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Can Detroit save itself with muscle cars?
Can American automakers save themselves by sticking with what has worked for them since the 1960s: big power and brash looks? If the Dodge Challenger, Ford Mustang, and Chevrolet Camaro are any indication, Detroit is out to spark a muscle-car resurgence.

Nostalgia for bygone eras is one of American drivers’ favorite obsessions. How many great cars there used to be: The 1963 Corvette Stingray. The ‘64 Pontiac GTO. The ‘67 Chevy Camaro.

Steve McQueen’s Mustang in the 1968 movie “Bullitt” still has passionate fans. Even the 1969 Dodge Charger became a star retroactively, when a bright orange one known as the General Lee... Read Article
Can Detroit save itself with muscle cars?



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w209w114w209w114 - 2/12/2008 4:07:16 PMView My AgentSpace
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IF they make these cars fuel efficient and reasonably priced, then YES!

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PorschinatorPorschinator - 2/12/2008 4:52:57 PM
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Considering the Camaro is using a power plant from the Corvette it should have reasonable MPG since current Corvette is best in class MPG. Charger at over 2 tons...not so much :-P

I highly doubt Detroit is relying on these muscle car sales to save anything but rather wanting to make fun vehicles.


w209w114w209w114 - 2/12/2008 5:07:36 PMView My AgentSpace
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Porschinator,

I think a Turbo V6 will do a nice job for most people in the Camaro. Although muscle car purists will want the V8 (which will surely be available)


rockerrocker - 2/12/2008 4:16:29 PM
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All things hinge on quality, variety, design and marketing. Improve the Mailbu(check), redesign the Impala(please), make a Buick that someone(half the age of my grandmother) would drive, get Cadillac back in the luxury market(in substance not just price), get rid of the old Neon platform, make Jeep Jeep again. That would be a start.

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S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 2/12/2008 9:28:00 PMView My AgentSpace
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Cadillac's already there, but yes, I agree.


w209w114w209w114 - 2/12/2008 4:35:55 PMView My AgentSpace
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These cars wont be competing directly. Detroit invented the muscle car. Sure the 1 series is FAST but its no true muscle car.

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OblivObliv - 2/12/2008 5:23:29 PM
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The Germans havent created a muscle car. And they never will.

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neutralneutral - 2/12/2008 10:25:48 PM
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I would hope the Germans/Japs don't make a muscle car. The muscle car is an American thing, not a foreign thing. When I sit in a Mercedes/BMW/Audi/Infiniti, I was elegance, refinement and panache as well as brute power, quality and performance.

I expect all of the newer gen Muscle cars to be well built and pretty good handling, but still have that vicious American feel.

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mini22mini22 - 2/12/2008 4:26:53 PM
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BMW's are great driving machines but their not American. Muscle cars are American. The 2 new ones create excitment because they like the Mustang offer a unique American driving experience. The problem is they are low volume. The rest of the models from GM,Ford,Chrysler have to have the "gotta have it" appeal. The Malibu prooves that a mainstream FWD sedan can go toe to toe with Accord and Camry yet offer distinctly American feel.Buick has some of that,The Chrysler 300 and Charger offer that as well though they need to improve interior quality.Ford needs to redesign the Taurus so it offers some excitment.

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PorschinatorPorschinator - 2/12/2008 4:59:04 PM
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Very true. Only main issue is that Muscle cars are not known for fit and finish or great Driving feel as well as handling to rival German sport sedans. Just straight line off the red light grunt.

If the Camaro and Challenger compete with more refined driving feel and quality it will be a winner. Def not the 60s, early 70s anymore!!! Camaro will smoke the 135i and 335i but doubt it will be as fun to drive.


lyonboylyonboy - 2/12/2008 7:04:04 PM
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The Camaro and Challenger are too big and fat to be sporty cars. The two cars will flop within a year of introduction. GM and Chrysler would have been much wiser to put their resources into more mainstream product.

