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GM Finds The Road To An All Electric Car Is Full Up Bumps

Agent009 submitted on 2/19/2008 Official Bell & Ross Timestamp: 1:25:13 PM

15 user comments | Category: Misc News | Source: | SOURCE: www.detnews.com

In the rush to deliver an electric car to the masses, General Motors Corp.

is finding that the all-important battery might not be the only major hurdle.

The heating and cooling systems, for example, are a challenge because they typically are built to run off a traditional fuel combustion engine. That means new types of air conditioning and heating systems must be built.

GM, in a high-stakes race with Toyota Motor Corp. to turn out an affordable, effective battery-powered car, has found that while the lithium-ion batteries themselves are hitting all the marks on early road tests, a host of other issues are beginning to crop up.



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GM Finds The Road To An All Electric Car Is Full Up Bumps

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Agent009

"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough."

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User Comments

EnnNorak

A hydrogen economy would solve all these problems. All we need is cheap solar cells to convert sunlight into electricity for the electrolysis of water. The sun radiates more energy to Earth than our overpopulated planet can currently use. We are just too stupid to figure out an economical way to harness that energy. Shame on our science-challenged politicians for lacking vision.

— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 6:16:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

GreenPlease

@EnnNorak

Actually the hydrogen economy would be substantially less efficient than a straight EV economy. Look at the losses in energy in hydrogen:
1. Production to electrolysis- 66% (Losses to splitting water)
2. Electrolysis to tank- 70% (Compression losses)
3. Fuel cell to electricity- 60% (Best Case Scenario)
4. Electricity to wheels- 90%
Total: 24.9%
1. Charging the battery- 90%
2. Discharging the battery- 90%
Total: 81%

If you use a natural gas fired turbine (60% efficient) to provide the primary electricity for both processes you get a well to wheels efficiency of:
Hydrogen: 14.9%
Batteries: 48.6%

There would be no scale up advantage either: both would be using the same traction motors, and hydrogen FC vehicles need a traction battery anyways, so why not just go straight EV?

— GreenPlease (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 6:48:30 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

EnnNorak

GreenPlease, you greenies will never stop rationalizing. Who cares about efficiency of electrolysis when there is a virtually unlimited amount of clean solar energy available. Efficiency becomes an issue only if you want to produce hydrocarbons out of coal for example.

We need to have solar cells that are cheap enough to allow for an acceptable return on investment. They can be very inefficient if you want as long as they are cheap enough. The input of radiation from the sun is free.

— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 2/21/2008 10:15:08 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

1970toyotamarc

They should have just stuck with the EV-1.

— 1970toyotamarc (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 2:03:53 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

EnnNorak

fastonekiller, even though I am not in favor of hybrids, I think the Prius is a good-looking and efficiently packaged vehicle. I would like Toyota to make a larger diesel-powered version of the Prius.

— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 6:18:58 PM | | Votes: 2   

1970toyotamarc

You have obviously never driven an EV-1.

— 1970toyotamarc (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 6:55:23 PM | | Votes: 3   

Michael

I would agree that you are correct in at least one sense; the electronics from the EV1 should be available as a starting point so at least there should be no need to start from the beginning to develop all the necessary electronics! Does anyone know whether this was the case?

— Michael (View Profile)

Posted on 2/26/2008 7:42:35 AM | | Votes: 1   

t_bone

As much as pure electric climate control will be a massive battery drain, imagine the luxury of getting into car on a cold morning and BAM! the heat is INSTANTLY on!

— t_bone (View Profile)

Posted on 2/19/2008 10:10:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

GruntyDieselsRock

What they should stop doing is ranting on about what they are doing with green cars and actually produce one. GM's greenwash comes straight from the marketing department. There actually isnt any research going on. This is all just to make you think their will be an alternative to your 8mpg truck. Yes this is. Now. Bt not from GM. Ever, not likely. GM will go broke first. They are far too late to this party.

— GruntyDieselsRock (View Profile)

Posted on 2/20/2008 4:18:10 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Michael

I guess you can't say that anymore!

— Michael (View Profile)

Posted on 2/26/2008 7:38:19 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

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