3% of imports and 7.5% of total crude volume.


no1listensanywayno1listensanyway - 2/12/2008 12:45:38 AMView My AgentSpace
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Hugo Chavez is a little attention whore. He tries so hard to make himslelf signifigant on the world stage, but nobody cares. He called the most powerful man in the world a Devil, he has made arms deals with Iran and had befriended one of the most hated men of the Western World (Castro). He is digging a grave so deep, he might come out of the other side of the world. Hardworking middle class citizens of Venezuala have had enough of his antics, the poor Venzualans are not seeing any progress and long established business ventures with internatinal companies are being sevored. Chavez has destroyed a country that truly had potential to become a major economic/political player in the Southern Hemispere.


Sailor - Your comments suprise me. You must understand the consequences of a recession in the US has huge consenquences for the rest of the world. With a globalized market we are all invested in each other. As much as Europeans fantasize about the fall of the US empire, that will not happen any time soon. If it does, Europe ceartainly would not have anything to do with it. Europe is a has been, if it werent for England and Germany, there would be no economic growth in Europe.



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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 2:16:12 AMView My AgentSpace
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Ofcause it would have an impact on europe... People are just so damned affraid of this "economic recession" that it is getting funny! We've had economic recessions before without it actually having an impact on society...

As to Germany and the UK driving europe... Whatever man! 9% of ALL cargo in the whole wide world is carried out by a danish ship owner, World's second largest air plane manufacturer is french, The biggest oil exporter in europe is Norway... Sure Germany has a huge impact, Britain... I'm not so sure!


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 1:28:36 PMView My AgentSpace
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Why? because I'm not buying the US BS?!

I think you need to lay of that agent orange stuff...

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ChicagoTedChicagoTed - 2/12/2008 1:13:36 PM
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Venezuala Oil is referred to as "sour crude". It is high in sulfer and very few places other than USA can process the oil. We have the refineries, he has the oil. If he embargos us he will be swimming in unusable crude.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 3:49:49 PMView My AgentSpace
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Yay... Sour crude... That is just like so close to the stuff ships burn... And ship owners have often showed just how little they care about where fuel comes from as long as it is cheap... And ships use quite a lot of oil... So once again, as long as the UN doesn't initiate a world wide embargo on Venezuela, he will have absolutely no problem getting rid of his oil. He might have to sell it a little cheaper, but it won't be hard to sell!


kablaamkablaam - 2/12/2008 7:07:11 PM
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If Venezuela can sell all of it's crude products to non-americans, why don't they? Does it have to do with the fact that we consume upwards of 1/4 of the worlds oil? Or maybe it's because they sell 60% of their overall oil production to the United States. A 60% decline in sales is a very difficult thing to stomach. Before you go and say, "someone will buy it", the fact is, since he hates us so much, why the 4 year delay? Maybe next year?

Fact is, no one is forcing Venezuela to sell us their Oil, it's by choice.

Why is it that imports for American products in Venezuela INCREASED by almost 35% in 2006?

There is an old adage that will play true in this case, "don't bite the hand that feeds you".

P.S.: Survey's in 98 estimate between 10-20 Billion barrels of oil in Alaska alone(untapped). Canada(second largest oil reserves in the world, second to SA) is estimated to become the worlds largest oil producer in 2010. Canada is where we import most of our Oil, second is Mexico.








cdokecdoke - 2/12/2008 11:19:20 PMView My AgentSpace
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Not only is it sour, but it is also quite heavy, the avearage API is around 10.5 degrees, although some of it is upgraded within the country.

Whist running around the EIA website, I came across this: "Along with being Venezuela's largest employer, PdVSA [although it is an acronym it is pronounced "Pedavesa" in the circles I run in- it is the national oil company]accounts for about one-third of the country’s GDP, 50 percent of the government’s revenue and 80 percent of Venezuela’s exports earnings."


