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Has Consumer Reports Tarnished Toyota's Reputation?

Agent009 submitted on 10/17/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 4:08 PM
from: www.autospies.com

[39] user comments | category: Misc News

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Has Consumer Reports Tarnished Toyota's Reputation?

Toyota responded today to the Consumer Reports decision to no longer recommend Toyota and Lexus models based on past performance history. Pretty much as expected, the response reiteration of the current models on the list with no attempt to rebuttal Consumer Reports reliability allegations.

While there maybe nothing wrong with the stance, it does make us wonder if that is enough for current and future customers to restore faith in the brand. After all Toyota built their very foundation on the hallmark of legendary quality and reliability.

Did, the Consumer Reports decision may actually signal that they are no longer are the best but better than average.

Did Toyota go far enough with simply a restatement of their current strengths, or should they have taken the extra step of explaining how this can be prevented in the future?

You tell us.

Press Release:

Toyota, Lexus and Scion models collectively led the industry with the greatest number of models, 17, ranked "Most Reliable" in this year's Consumer Reports Reliability Survey. With dozens of models from three dozen makes vying for a spot onthe magazine's "Most Reliable" list, only 39 were chosen. Toyota, Lexus and Scion models accounted for 44 percent of the list.

Toyota, Lexus and Scion earned three of the top six places among most reliable makes. Collectively they ranked third place in reliability among all automakers.

"Over all, this survey reflects well on our products," said Toyota Motor Sales Executive Vice President Jim Lentz. "However, we're taking measures every day to continue to sharpen quality and enhance customer satisfaction."

Comments:

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DaHarder - 10/17/2007 4:27:24 PM

+5 Boost

Without a Doubt!

Many of the same people who drive Toyota products, which are largely little more than 'driving appliances', are the same one's who read CR...

DAMAGE DONE!

reply to this comment

adamsaf723 - 10/17/2007 8:08:54 PM

0 Boost

Seeing as how nobody wants a Subaru, and domestics aren't most people's top picks, I would say NO.

DaHarder - 10/17/2007 8:22:58 PM

+3 Boost

Even still, It is unquestionably Toyota who has damaged their own reputation.

C.R. is simply the messenger - Deal With It!

gryphon - 10/17/2007 4:31:29 PM

+3 Boost

It's unfortunate that Toyoya did not try to take the bull by the horns and address the issue directly. Their loyal customers deserved better, as does the public at large.

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Agent009 - 10/17/2007 4:45:44 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

Well considering that reliability appears to be the bedrock that the consumer banked on. I would have expected some type of address from them. But this effectively ignored the issue. Now what would happen if JD Power did the same?

Toyota is an excellent company and a lot of the scrutiny is unfair, but when you reach the top everyone is gunning at you. Be prepared to defend yourself.

rg12345 - 10/18/2007 7:26:19 AM

+2 Boost

agree with 009 on this issue
the reliability of Toyoyoyota has the same importance of, as an example, the BMW sportiveness's; that's why the new m3 is so much under knife, same with toyota now.

answer - 10/17/2007 4:40:09 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

A history of building quality automobiles afforded Mercedes to keep its brand image even through times of poor reliabilty data.

Surely then history will also afford Lexus to continue with its reputation of quality in much the same manner.

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DaHarder - 10/17/2007 4:44:00 PM

+1 Boost

I don't feel that Lexus has anything to worry about here, it's Toyota (and the vehicles sold through those channels) that will suffer as a result of this 'slip in quality'.

Note: I've heard many-a-Camry owner voice concerns that the new Altima/Accord seems so much nicer inside than their cars... Hmmm?

Agent009 - 10/17/2007 4:47:38 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Lexus probably won't be affected. (Toyota may not be either) but it will be interesting if any other rating firms follow suit. Then the voice of the many may have an affect.

enthusiastx11 - 10/18/2007 12:18:32 PM

+1 Boost

'A history of building quality automobiles afforded Mercedes to keep its brand image even through times of poor reliabilty data."

this is a bit simplistic. mercedes' image was based on several things...building very stylish cars for many years, leading safety innovations, and performance technology. quality was another factor. and when that slipped for a couple of years (2002-2004), mercedes had other strengths to fall back on.

montyz81 - 10/17/2007 4:55:06 PM

-4 Boost

It's time for Toyota to step aside anyhow!

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Bmw8ter - 10/17/2007 5:23:23 PM

+1 Boost

Please....Toyota did this by themselves; not CR.

I'd like to take a minute to thank Toyota for the manufacturers defect on my 2007 Toyota Camry V6 XLE.

