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Why Is BMW Backing Away From Performance? The M3 CSL Bites The Dust!

Agent009 submitted on 08/26/2008 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 2:26 PM
from: www.carmagazine.co.uk

[58] user comments | category: Misc News

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Why Is BMW Backing Away From Performance? The M3 CSL Bites The Dust!

What is going on at BMW, and why?

First there was news out of Germany last week that BMW had decided not to compete against the Audi R8. The reason was simply because there was no need to pursue such a small but visible sector of the market. Audi scores 1 and the BMW bean counters score a 0. So with a simple slash of the cost cutting knife, the future of a possible M1 rebirth has been cancelled for the foreseen future.

Now BMW has never been know to give up a good fight, and in days gone by the R8 would not have gone unanswered. But something has changed for the worse.

Car Magazine out of the UK is now reporting today the yet another casualty of cost cutting has surfaced. The ultra high performance and light weight M3 CSL slated for summer of 2009 has also bit the proverbial dust.

Is BMW backing away from it’s performance heritage, the very soul of every one of its cars? Is this leaving the door for others to take the torch, and blaze a new path into the performance sector?

While we can’t say for sure what the future holds BMW for the rest of the year, the budgets are clearly are being affected to the point where the value of image cars for the brand are now in question.

Mark yet the passing of yet another still born dream, the M3 CSL.

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WayneDash - 8/26/2008 2:41:16 PM

+2 Boost

Wow! Hopefully they are cutting cost for the production CS model.

*crosses fingers*

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B7FAN - 8/26/2008 3:58:04 PM

-9 Boost

the CS model is crap i think its a big mistake. they need to return the 8 series coupe to today's standard and luster thats what i want them to do because the CS is still not definite I just hope they HACK that too. I love BMW's and their heritage but that CS is crap SORRY MY BMW FANS JUST SPEAKING MY MIND

GreenPlease - 8/26/2008 4:12:17 PM

-6 Boost

OH SNAP!

Click the link and read the end of the article:

"For the full story on the death of the M3 CSL – and its nemesis from Audi, the planned RS5..."

The RS5 got killed as well? Shame... that's a car that could've had some soul..

Agent009 - 8/26/2008 4:20:43 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

From what I see so far, the RS5 still has a green light. Right now Audi is giving no indication any model rollback due to any issues.

theoptimisticpessimist - 8/26/2008 5:32:40 PM

+5 Boost

"they need to return the 8 series coupe"

Please, the 8er was slow, overweight and a sales failure. I remember driving the 840ci and thinking "wow you really need the V12". how many cars do you think that about?

Agent004 - 8/26/2008 11:21:00 PMView My AgentSpace

-2 Boost

Doesn't the M6 compete against the R8?

1dott8 - 8/27/2008 9:59:04 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

Agent004 - the M6 is a GT while the R8 is considered a super car. not comparable.

sector - 8/27/2008 1:15:36 PM

+1 Boost

If M6 competes with R8 then Rosie O'Donnell just competed with Monica Bellucci.

Kraut_god - 8/28/2008 7:38:20 AM

0 Boost

bmw is crap. cheap looking plastic cars.

HSCenterconsole - 8/26/2008 3:01:19 PM

+4 Boost

I hope this news isn't true. A light weight M3 in my book is a winner.

reply to this comment

GreenPlease - 8/26/2008 4:10:20 PM

0 Boost

Agreed. Hopefully they will invest in light-weighting the entire E9X model range. The investment needed to bring the M3 CSL to market could probably net CFRP hoods, CFRP trunks, thin wall Al exhausts, and start stop for every E9X model.

BMW probably made a very rational decision and said "Look, we can either spend $X and produce a CSL variant, of which we will only sell ~500, or we can spend the same $X and take 150lbs of every E9X in our product range and move closer to those damn EU and CAFE regulations..."

Its a loss for the enthusiast and, hopefully, a win for the everyday high end consumer.

WorldofLuxury - 8/26/2008 7:08:01 PM

+4 Boost

I agree. Tuning a car is pretty easy when compared to a company's ability to lighten it strategically.

Does anyone know why there's a hole in front of all M3 CSL's? I'm guessing that it's similar to those hooks they put in front of race cars. (pretty sure it's not the radar)

GreenPlease - 8/26/2008 10:43:37 PM

+2 Boost

I believe that the hole is for a ram CAI, though one would imagine that the V8 M3 would have two of those...

As to strategically lightweighting a car:

For most components you have two costs: tooling and materials (little engineering for these parts). The tooling will cost the same whether it is used on 500 cars or 10,000 cars, so the latter will obviously be more profitable. Also, a vehicle such as the M3 CSL would demand the use of carbon fiber which is about 5X the cost of CFRP. The former only saves ~5% over the later in terms of weight.

So for the (material) cost of carbon fiber front bumper, hood, and trunk for 500 vehicles, BMW could produce the same components for 2500 regular E9X with CFRP, not to mention that the tooling costs per unit would be 1/5.

ubercool - 8/26/2008 3:24:12 PM

-14 Boost

Never been a fan of beemers anyway, they all look awkward and nerdy...

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HSCenterconsole - 8/26/2008 3:27:27 PM

+10 Boost

It's "Bimmer" not "Beemer" ubercool

CRS2112 - 8/26/2008 4:56:15 PM

+7 Boost

Maybe he is talking about the motorcycles???

