GM shrinks Volt’s gas tank

omarrana submitted on 07/09/2008 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 10:47 AM
from: www.egmcartech.com

Tags: Chevrolet

Chevrolet

GM shrinks Volt’s gas tank

One of the many things GM flaunted when it unveiled the Chevrolet Volt Concept was that after the lithium-ion battery pack completes its 40 mile range, the Volt would be capable of an extra 600 mile range on 12 gallons of gasoline.

According to KickingTires, GM has shrunk the capacity of the plug-in electric Volt to hold less than 12-gallons - cutting down the car’s 600 mile range. GM is not saying exactly how many gallons have been reduced, but the target is now to travel... Read Article

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amazinBimmer - 7/9/2008 1:12:53 PM

-5 Boost

still a pos gm. stupid union workers

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Spectator - 7/9/2008 1:58:28 PM

+4 Boost

Thats not really fair to throw the company under the bus just becuase of the Unions.

Bmw8ter - 7/9/2008 2:07:40 PM

+5 Boost

....and BMWs union workers are so much smarter.

EnnNorak - 7/9/2008 2:16:51 PM

-4 Boost

I don't like unions but I don't see what unions have to do with it unless I missed something in the article. I for one will not buy a car that has short range. I am totally pissed at all car companies who cut the capacity of gas tanks just to reduce the total weight of the vehicle with a full load of fuel. The incremental inconvenience of a short range far outweighs the slight extra cost of lugging around an extra 100 lbs of fuel. Maybe Lutz does not drive.

bestofallcad - 7/9/2008 4:05:37 PM

+4 Boost

amazinBimmer YOU MAKE ME SICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!! when ever I see any comment from you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ARE YOU STUPID DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT THE FOREIGN AUTO MAKERS ARE NOT MAKING MONEY?????????????

DO YOU GET PD FOR WHAT EVER BUSINESS OR JOB YOU HAVE?????

AND YES IT IS TO BAD, THE DAMN UNIONS ARE HURTING THE AMERICAN AUTOMAKER HOWEVER DOES THAT MEAN NOT TO SUPPORT OUR COUNTRYS COMPANY'S. I FEEL BAD FOR GM AND COMPANYS LIKE THEM BECAUSE THEY WOULD BE MUCH MORE PROFITABLE IF IT WASNT FOR THE UNION'S.

I see your comments all the time and all you ever do is slam the American Auto's, you never give any of them credit for anything well done YOU MAKE ME ILL!!!

a** comments like you make all the time why do you not move out of this country since you hate the AMERICAN COMPANYS and hate the AMERICAN WORKER, YOU always are calling names, like fat lazy american worker I am sick of your rude comments and lack of knowledge and lack of respect for other Americans that work their A**es off to make a great product.

Why do you lump the American Auto maker into Fat and Lazy??? and I seen you comments where you call them F*cks, who gave you the right stereo type like you do? YOU ARE PATHITC, talk about predujice you are, who made you the JUDGE????

I would rather give our country's company's and our country's workers my money for a Great product, like they do produce, then to give my money to FOREIGN companys and supporting FOREIGN countrys workers. Because when the FOREIGN companys who get our money they are not putting it back into our ecomony. Let me repeat my self so you hear this, do you think when they get our money do you think they are giving it to us to put into our countrys ecomony and our are they supporting American jobs, American spending.

Did you ever take economics?? when you see GM laying people off that is NOT GOOD FOR ANY ONE THAT LIVES, WORKS, And OWNS A BUSINESS in this country. NO JOBS, MEANS NO MONEY, WHICH = NO SPENDING SO SUPPLY goes up AND DEMAND GO DOWN WHICH then prices drop, which = OUR ECOMOMY GOES TO SHIT!!!

IF YOU HAVE HALF A BRAIN YOU WOULD REALLY RE-THINK YOUR COMMENTS. AND SINCE I DO NOT THINK YOU DO LET ME SPELL IT OUT FOR YOU,,,, IF YOU LIKE YOUR LIFE STYLE Like you Job and like money, YOU MAY WANT TO THINK ABOUT A AMERICAN PRODUCT NEXT TIME, RATHER THAN A FORIEN COMPANYS BECAUSE ALL YOU ARE DOING IS SENDING MONEY OVER SEAS TO MAKE THERE ECONOMY PROSPER.