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TargaTarga - 2/12/2008 7:41:06 PM
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Obviously you have no idea about muscle cars. These are not designed to run with porsches or M3s even. It is just a different type of car all together.


ilmorilmor - 2/12/2008 7:22:45 PM
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I think cars like these help each manufacturer because, besides sales and (hopefully) profits, they establish a positive and popular image, and help bring people into the showrooms. These cars don't appeal to everyone, but that's ok they're not meant to. Personally, I would like one of each (Shelby, Camaro and Challenger).

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mini22mini22 - 2/12/2008 7:40:54 PM
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Fun to drive means different things to different people.A BMW is and has always been known for handling and agility. A muscle car has always been known for straight line acceleration and the sound of its motor. The newer ones also now handle reasonably well. They do not handle with the scaple like precision of a BMW etc. nor will they ever. That's not what their about.

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thstonethstone - 2/12/2008 8:02:35 PM
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I don't see how one or even two nostalgia cars per US maker can save anyone. Sure, the Mustang has been a sucess, but the Camaro will be less so and the Challenger even more less so. This trend will wear itself out pretty quickly.

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BoredBored - 2/12/2008 8:21:55 PM
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these cars aren't meant to save GM and Chrysler.
they are meant to bring traffic, and hopefully sells, in their chain of dealers.

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Bmw8terBmw8ter - 2/12/2008 8:34:45 PM
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Detroit is neither coming, nor going....it just "is".

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EvoAudiEvoAudi - 2/12/2008 9:48:14 PMView My AgentSpace
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If they stopped talking about it and actually sold them they would.

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krackerhatesmekrackerhatesme - 2/12/2008 10:30:22 PM
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Not trying to be a hater of these cars... but lets not forget the reason they went extinct in the first place. I think its great they are making these cars and I can't wait to see the production models on the road. These muscle cars might just get people in to the showroom and have them notice the Malibu or the Caliber. So if these cars help attract people to the dealer and they sell a Caliber or Malibu because of it then it helps the manufacturer. (Change the name Malibu - it reminds people of Malibu Barbie - But I guess "GM is targeting younger female drivers for this car....")

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huu76huu76 - 2/12/2008 11:13:12 PM
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They should start with something that can seriously compete against the Civic and Corolla.

Even BMW has to go down market to try and compete against those cars. MB and Audi already have.

Heritage and magic feel don't pay the bills. Saying my car company is about to go bankrupt doesn't sound too appealing either.

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without_exuberancewithout_exuberance - 2/13/2008 12:18:39 AM
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Get real wishful thinking. Guess who will be driving these cars.
1. The grandpa with keg belly, beard down to his keg belly, driving in the slow lane.
2.Young spoiled 18-20 y.o. white male w/money to burn as long as his parents are providing it.
3.overweight hood local with 22" rims, and a huge exhaust. Oh yeah he will crash it within 9 months of getting it.

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Chaos29Chaos29 - 2/13/2008 12:58:06 AM
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They have to ... otherwise, the trailer trash will protest!

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TTRaceRRTTRaceRR - 2/13/2008 1:56:10 AM
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I think they bring excitement and showroom traffic to the brands. Unfortunately, when the money talks, buyers are more in the appliance mindset and settle for a Camry, Accord, Civic or Corolla. US automakers need to take advantage of all the publicity these cars are bringing to their brands and translate them into sales of their more practical models. I think it would be wise for Chrysler not to offer the Challenger for too long until sales drop off, but rather replace it in about 24 months with a Barracuda variation of the same model while the momentum and desirability is still high for such a vehicle. If the market demand is still strong for musclecars after it has had a run for a couple years, replace it with another musclecar such as a Roadrunner and so on.

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krackerhatesmekrackerhatesme - 2/13/2008 9:30:08 AM
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Imagine a Roadrunner.... +1 TRacer = Just plop a new body on the same frame/engine after a few years = saves them money and gives them a new product.


0to600to60 - 2/13/2008 9:08:50 AM
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After pickups, the best sellers are family sedans. They need to strengthen their family sedans. Make them more appealing to the Camry, Accord, and Altima buyers.

