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Hillary proposes 55mpg fuel-economy standard by 2030

omarrana submitted on 11/05/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 4:00 PM
from: www.egmcartech.com

[45] user comments | category: Misc News

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Hillary proposes 55mpg fuel-economy standard by 2030

While the Senate voted to increase fuel-economy standards to 35 mpg by 2020 in June, Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton today proposed hiking the standards to 55 mpg by 2030, and probably pissing of automakers even more.

Ford, GM, Chrysler and Toyota have shown their support for a lighter increase that would call for the fuel-economy standards to raise between 32 to 35 mpg by 2022.

To go along with her new proposal, Clinton pledged to offer... Read Article

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autopro - 11/5/2007 6:30:22 PMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

lets put her a** on a vespa.

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EL34 - 11/6/2007 3:27:49 AM

+1 Boost

lol

EnnNorak - 11/6/2007 9:05:34 AM

0 Boost

Hillary, stop attacking motorists and the auto industry. CAFE will achieve nothing. Only a gas tax will reduce demand and control pump prices without government price controls. The good thing about Hillary is that her husband was the best (and smartest) president of modern times and will obviously be available in the background with his sound advice.

ICON - 11/6/2007 12:26:37 PM

+4 Boost

There is NO good thing about Hillary.

This is simply more posturing by a serial sycophant...

The market demands will push the fleet average past 35 MPG well before 2020,without any meddling by her or other overly intrusive politicos.

bluedart - 11/7/2007 10:36:22 AM

+1 Boost

let's propose all politicians stop being hipocrite by the year of 2010. and if hillary think that's good for the environment let's propose she works for the auto industry so she can put her whole effort and energy into making that happens

cdoke - 11/5/2007 9:33:15 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

I suggest that before you entertain the idea of spouting such hackneyed propaganda about the treatment of the oil industry by certain politicians again that you read Oil and Gas Financial Journal and find out the truth.

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cdoke - 11/5/2007 10:18:47 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Oh...goodness. It's gone.

Aut disce aut discede, I suppose.

cdoke - 11/6/2007 4:03:36 PMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Ah idiotic de-boosting. The above post of mine was a response to one that no longer exists. Be that as it may, it dos not change the point, George Bush has not enacted nor proposed legislation that is structurally beneficial to oil companies. Many of the DOE research projects have been cancelled- which is fine (minus perhaps the destruction of useful knowledge in the process) as oil companies have been making enough money to do the research themselves.

All one must do is read within the first 5 pages or so of O&GFJ to find out all laws that pertain to the oil industry.

The only thing that Bush has done which is indirectly beneficial to oil companies is increase the staff at the BLM. They are extremely understaffed at the moment.

Incidentally, contrary to what some semi-retarded journalist might tell you Halliburton is NOT an oil company- they do not produce a single drop of oil. They do have divisions that perform services for oil companies, but they are not an oil company.

lexusis350 - 11/5/2007 9:17:54 PM

+4 Boost

Hitlary is a moron. She's going to put a lot of stress on a lot of car companies because SHE believes in Global Warming.

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holmstar - 11/6/2007 11:32:31 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Global warming is not in question. It has already been proven to be fact. The global average temperature is rising. What is not proven is the reason for warming. Please get your facts straight.

r_driver04 - 11/6/2007 2:59:02 PM

+3 Boost

We can't stop global warming. It's gonna happen no matter what we do. We can only hope to reduce its' affects. Maybe we should all ride Vespas and or take a bus.

lexusis350 - 11/6/2007 5:43:47 PM

+2 Boost

Oh, sorry. I believe in Global Warming, but I highly doubt humans are to blame. Hillary thinks that it's my fault for driving a non-hybrid/non-electric car. I should have been more specific.

Rupert - 11/6/2007 6:24:06 PMView My AgentSpace

-3 Boost

Why do you believe differently to the UN council on climate change which is 95% sure that global warming is man made? Are you an unknown expert?

Wait, were you the guy who said you wouldn't do anything about global warming as you believe your God will save you?

S4cabriofoxone - 11/6/2007 11:43:07 PMView My AgentSpace

+5 Boost

And Hilary travels by helicopter or by airplane, I assume? Very eco-friendly.

markymark - 11/5/2007 9:19:41 PM

+8 Boost

I owe all of my comments on this site to Al Gore for inventing the internet.

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EL34 - 11/6/2007 3:29:47 AM

+2 Boost

Al also invented the melting iceberg with a polar bear stranded on it as it floats into New York harbor.

M35MT - 11/6/2007 8:04:13 AMView My AgentSpace

+3 Boost

Let's not forget about Man-Bear-Pig...

pchera01 - 11/5/2007 10:41:02 PM

0 Boost

its good thought, to be pratical is not easy, to make these kind of statement, she is a moron

reply to this comment

iamdabest1 - 11/6/2007 12:48:22 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

since shes sooo brilliant maybe she should try to make a car that can do it............

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moto - 11/6/2007 12:49:38 AM

+4 Boost

I'm no supporter of Clinton, but her proposal isn't that outlandish of an effort. Think about it, folks. As a scientist and manager, I've seen greater things accomplished.