I do not know about you, I know I would rather support our economy then other countries economy. I like my life style. And I love my Country.

By 1st thing I saw was this Jokes comments 1st thing and I am so sick of him so I did not even say anything about the car in the article I think this car looks Great ANOTHER GREAT JOB GM!!!! I HOPE THE BEST OF SUCCESS WITH IT AND ALL THE OTHER GREAT AUTO'S GM HAS BEEN COMING OUT WITH..........

Bored - 7/9/2008 5:56:22 PM

+4 Boost

@ amazingBimmer,

Yeah, that was a dumb comment...almost sounds like you were thinking the right thing but typed the wrong thing.

Besides, the Unions just build the car in accordance to the design specs of GM.

Whelan - 7/9/2008 2:09:56 PM

+5 Boost

Amazin, that is probably one of the worst comments on here. Maybe you should go hang out with EL some more.

Trying to keep this discussion on topic and not about some @$$holes retarded comments now;

It makes sense to shrink it down. Fuel sitting around does not get better with age. With all the additives and such in it now, it is not as good for long periods of time sitting. And 360 miles to a tank with 40 miles pure electric is insane!

Also take into account it gets 40 miles pure electric on a full charge. So if your commute is like mine say 50 miles round trip. If I did not plug it in at work I would be using only 10 miles a day in gas. That's 50 miles in one week and over a month only 200 miles of commuting using gas. That leaves another 160 miles in a month of gas driving.

Hopefully you followed me on that one. It does not get 40 miles electric once and then go all gas, you get 40 miles for each full charge and if I charge it at work, that would mean I would be driving to and from work using no gas!

So that really makes the whole it only does 360 on gas still a HUGE advantage as you get that electric usage each time then pickup the driving. Still feasible for long trips as well as you can get 360 miles to one tank.

reply to this comment

Audiphile - 7/9/2008 3:36:02 PM

+4 Boost

Guys, I think you are missing the point of the Volt Concept. It is not a Prius-like hybrid, in which the car is driven by both electric and gasoline motors. It is also not a purely electric car, which requires the battery to be recharged from an electrical outlet.

The 1-liter 3-cylinder gas engine in the Volt drives a generator which charges the car's battery pack, which in turn powers the electric motors that actually propel the car.

To quote answers.com,
"This general layout is considered a plug-in series hybrid design since mechanical power initially drives the generator, which in turn charges the battery pack. Power is then drained from the batteries to run the electrical motors which move the vehicle. The internal combustion engine does not have any mechanical linkage to the wheels (unlike current vehicles such as the Toyota Prius), and it can run at a constant rpm for optimal efficiency."

GM plans to keep the lithium-ion battery in a state-of-charge (SOC) range of between 30% and 80%, with the on-board generator kicking in at the 30% level.[10]"

As the eletric motors don't care where its "juice" comes from, a diesel engine could be used in place of a gasoline one. All internal-combustion engines achieve optimum efficiency running at a constant optimal rpm, but diesels are much more efficient than gasoline engines when running in constant-optimal-rpm mode.

Hydrogen fuel cells could also be a source of electricity in future Volts.

True, the Volt will be able to run 40 miles on the battery pack alone, and then can be recharged from a power outlet. However, that would reduce the Volt to the status of a commuter car. For longer trips, one needs the gasoline engine to recharge the battery pack. As conventional cars can travel 400 to 500 highway miles on a tank of gas, GM's decision to cut the Volt's full-tank range to 360 miles would be a minor inconvenience to most drivers. However, for the motorist who has to drive across a vast desert complete with the stereotypical "no gas for 400 miles" warning signs, adding a gallon or two to the tank capacity might be a good idea!

reply to this comment

MercedesBenz00Z - 7/9/2008 3:41:10 PM

-6 Boost

GM, come on, no one needs your car anymore. Just go bankrupt and never come back :)