ChicagoTedChicagoTed - 2/12/2008 4:46:09 PM
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Sour Crude contains 1% sulfer. Before it is refined it is highly corrosive. The ship owners would still need to have it refined. There is no unused refining capacity for sour crude so when our refineries shut down there would be no market. You can't take it straight from the well and burn it in a ship.

Hugo needs us as bad as we need him. He's bluffing and everyone knows it.

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krackerhatesmekrackerhatesme - 2/12/2008 6:34:31 PM
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+1 Ted
Think about how much oil can ships use compared to what he normally sells to the US.


TheSailorTheSailor - 2/13/2008 2:41:52 PMView My AgentSpace
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LOL... WOW... ONE PERCENT?!? The stuff ships use, HFO, is almost never below 2% sulfur... You know, even the gasoil loosely refered to as "diesel" on ships are 0.1% in the cleanest form...

HFO is basically a waste product of refining meaning that it is actually often dirtier than crude. We even have onboard processing equipment to remove solids and water (centrifuges) and viscocerators to control viscocity as HFO would solidify at normal room temperature. It is heated to 120 degrees C just to get it into the engine... If you gave it crude to run on, it would be extremely happy! Crude is just too expensive and full of stuff you can earn more on (i.e. gasoline and diesel)... HFO is less than 400$ pr ton!


huu76huu76 - 2/12/2008 6:50:35 PM
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Sailor,
Venezuela needs ships to sell their oil, it just so happens the US has the world's largest navy. If Dubya really wants to irritate Mr. No-plan, an embargo would do just fine. Who'd stop him, China? I can just see it now, "China threatens to stop shipping us sh!t".
It's not like Bush needs to worry about re-election.

btw, Venezuela exports 3 million barrels a day to the US, roughly 13%. Just means we need to wait longer for new tires.

Knowing the US is their lifeline must really piss off Europe. Look at the top 5 producers, 3 are under American protection, there's Canada at #2, and then odd-ball Iran.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0872964.html

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/12/2008 8:20:22 PMView My AgentSpace
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Ohh come on... You really think even Bush would be dumb enough to start shooting at ships flying different flags just to piss off Venezuela... You know Russia has a lot of nuclear bombs, so if Bush crack one more "your mamma"-joke about Putin's mother, he'll nuke all of the US and because those bombs have been waiting in missile silos for the last 20 years, they might be a bit off, so expect a large chunk of Canada to go with it! Come on man... Grow up! The US shooting on international ships FOR NO APPARANT REASON would be like declaring war on the rest of the world, and though the US might very well be the most powerful single nation, they'd have a hard time controlling THE ENTIRE PLANET!

Such an embargo isn't initiated by Bush... It has to be sanctioned by the UN and an international battle plan have to be worked out... Elseway it will just end up like in Iraq! And just look at how well that is going.


huu76huu76 - 2/12/2008 11:01:15 PM
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Sailor,
Who said anything about shooting? Board, seize and divert. Which country would want the honour of trying to ram an aircraft carrier?

You think Russia would jump in? Venezuela has what that they need? Russia probably doesn't even trade with them.

You know the US has lots of nukes that actually work. Speaking hypothetically, the US can pretty much wipe out anyone before they knew what happened to them (stealth to knockout defenses, anti-satellite weapons, and the Ohios. Over half the US nuke arsenal sits under the oceans, the one place satellites can't see). Don't forget about SMD, hey, 50% is still better than 0%.

The UN needs to sanction it or else what? News to Europe, the UN is irrelevant beyond humanitarian aid, and they're having a hard time with that too.
Venezuela isn't Iraq, Arabs have the unique distinction of putting no value on themselves or their kids.

Hugo's just hoping blowing hot air can buy him some more time. I'm sure he must know the US is practically Venezuela's only customer.