Kennedy proposed that the USA put a man on the moon and return him safely to earth in one decade. The federal government offered aerospace companies research grants, NASA organized the programs to get the job done, and the goal was accomplished. The technology developed in the space programs spun off billions of dollars of profitable development that everyone globally takes for granted - telecommunications and high-strength lightweight materials being the most obvious ones that come to mind. It was among the best investments in technology of the late 20th century, right up there with Senator Gore's legislations that funded electronic communications research and the subsequent sharing of the internet technologies for commercialization that we take for granted today.

(SIDE NOTE: Gore was, in fact, one of the key players who created the internet as we know it today. Scorn thrown at him based on the misunderstanding that he "invented" it only shows ignorance on the person making the smart-ass comment. I'm looking at you, marky.)

Fast forward 45 years to today and a bunch of geeks in front of their computers scoff at government grants that would pay for whatever technology developments might be necessary to meet the relatively simple goal of increasing fuel economy of land-based vehicles in 23 years. I'm ashamed that the so-called world superpower nation is so pathetic that its industrialists don't want to even TRY to achieve new goals. They're too busy lining their pockets with quick money made from outsourcing deals.

Also consider the rate of growth of fuel prices. If the current rise in prices is any indication of the turbulent markets ahead of us, we will wish for 55mpg vehicles much earlier than 2030.

Automakers would be stupid not to accept the challenge. Do they not realize how elastic the vehicle demand is when fuel prices rise?

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t_bone - 11/6/2007 1:05:26 AM

+2 Boost

What I find funny about the comments is that you're the only one mentioning the slight detail that 2030 is TWENTY THREE YEARS away. If we're still driving reciprocating air-breathing POS engines in 23 years we're going to be having more problems than the environment...like truly being a 3rd-rate has-been nation.

XYZZ - 11/6/2007 3:53:22 AM

+1 Boost

considering that current ICEs are only 20-25% efficient, there is A LOT OF ROOM for gains in efficiency and mpg.

M35MT - 11/6/2007 8:07:22 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

t_bone, agreed.

By 2030 gasoline should not be our primary fuel for automobiles. We need to start from the ground up. Hydrogen.

I dont hate Hillary for comments like this, I hate her because she is a socialist moron.

r_driver04 - 11/6/2007 3:01:08 PM

+2 Boost

In retrospect, they also said we'd be piloting our own personal aircraft by now too. Remember the Jetsons?

theoptimisticpessimist - 11/6/2007 7:30:45 PM

+1 Boost

Moto, thank you for your insightful and intelligent comments.

neutral - 11/6/2007 9:29:09 PM

+2 Boost

AlexApex,

Not to be demeaning, but ICE's get nearly 30% thermal efficiency or slightly more. Not only that, Carnot efficiency is something like 60% (the maximum possible with an ICE). Truth of the matter is, fuel economy gains can be made through things like lighter materials, ActiveFuelManagement and Variable Valve Timing.

M35MT - 11/6/2007 8:10:12 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

So with all these tax credits, and obvious increased spending in 'social' services (over paid, under producing programs) our governement will further push itself into debt.

reply to this comment

r15mohd - 11/6/2007 8:46:22 AM

+1 Boost

RON PAUL FOR PRESIDENT...

Hilary is an idiot and has no grounds on issues as she's always flip-flopping...

m35t...thats exactly what the car companies need to do, "re-invent the wheel of hydrogen/hybrid/li-ion technology"

reply to this comment

JWalkerLegrande - 11/6/2007 10:53:17 AM

+3 Boost

55 Mpg actually does not sound that tough, most modern diesels achieve that today at reasonable costs. I seriously doubt that increasing CAFE standards will change buyer preferences though. I hate to say this but charging 9 bucks for a gallon would give a HUGE incentive to car makers to produce more efficient engines/cars. TODAY

You have to admit that you would not vote for anybody with such propaganda, so no need to worry, nothing will change.

reply to this comment

Neverfollow - 11/6/2007 12:06:17 PM

+4 Boost

"Random Thoughts"

Well, okay. Once again class we must look to Europe for inspiration. Gas is close to two euro per liter. Do the math in your head kids and try to keep up okay?

Over half of the cars sold in Europe are diesel powered. Do they get 55mpg? Only the very smallest and lightest do. Are we destined to become a nation of "Smart" cars? Roger, you bastard, you did it again!

Americans must be ready to give up the giant SUV Are we ready to put an end to urban sprawl? I doubt commuting will be near as much fun in a 2 seat plastic car the size of a toilet stall. Are we ready to watch GM, Ford, and Cerberus crumble before our very eyes as they scramble to adjust? Are we ready as a nation to absorb the economic hit from that?

Does 55 mpg apply to hydrogen powered vehicles as well?

By the time we get 23 years further down the road, I think the internal combustion engine will be dead anyway. Funny thing is, I think every other politician believes that as well. In fact, if they blurted out some politically correct BS today about making the automakers get 55mpg CAFE in some date far into the future, they might just get some votes and not ever have to worry about doing a thing...........hey wait a minute.