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bestofallcad - 7/9/2008 4:48:54 PM

0 Boost

MercedesBenz00Z you make me sick as well. With comments like go bankrupt GM No you ass go bankrupt Mercedes, because Mercedes is a German car, GM is a American car which suports AMERICAN PEOPLE, IT GIVES JOBS TO AMERICAN PEOPLE, IT PAYS TAXES TO AMERICA, WHICH HELPS SUPPORTS DIFFERENT PROGRAMS THAT SUPPORT, AMERICAN PEOPLE, AMERICAN BUSINESSES, AMERICAN JOBS WHICH ALL MEANS THE AMERICAN WAY OF LIFE.

DO YOU WANT THE NEXT DEPRESSION????, YOU DUMB A**, IF THE BIG 3 WENT UNDER WATCH OUT WE WILL BE SO CLOSE TO A DEPRESSION IF NOT A DEPRESSION. AND THIS TIME AROUND IT WILL BE MUCH HARDER AND TAKE A LOT MORE TIME TO RECOVER FROM THEN THE 1ST ONE SINCE AT THAT TIME AMERICA WAS THE WORLD LEADER, IN EVERYTHING, DEVELOPING PRODUCTS, INVENTING PRODUCTS, AND MANUFACTERING PRODUCTS. WELL TODAY AMERICAN MANUFACTERING IS BECOMING MORE AND MORE RARE, SO NOW TAKE THE CAR MANUFACTURING OUT WELL BAD TIMES WILL HIT.

Just think about this you dumb A**, IF THE BIG THREE WENT UNDER, WHAT EVER SMALL PROTION OF LEVERAGE WE HAVE WITH FORIEN AUTO MAKERS WOULD BE GONE, THEY THEN WOULD NOT EVEN HAVE TO HAVE PLANTS HERE which helps support some American jobs, SINCE WE WOULD HAVE TO BUY THEIR CARS they could pull their plants nothing would stop them from doing this, BECAUSE WE WOULD NOT HAVE CHOICE but to buy their cars since we would not be manufacturing American cars any longer. They also then could charge anything they wanted since America would not have a choice. Just look at Gas Prices we are relianent on forien oil and what are gas prices????

The big three are a Big part of Americas economy and do not forget that you Dumby!!!! Sorry I have stooped to their level however I have to defend American companys because I live here, make money here, and was So Lucky to be Born in The Greatest Nation in the world, so when I hear or see other people like these two and see these comments about my countrys company's it makes me sick to my stomach.

DO YOU LIKE YOUR MERCEDES, WELL I HOPE YOU DO SINCE YOU ARE AND WOULD BE TO BLAME, AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU FOR BAD ECONOMIC TIMES IN AMERICA. IF THE BIG THREE WENT OUT OF BUSINESS IT WOULD EFFECT AMERICA, MAYBE NOT FOR AWHILE BUT FOR DO YOU WANT YOUR KIDS TO HAVE THE SAME OPPROTUNITY'S IN THE FUTURE??? THEN YOU BETTER START TO SUPPORT OUR COUNTRY'S BUSINESSES AND YOU CAN START BY OR YOUR RUDE COMMENTS BY NOT PUTTING THEM DOWN AND WISHING THEY WOULD GO OUT OF BUSINESS.

IF YOU WANT TO KEEP OUR COUNTRY'S ECONOMY HEALTHY THEN SUPPORT AMERICAN COMPANY'S OR ATLEAST KEEP YOUR RUDE COMMENTS TO YOUR SELF. IF YOU CANNOT MAYBE YOU WANT TO MAKE THIS COUNTRY A 3RD WORLD COUNTRY??? IT SURE SOUNDS LIKE IT WHEN YOU DO NOT SUPPORT AMERICAN COMPANYS AND YOU EVEN GO FURTHER BY KNOCKING THEM.

AGAIN GREAT JOB GM.

Bored - 7/9/2008 5:50:18 PM

0 Boost

@ bestofallcad,

A neg for way too many CAPS, so your argument will ultimately be ignored by others.