Price paid - $30,000 Personal Value - $Crap

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S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 5:43:18 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

I've read some bad things on the new Camry... I'm sorry. You should've bought an Altima instead.

Bmw8ter - 10/17/2007 6:28:49 PM

+4 Boost

Houstoncutie.......I bought it practically brand new...150 miles were put on it to transport it to the dealer because the local dealer didn't have to color I wanted(they drive the car if it's under a certain distance). Here's my log I kept because I was betting on a lemon law for the car.

Issues with New Toyota -

6/25/07 - 2007 Toyota Camry XLE V6 fully loaded purchase finalized on June 25th 2007. Approximately $3,000 was put down towards the purchase of this vehicle, as well as, a trade in value of our previous vehicle valued at $11,000+ as per negotiations made with the dealer.

6/28/07 – Car slipped a little bit (I didn't realize traction was lost) while passing another vehicle on a wet road; VSC light and check engine light come on. VSC refused to disengage after traction was regained. Car started to shake like it was out of alignment. Had to pull over on the side of the road and restart the car. Everything back to normal after restart. No lights are lit on the dash. Salesman *********** notified of incident.

6/30/07 – While driving to **********, hazard light, VSC light, Check engine light come on for no apparent reason. Lights remain on even after restarting the car. Salesman ********** notified of incident and advises us to bring to the dealer to get checked. Error code found regarding engine misfire. Mechanic says this hasn't happened to any of the cars they've received at the shop. Codes wiped and we're told if it happens again, bring the car back for a thorough inspection.

7/03/07 – Wife goes out to car to head to work. Starts car and hazard light, VSC light, and check engine light come on. We head to the dealer as advised to do from the last visit. Something occurs while wife is driving the car that causes the car to temporarily lunge forward as if the brakes may have been enabled temporarily. Car is dropped off to the service department for the second time for the same issues.

7/03/07 - Car went into shop 7/03/07 while Toyota performs tests at the direction of the manufacturer, to hopefully fix the current engine misfire issue. Dealer unable to fix the problem. They were directed by the manufacturer to take a screenshot of the error code and send to the manufacturer. Car was at dealer for approximately 4 days.

9/01/07 – Car started up in the A.M. because my wife and I were going out. The engine sounded as if a cylinder might be misfiring, but no dash lights have come on.

9/03/07 – Car is started up in the A.M. and the VSC and Check engine light are illuminated. We have to wait until after Labor Day to have the car serviced.

9/04/07 – The car still has the check engine light illuminated and is taken to ********** for another look, yet again. After sitting for some time, there are no issues with the car but the computer does register a cylinder #6 misfire according to the service department. The misfire can't be duplicated, and I'm informed from ****

Bmw8ter - 10/17/2007 6:35:03 PM

+4 Boost

at ******** that they've contacted a specialist in California, who advised them to hold the car overnight and do a cold start in the morning to see if the problem persists. They think it has something to do with the first 60-90 seconds after the car is started. This is the 3rd time the car has been to the dealership for engine misfiring.

9/05/07 – ********* has informed us that the specialists thinks it may have something to do with a fuel injector to cylinder #6, and that they're going to have to hold the car until Friday 9/07/07 while they perform tests. I've also asked Toyota to test the VSC system, as this system operated improperly back in June when the car lost traction on wet road. The VSC had engaged the brakes but failed to disengage. ******* said they will test that system as well.

9/10/07 – ********* has informed me that they believe the issue was with a lifter for cylinder 6. That exhaust gases weren't being expelled by one of the valves and the cylinder was basically choking on the gases. The parts to fix the engine won't be in until the 12 th or 13th. The car has been in the shop a total of 7 days for this particular problem and 11 days total since owning the car(this may not reflect actual working days).

Total repair cost - $1400+ under warranty.

I'm gonna end up taking this car because it's faster than my beater stang and is loaded with all the goodies you can get; and I'm gonna get my wife "another" new car.

Bmw8ter - 10/17/2007 6:49:01 PM

+2 Boost

I have less than 3k on the odometer...too.

henbmw - 10/17/2007 11:32:44 PM

+1 Boost

Wow surprising stuff. Thanks for the imput, bmw8ter

Bmw8ter - 10/17/2007 11:41:26 PM

+1 Boost

No problem.....we're now experiencing "over rev" issues on the engine; something that apparently the 4 cyl. engines are extremely prone to. They supposedly haven't figured out how to fix the over revving.

r15mohd - 10/18/2007 10:26:59 AM

+1 Boost

as much as many may complain...no other car company has as many "reliable" and "recommended" vehicles as does the toyota brand.

now with these minor setbacks, everyone can be assured that they will address the situation thoroughly and come back with a uproar.

they've been great at what they do because they know how to do it, they let a little competition sidetrack them, but i dont expect them to fall due this. it will only make them stronger in making sure these issues dont happen again.