Neverfollow - 11/6/2007 11:18:03 AM

+3 Boost

Oh here we go again, another politician that want's to pick on an easy target that people love to hate.

Funny, I don't see her attacking the "MOB" (merchants of death) squad. Hands off the Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms industries but lets go after those rich car guys again. They look like there having way too much fun!

reply to this comment

SteedPub - 11/6/2007 11:43:59 AM

+5 Boost

All politics aside, the mathematics behind such a boast of 55mpg AVERAGE gets overlooked.

It is not being proposed that there is a car or cars that get up to 55mpg, it is being proposed that the fleet AVERAGE be 55mpg.

Think about that in terms of todays fleet.

To accomplish this, there have to be LOTS of cars that get 60, 70 and 80 mpg to offset the commercial and truck vehicles that would be getting only 30, 40, and 50 mpg.

Let that sink in and do the math, then you see how ridiculous it all is.

reply to this comment

1970toyotamarc - 11/6/2007 8:25:59 PM

+3 Boost

Oil hit $97 a barrel today. 'nuff said

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cdoke - 11/6/2007 9:31:09 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

It isn't quite that simple. First, the oil futures market is in backwardation. The market is behaving in a manner consistent with this expectation- i.e. they are producing as much as possible at the present moment.

Were higher prices expected in real terms, because firms with finite resources intertemporaly allocate their production, we would expect them to withhold production until such time as the price increased. This is simply not what is happening.

Now the heart of the issue is that price is not by itself necessarily an indicator of scarcity. Were you to look at the price in real terms of mineral commodities as a function of time despite increasing scarcity due to extraction you will see decreasing prices in real terms. The reason for this is primarily technology. There is this battle between scarcity and techology and for the past 100 years in general technology has won.

Oil is slightly more difficult, as in real terms the price has overall been flat. However, there is an issue in that there should really be a quality correction to the deflation indexes used to determine the real prices. What you then find are rising prices in real terms.

Interestingly, these high prices are ultimately detrimental to OPEC. The series of countervailing forces unleashed by the market when prices are high also serve to destroy OPEC's market power. This has happened before. During the 1970's embargo, OPEC's production decreased, but world production increased. Their market share receded. Screw the market and it will screw you right back.

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cdoke - 11/6/2007 9:40:02 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

One more thing, if you really want to find out more about all of this I suggest "On Borrowed Time?" by Dr. John Tilton also "International Energy Markets" by Dr. Carol Dahl. Both of which are professors at the Colorado School of Mines, in fact Dr. Dahl is interim Department head of the Economics department. They are well known experts in these matters. Their books are available on Amazon. Dr. Dahl in fact recently did a study for a group of companies or the Department of Energy (I don't remember) pertaining to oil prices. Incidentally, everything that is going on in the market, including high prices, can be explained by market mechanisms.

0to60 - 11/7/2007 10:51:03 AM

-3 Boost

Bush is an idiot; him as well as his administration is corrupt. I blame him partially for the rise in gas prices is due to that corruption.

Almost anyone other than him would be a breath of fresh air!

I cant wait to see how many of you jump all over me for those comments!!

Political parties are a horrible idea and it only hurts americans that we have to stand behind one of them. They set up a new class system and no matter what they believe in, because you are apart of that " class" you will support it no longer how corrupt they are. And the continuous support of Bush is the proof of such however this holds true for both Dems and Reps. Nothing will be acheived until they do away with the political party system. It doesnt work! Thats why Bush is president, the economy sucks, and america is in worst shape than it was during the Clinton administration.

reply to this comment

chuck717 - 11/7/2007 12:08:03 PM

+2 Boost

Oto> It is not a question of jumping on you. The world has agendas, the G8 countries are consumers of a lot of the worlds resources and they have to protect the trillions of dollars that flow back and forth.
It doesn't matter who gets in, the game is already set up the fix is in.
The power players do what they have to for big business and they in turn keep the masses happy as possiable with plenty of food, a decent enough pay and freedom of expression to a point btw.
6 billion people on earth everybody has a take, really the whole thing could actually be must worse, get three people together 2 probally don't like you magnified this by all the souls on this plantet it is a wonder we still have a plantet?

chuck717 - 11/7/2007 11:55:30 AM

+2 Boost

2030> Look nobody knows what the heck happen ten minutes ago in this world let alone 23 yrs from now?
What i do know back when her husband was president in the first term why didn't they push for 35mpg by the year 2000???

reply to this comment

0to60 - 11/8/2007 3:04:17 PM

+2 Boost

This is a BMW site...

This is a republican site...

Bush is still an idiot...

reply to this comment

S4cabriofoxone - 11/8/2007 9:12:21 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

I cannot wait until November 2008. I am being completely honest--that's too far away. He has tarnished our country's funds, our country's economy, our country's image...

S4cabriofoxone - 11/8/2007 9:11:35 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

That's an amazing picture.

reply to this comment

BMW740Z4 - 11/9/2007 10:50:05 PM

+1 Boost

So Nurse Rachet is spewing vacant promises of what "should be" again....and this is news? How does anyone take this retard seriously.

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