Also, it doesn't hold water.

Reason #1: Corporate Lobbyists.
Reason #2: American and International Fair trade laws written and agreed to by our own government with loopholes the size of the moon.

As an American, yes, it sucks and makes me angry that we are constantly losing jobs and industry. But I also accept that as an American, us, the people, deserve some of the blame -- voting for politicians with the best intentions that turn their backs on us and renege on campaign promises, or worse, NOT VOTING AT ALL.

Luckily for us, it's a very small percentage of blame. The true blame goes to American corporations' greed and American government's legal incompetence.

Life just isn't as black and white as your argument is. If it was, we wouldn't be any problems here or abroad.

MercedesBenz00Z - 7/9/2008 9:05:39 PM

-2 Boost

bestofallcad,

I'm sorry, but Mercedes-Benz is making enough money, more than enough actually, so I really don't see why it would just bankrupt.

But GM and Ford will bankrupt because of so many reasons. Can they make decent cars? No. Do they care about the customers? No. Are the American cars reliable? Heck no.

So sorry, pal. I am not gonna drive an American car just because of the economy. We don't live in the Soviet Union here, or are you a communist?

MercedesBenz00Z - 7/9/2008 9:10:25 PM

0 Boost

And just to let you know, this damn country's government is doing their best to let the second Great Depression happen, so don't blame me for any economic issues, blame the government.

But obviously you would just keep telling me that GM is better because you are a brainwashed moron.

I feel sorry for you because all the luxury stuff you know is only just Cadillac LOL

damikco - 7/9/2008 11:05:44 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

MercedesBenz00Z ...... Germany is afraid, yes afraid of the new cts-v that made many waves in germany this year eating up a little race track ...(you now where) i dont have to mention it, als the next up to make Germany run in terror is the pontiac G8 THE MOST POWERFUL CAR UNDER 30k, oh and buy the way these two union made made cars have a longer warranty than anything in BMW's linup also have better gas milage.

Bored - 7/9/2008 3:59:07 PM

0 Boost

I do like the points made by Whelan and Audiphile, but "perception is reality" and I think this will be the Volt's downfall. I believe their only chance at success with this vehicle is a no nonsense, propaganda-free advertising campaign that educates the public on this approach.

Anyway, I posted the following yesterday:

I had some hope for this vehicle until I read this:

http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2008/07/volt-gas-tank.html

GM is looking to sell this vehicle for around $30K w/ gov't tax breaks. If they are going to cut potential fuel mileage by about 40% (from 600 mi. to possibly as low as 360 miles), the price needs to be under $20K.

WHY? Two reasons:

1) The Prius starts @ $21,500, with the minimum potential to travel 571 miles on a full tank of gas.
2) The VW Jetta TDI Bluemotion will start @ $22,000, with the minimum potential to travel 638 miles on a full tank of diesel.

Obviously, there are more alternatives but I would gladly pocket the $8K.

Wouldn't you?

reply to this comment

91z4me - 7/9/2008 5:13:35 PM

+3 Boost

Did you not read the rebuttle I posted after you?
The Volt isn't about going as far as possible w/out stopping. Who does that anyway?

Seriously the Volt will go 40 miles on pure electric, which guess what is more than the average person uses in a daily commute.

By reducing the gas tank you reduce the weight (which improves fuel economy) and you add space for the battery system (which improves range).

And since when is the value of a vehicle based on it's range?

BTW how much will that tankful of diesel cost you in the Jetta?

ceric - 7/9/2008 5:32:03 PM

+4 Boost

GM will make or break on Volt. It is a big bet, and I hope they succeed. I have never owned a GM, but Volt is interesting to me ...

Bored - 7/9/2008 6:57:48 PM

+2 Boost

@ 91z4me,

Sorry, but I spend so much time dealing with idiots like MT that I miss good post like yours. I went back to read it, but one thing stuck in my head:

"So do you really NEED the extra 240 miles or do you just WANT the extra 240 miles because you THINK you need it?"