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TheSailorTheSailor - 2/13/2008 4:43:59 AMView My AgentSpace
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you know what? what ever... this is just getting silly!


without_exuberancewithout_exuberance - 2/12/2008 11:53:23 PM
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What is funny is that all the Americans keep saying "our oil, our this, our that" in Venezuela. Just becasue you steal land, land rights, waterways and its rights from the poor indegenous people. Decide that you want to build upon said land, waterways and put millions if not billions into developing the land does not mean it is yours. Same thing they are doing in the Niger Delta, stole the land from the people developed it, and get MAD and ANGRY when the people native to the land demand proper compensation.

You guys have the goddamn nerve to think you own the world and should get oil, uranium, gold, silver, copper, chocolate, diamonds, cobalt for pennies on the dollar. Chavez is a black/indian man who was sick of seeing HIS PEOPLE being robbed by AMERICAN and EUROPEANS. Not only in oil revenue but in many other products. Get used to it the 3rd world is starting to demand fair compensation for the goods you have been getting away with STEALING for the past 60-100 years.

Chavez got rid of the WHITE Venezuealans who served WHITE EUROPEAN AND AMERICAN "INTERESTS." They did not serve the brown and black people of Venezuela. They siphoned off billions every year into American and European banks. Chavez and many like him are sick of it. Where was your outrage then??

All of you are up in arms because Exxon is finally getting some due to them. Exxon has robbed, pillaged- sent in mercenaries to wipe out entire villages in their way,-, and polluted many 3rd world countries.

Get this AMERICA DOES NOT OWN THE WORLD!!!!
It is about time someone has the backbone to stand up to your corporations. This oil belongs to the people of Venezuela.

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kablaamkablaam - 2/13/2008 1:23:20 PM
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I guess you are adding to the pollution, pillaging and robbery by purchasing gasoline from these evil doers huh?

Get off your pedestal and back to reality.

60% of their oil revenue comes from the US. They sell it to us because they want to. Explain to me why poverty is so high in Venezuela, why there is virtually no middle-class, why the rich/poor disparity is so high that 95% of farm land is owned by 3% of the population?

We make Venezuela(well Chavez and his mopes) richer by the day. Where were these countries when oil was 12/barrel? Just remember, history is a BI#@^.


motomoto - 2/14/2008 7:04:36 PM
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kablaam, you make Americans look like the greediest bastards on the planet.

Like it or not, Chavez is an elected official of a sovereign country, and without_exuberance is mostly correct. Sure, Chavez is taking some extreme measures in an attempt to reverse 100+ years of colonialism, and I personally don't like his style either, but his actions are much more honorable than using an offensive war to "liberate" a middle-eastern country, giving no-bid contracts to friends, and using US soldiers to defend private oil facilities, and lying to convince everyone of impending threat all the while.

Most people here seem to be pro-capitalist. Nothing wrong with that, but wake up and realize that you can't simply buy anything you want. Don's support a corrupt US administration while accusing a 3rd-world Robin Hood of being unfair. Nobody's got clean hands in the oil industry.

When you wave your checkbook overseas, you're playing by the local laws. Today, thanks to decades of disingenuous US foreign policy punctuated in the last 7 years by an idiot-in-chief, the American businessman is simply not welcomed overseas nearly like he used to be. Demonize Chavez all you want, it doesn't change the fact that the USA has worn out its welcome across the planet.

By the way, Exxon will have no problem regaining legal access to Venezuelan oil -- it will simply have to pay Venezuelans a fair price for access rights and bid against other oil developers, just like everywhere else in the legitimate business world. All the crooked exclusive-access contracts that Exxon twisted corrupt 3rd world leaders into making in the past are slowing falling apart ... not only in South America, but in Africa and the middle east too. I'm surprised that it hadn't happened sooner.

Moreover, since China has not only the demand but also the technology and the newest refineries coming on line, they will be happy to outbid American companies for drilling rights.

Truth hurts, doesn't it?


kablaamkablaam - 2/13/2008 7:50:30 PM
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