AgentOrange - 10/17/2007 5:40:52 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

"So let it be written, so let it be done"

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S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 5:44:41 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

It won't "tarnish" their reputation. But it has certainly made a dent.

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answer - 10/17/2007 6:07:12 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Forgive me, maybe I don't understand this thing.

Was looking at prior vehicle history a benefit only given to Toyota/Lexus? And is it just this benefit that is being discontinued by CR?

If that is the case, doesn't this just mean new Toyota/Lexus vehicles won't be given the benefit of the doubt?

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Will_ - 10/17/2007 6:37:13 PM

+4 Boost

What's truly a shame is the number of people rejoicing at this type of information. I think answer described it perfectly a few comments above:

"A history of building quality automobiles afforded Mercedes to keep its brand image even through times of poor reliability data."

And Toyota's reliability data isn't even as bad as Mercedes' got in the '90s...yet anyways. To not "recommend" Toyota products is really a statement about the quality of the entire automobile industry. I think CR did this after taking on so much criticism about being chummy with the Toyota Corporation, when they were merely on reporting conclusive and concrete reliability data.

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S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 9:43:22 PMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

I disagree. A good publication will stand its own if it is indeed correct. In this case, Toyota's build quality has been slipping lately. Perhaps not their mechanical reliability, but their construction has been less than stellar. The Edmunds.com/insideline article on the long-term Camry LE V6 is a perfect example.

mini22 - 10/17/2007 7:43:13 PM

+3 Boost

You know what-how about the fact the CR simply tells it like it is and has no favorites. CR was not saying all Toyota products. Never the less if the build quality on a Camry is no longer good enough then CR has the right to no longer recommend. It is interesting that Toyta just recalled over 400,000 Japan made vehicles today.I think they are going through the growing pains at being such a large company. Perhaps the drive to be #1 in sales world wide has created a negative culture in terms of the ultimate quality.If I were a strictley Toyota person and placed a lot of confidence in CR I would consider Honda.

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S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 9:44:14 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

Hondas drive better, too...

S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 9:44:38 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Is that the only way you could think to respond to this article?

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EL34 - 10/17/2007 8:30:45 PM

-2 Boost

American & German car fans, it's time to rejoice :)

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jt716 - 10/17/2007 8:38:32 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

It made a huge dent because i know lots of ppl down here buy a toyota for reliability. When purchasing the fusion lots of ppl told us its a ford so it must be full of problems n stuff. I didnt really care for the reliability just that it handles beautifully. And I really like the exterior...interior not so much but still thats where they can make an improvement in the next fusion. After seeing this people finally believe me that toyotas are now like any other manufacture and not as good as they used to be in reliability.

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S4cabriofoxone - 10/17/2007 9:45:34 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

Or, everyone else has gotten better? Something to chew on.

LexusGS - 10/17/2007 11:06:43 PM

+3 Boost

I have a 2006 Lexus GS300, and I only had a minor rattle that was repaired. Its a shame that there are other "minor" problems that are not of a big deal that can really bring down the GS sedan rankings. Oh well.

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TheGenius - 10/17/2007 11:54:19 PM

+1 Boost

Consumer report has not tarnished Toyota's reputation, Toyota has tarnished its own reputation in pursuit of sales. New Tundra blowing its engine , new ES suffering from unintended acceleration. RX recalled for pedal issues, Pruis recall etc, etc.. Toyota was recall king last year, and stuff like that never used to happen on this scale. In sheer pursuit of sales something has to give!

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GodfatherSHM - 10/18/2007 8:29:07 AM

+4 Boost

I am confused to why people are actually thinking that this is so huge...no car company should get an AUTOMATIC recommend, it is the responsibility of a company like CR to re-evaluate each year all of the cars. It is ashame that the titles of all of these press releases are so misleading, like 009 included, 44 percent of the list was stil Toyota Corp cars, they made up almost half of that list of most relieable. Their quality is still considered high, and their reputation is no where near impacted. I also agree with the statement, "everyone else HAS been upping their quailty", and as a consumer that is great for us, for the price these cars cost today, we should be getting better than crap looks and blah interiors.

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Tripleonefive - 10/21/2007 12:37:57 PM

+1 Boost

CR doesnt mean anything along with JD Powers or Shady Powers. JDP is a pay for play company and CR is a bunch of morons drunk with power . The only reliable sources are Motor Trend Edmunds and KBB. Toyota and Honda make the most reliable cars with the highest build quality and best resale. GM FOrd and Chysler have a long way to go.

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