Considering that GM is shooting for a $30K price point (and only if the government approves the tax break they've requested), I have to answer you question with a question"

If I'm asked to pay $30K for a vehicle, shouldn't those 240 miles, at the very least, be included at no additional cost to stay competitive? A lot of people still take road trips.

It was a 12 gallon tank. Since GM estimates that it can get 50 mpg but will only travel 360 miles on fuel, the new size of the gas tank become only 7.2 gallons.

Let's say that your commute to work is 35 miles, round trip. No problem. It's a "free" commute, relatively speaking. Well, what happens when co-workers want to do happy hour and you can't park close enough to the building at work and/or the bar to charge up for safety's sake? It means your commute isn't as "free" as it could have been because now you are relying on your fuel. Kinda of inconvenient when the kilowatt per hour cost to refuel your car w/ electricity would be around $1 (sorry, don't have more precise figures) and per gallon cost of fuel is at least $4.20.

Speaking of regular gas, it's $4.20/gal where I live. What's going to be my cost per mile on gas? Sure it would be great to included the electric miles, but let's be fair and just talk about the gas engine. The 50 mpg that Chevy claims is obviously highway miles, but I will exclude real-world variables like traffic, accidents, and driving habits. National avg. of regular is $4.10, making the cost per mile $.082.
I think that's awesome, but it makes me want more of that $.082 per mile cost.

For the sake of argument, the Prius has an 11.9 gallon tank yielding a maximum of $.085 per mile. Nat'l avg for diesel is $4.81 and Jetta TDI will have the same 14.5 gallon tank as its gas siblings, so it's cost per mile is $.11.

Now the Volt obviously wins the cost per mile battle, but at what cost? Is it really worth it to the consumer to pay at least $8K more? Well, yes and no because that starts with an individual financial state. But what is more important is that GM convinces the public that the Volt is a better alternative.

"Perception is reality".

As a commuter vehicle, yes, it would be a good choice. But the majority of potential buyers only have the means for one vehicle and may need that vehicle to do more than just commute to work and be a runabout. A Civic or Corolla at half the asking price of the Volt would be a better choice.

Right now, your argument only makes sense if you are buying the vehicle for me and you aren't going to be my "sugar daddy". That $8K difference buys me a lot of gas, pays bills, and/or becomes an investment that could possible gai

993Turbo - 7/10/2008 6:52:20 AM

+1 Boost

But 12 gallons is a pretty small tank already. Are we talking about 30-50 lbs difference? That could easily be around someone's waist line!

holmstar - 7/9/2008 6:03:41 PM

+5 Boost

Since when is 350 miles per tank a huge problem? I don't think I've ever even owned a car that got more than 400 mi per tank. My current car gets about 350/tank and I've never seen it as the massive issue that some of you seem to think it is. Seriously, this is a big issue for you guys??

I also totally agree that this is intended as a commuter car. As someone else said, if you have a 50 mile commute, you would only use 10 miles worth of gas per day. If you are getting something like 40 miles per gallon (probably closer to 50 in reality) you would only use .25 gallons per day. Let's say the tank ends up being 8 gallons. This would be enough that you wouldn't have to stop for gas for 32 days!

If you are worried about long road trips, well how often do you really drive more than 350 miles at one time without stopping for food or to use a toilet? You have to stop anyway, so what is the big deal with stopping to get gas at the same time?

Seems like you guys are just looking for things to get ticked off about.

reply to this comment

holmstar - 7/9/2008 6:11:53 PM

+3 Boost

Hey, bestofallcad
Yeah we're with you that some people on here are being trolls... but chill out. No need to write a book about it. If you really are that annoyed, tell it to 001.

reply to this comment

Bored - 7/9/2008 7:09:33 PM

+3 Boost

@ holmstar,

that's odd. every time i've complained about MT, nothing happens.

also, i don't disagree with the points you and 91z make. i guess i'm just thinking of the flipside of the coin, so to speak.

damikco - 7/9/2008 10:52:28 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

The Volt will be bigger than the prius!