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TTRaceRRTTRaceRR - 2/13/2008 11:33:08 AM
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kracker,
I never said anything about keeping the same chassis beyond the 2-4 year run for the Challenger/Cuda. However, I'm sure you can get at least 6 years out of a decent chassis while a new one is being developed. It doesn't make any sense to put all that money into developing one just to dump it in 2-3 years. A body refresh is inexpensive and could keep the the chassis profitable. If you are old enough to remember, Detroit used to completely restyle their cars every year between the 50's-70's. It was exciting to see what the new ones would look like. Also, your new car wouldn't look exactly the same as your neighbor's 3 year old car as it is with every Camry and Accord parked in today's driveways.

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mini22mini22 - 2/13/2008 1:32:43 PM
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Muscle cars will not save the big 3. They do bring in some extra traffic and the Mustang has been a profit maker for Ford. The problem is the new fuel economy rules are eventually going to kill off the V8.So if they are going to keep the muscle cars they will have to evolve with smaller,most likely turbo V6 engines. They will also have to get a bit lighter in weight as well. A Dodge Challenger currently weighs 4100 LBS. That's not going to fly in the face of fuel economy regs.

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RupertRupert - 2/13/2008 6:05:25 PMView My AgentSpace
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Retro 70s is the fashion in the US right now?
That's so odd - here in Britain it's quite an 80's punky/clubby look that is in fashion (skinny jeans, leather jackets, white shoes etc) - the 70's went out 2 years ago.

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huu76huu76 - 2/13/2008 11:23:25 PM
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TheBoss,
Who stopped the genocide in Kosovo? American airpower did.
Who's keeping China/Russia at bay? American military power is.
Who keeps Germany's economy going? American economic power is.
Who does most of the global research? American universities do (with help from Canadian and immigrant students).
Who offered to pony up peacekeeping troops for Darfur only to have the UN turn it down because one of the despot UN members was offended? America did.
Who keeps oil flowing to Europe? America does.
Who funds the majority of the UN (money well wasted)? America does.
American cars may not be all good, but they're still able to compete against the Europeans and win. Pick a class or cateogry and I'll tell you an American car that tops the best Europe has to offer.

You really are clueless.
Hiphop is so good? That's all we need, a few more generations of retarded gold chain wearing white kids with identity issues. (Maybe that's their plan, making kids so stupid China won't want to steal anything anymore) Black Obama is just going to make it worse if he wins the dumbocratic nomination (not like he has a chance against McCain anyway).

Your last comment was really sad. Hillary has more balls than Obama ever will. He'd just be a puppet for Europe and China. (the last thing the first black president wants to be remembered for is going to war as his first act)

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huu76huu76 - 2/13/2008 11:24:41 PM
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Oh, and you may think music isn't all that great (which I half agree with you), but hiphop is just a collection of "sampling", which is basically another term for stealing.

Europes seems to eat up all these garbage music and movies the US produces, goes to show how intelligent they are then.

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camrexcamrex - 2/15/2008 8:21:25 AM
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Bringing back some of the muscle cars will help sales and attention to their brands. But the real way that Detroit can save itself is innovative looks, styling, and economical (both gas wise and price wise) vehicles across the rest of their "bread and butter lines." Muscle cars by themselves won't do it. You can't survive with a one-trick pony, unless you're a small company. It just doesn't happen.

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AntiHybridAntiHybrid - 2/15/2008 11:03:23 AM
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The economy will hurt or kill off these cars. Dodge is late coming into the retro game. This Challenger should have been made for general availability in late 2006. After all, we all knew about the Mustang retro concept in 2003. What was Dodge doing, letting Ford be the test bed for the retro market? Well, the economy was much better in 2005-2006 and now people are tightening their budgets.
Another thing that will kill sale for the Challenger. Dealers are asking $20K over sticker. What the he11 are they thinking and shame on Dodge for allowing it. (I know free market and all that BS but come on...) Give credit to GM, prior to general release of the Pontiac Solstice they gave the people that had been on the interest list the longest first shot to purchase at MSRP. I passed but it was commendable. Next year I'll purchase my new 2009 Challenger at 0% and a fat rebate - bank on it.

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