reply to this comment

bagwell - 7/11/2008 3:01:06 PM

+2 Boost

I hope so but the price may be a huge problem -- $40K versus the Prius at nearly half that.

austintyson - 7/11/2008 8:36:17 PM

+2 Boost

Well I think what GM is trying to do is to keep the fuel from going bad. I drive 300 miles a week on avg. So if I owned one of these cars I could do most of my driving without usig a drop of fuel. So If I only use a gallon a week it would take 7 weeks to burn a tank of fuel. 12 weeks if it had a 12 gallon tank. And if the car gets 50 miles to the gallon plus you have the 40 mile range you start with then a tank of fuel will take you 390 miles. Not bad. My truck can take me 340 miles at best. And last fall when I drove to the east coast about every 300 miles I was ready to pull over and walk around a bit. 300 miles at 70 mph is just over 4 hours.. I don't knkow many people that can drive over 4 hours straight.

reply to this comment

bestofallcad - 7/11/2008 10:53:40 PM

+1 Boost

bored sorry about the caps, did not even notice it until I was finished with writing it and did not want to start over.

2nd was you said was the American Greed well, this is not only a American thing Greed is World wide, I am am sick of hearing people say the greedy American worker, the Greedy American Auto makers, the greedy, fat, lazy, corporations so on and so on. Greed World wide companys are in business to make money, I just dont understand how people dont consider that Toyota Corp, or Mercedes corp, and so on and so on, do you not think they are Greedy???

reply to this comment

bestofallcad - 7/12/2008 12:34:36 AM

+1 Boost

mercedesbenz00z sorry to say I have owned 2 BMW's in the past a 325i and then a 525i, accutally both BMW where my wifes cars, both of these BMW's we had more car problems with then any other car I have ever owned in my life.

1st the 325i it was in the shop every 3 to 4 months for you name it. Just to name a few problems here is a small list: the radio display went bad 4 times, to the cv joints, to the sun roof visor going off track, to the car blowing fuses, to it stalling on the freeway, to the front power window motors going bad twice, this is just to list a few. Oh by the way we got rid of the car with only 32,000 miles on it.

Then we bought a 525I we thought okay lets see if this is better. Just 2,000 miles into it, the computer that controls the suspension went out, had to have it towed into BMW, the computer they needed to fix it took 2 weeks to get the part in, since the part was on back order. Because this computer part was a problem with the 525's, and by the way this was a quote from the service advisor " We do not recall our cars like the American Car companys do" Which I said to him "Great since you do not want to recall your cars, you are going to make me waite and I will not have my car for 2 weeks, so you can say you do not have recalls!! and you know this a problem with this car." "Some Customer service." After that it only went in the shop another 4 times for other problems the 525 was a better car then the 325 however both BMW's worst cars I ever owned. Thank God both of these cars we only had a 2 year lease so both cars are gone.

So you say I only no Cadillac for a Luxury car's well I am glad since I have owned a Cadillac cts 2003 which I only change the oil about every 12,000 miles and that is all, which when traded my 03 cts it had 67,000 miles I then bought my 04 Escalade which never went in the shop either for any thing but oil changes, I had to put a battery, and I had to put tires on it, I traded it with 76,000 miles, for my 2008 CTS, what a car the 08 CTS is WOW, it is Great car. I am just getting ready to change the oil it has almost 16,000 miles now.

I am sorry I am not brain washed like you commented. I would take a GM car any day because of the Great GM cars I have owned.

Last thing mercedesbenz00z everyone blames the goverment for all the troubles they may have, well it is all up to us to make things better, it is like voting your vote counts, so it is up to each and everyone to make a difference, not just one single entity.

2nd thing is the current economic problems are caused by the Real estate market, which the down fall of the real estate market, which the blame does go to THE BANKS.....

Example 2 years ago almost any one could get a home loan. Banks where so librial giving out loans. With their critiea for obtaining a home loan 2yrs ago, if you had a breath and had a 620 credit score you could have gotten a loan for a home. So called investors where obtaining 100% loans on 2nd, 3rd, 4th

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