Bimmers = cars
Beemers = bikes

Wazz - 8/26/2008 5:37:12 PM

+5 Boost

I don't know where else but in South Africa BMW's are reffered to as Beemers, as in Bee-Em's.

Wazz - 8/26/2008 5:37:58 PM

+4 Boost

Referred* - typo

Rupert - 8/27/2008 5:44:52 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Cars are Bimmers (pronounced Beemer), bikes are Beemers (also pronounced Beemer). It's stupid.

gooch - 8/27/2008 4:04:17 PM

+1 Boost

"Bimmer" is pronounced "Bimmer," not "beemer." There is a difference.

gooch - 8/27/2008 4:05:50 PM

+1 Boost

Bimmer as in swimmer.

E92_M_Power - 8/26/2008 3:42:34 PM

+6 Boost

LoL

reply to this comment

1dott8 - 8/26/2008 3:50:16 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

you can deboost if you want to but bmw needs to put this car into production. with Audi coming out with an S5 evo and the RS5, bmw should really consider the M3 CSL if they do not want Audi to take the throne. competition is what makes these brands who they are.

reply to this comment

E92_M_Power - 8/26/2008 4:01:59 PM

+1 Boost

Are they going to release the S5 evo?

B7FAN - 8/26/2008 4:15:10 PM

+1 Boost

if the CSL is made it may not make it over here to the US it was only made for europe. but with BMW you never know what they have under their belt so Im not stressing that audi will take the crown. The previous CSL was a performer but the latest one if made will blow a lot of cars out of the water.

1dott8 - 8/26/2008 4:26:09 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

i guess we'll have to see about that (wink).

1dott8 - 8/26/2008 4:32:49 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

E92_M_Power - i wish i had a definite answer for your question but it would make sense. a few months back there were talks of the S5 getting a supercharged 6 cyl. with 20 less hp. that would leave room for the S5 evo and then the beast (RS5).

E92_M_Power - 8/26/2008 6:42:25 PM

-1 Boost

1dott8,

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/08/25/rs5-stopgap-audi-gives-sneak-peek-at-s5-evo/

Which means the line up will be S5(354), S5Evo(420) and RS5(470)?

BMW_DRVR - 8/26/2008 7:01:42 PM

+2 Boost

The CSL is a limited production vehicle and not made to compete with the RS. The RS competes with the M3. The 335 with the S5.

M35MT - 8/26/2008 4:27:30 PMView My AgentSpace

+4 Boost

Doesnt really seem like they're necessarily backing away from their heritage, these are very rare/exclusive cars that arent making it along. Easiest way to cut costs is on big projects that dont bring in big revenue.

They just released a V8 M3 that freakin' redlines at 8000rpm! I think they're doin just fine...

reply to this comment

E36er - 8/26/2008 4:34:59 PM

+2 Boost

BMW, Good for you. Taking the high road and breaking away from the German automaker arms race isn't easy. Besides, if you really wanted to "track out" your M3 you could take it to a credible aftermarket tuner such as Dinan.

reply to this comment

cdoke - 8/26/2008 5:13:56 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

I have to say that I am rather surprised by this, as the development costs for such a car are, from a relative standoint, miniscule. I wonder what is going on; I don't necessarilly at this point view this as them stepping away from their heritage however.

reply to this comment

cdoke - 8/26/2008 10:52:02 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

What exactly do those who have deboosted me disagree with?

adamsaf723 - 8/26/2008 5:26:29 PM

+1 Boost

On paper it sounds cool.

But I don't think they really need it. I don't believe BMW is shifting away from Performance, but they realize their market and are putting funds where they can flip a better profit.

reply to this comment

VISO - 8/26/2008 5:48:07 PM

-2 Boost

Here is interesting article that ran recently. Maybe, it might shed some light on the model cutbacks.

Works council: Downturn hurting BMW

Henning Krogh
Automobilwoche
August 25, 2008 11:29 CET

MUNICH -- BMW is in worse shape than the company is acknowledging publicly, according to the head of the automaker's works council.

"Since new cars have been selling sluggishly and with difficulty in recent months, inventories at dealerships have increased tremendously," the chairman, Manfred Schoch, said at a recent company meeting in Munich.

"With a further rise in inventories, one would expect that about 10 percent of dealers would head into insolvency."

Schoch, who also sits on BMW's supervisory board, did not specify whether he meant 10 percent of BMW dealers worldwide, in Europe or only in Germany.

According to the works council's own data, BMW's year-to-date sales are off 8 percent in the U.S., 13 percent in South Africa and 14 percent in Japan compared to the same period a year earlier, Schoch said.

"The vehicles that we produce in Munich, namely the 3 series sedan and wagon, have been hit especially hard by declining sales," Schoch said.

But BMW also is concerned by falling sales for other high-volume models, he asserted. Sales of the 5 series are running "5,000 units below target," while sales of the X3 SUV are 10,000 units under plan, he said.

BMW's executive committee has decided to cut production

In a bid to better balance production and sales, he said, BMW will trim output for the balance of the year. At a recent "crisis meeting" of senior BMW executives in Munich, cuts were allocated by plant and model, he said.

"As our share in Munich, we were hit with a cutback of roughly 3,000 units," Schoch said.

But an extension of the summer shutdown was rejected because a production start for the face-lifted 3 series right after the break was considered essential. "We can't reach the market late with it," Schoch said.

BMW also considered reducing working hours but ruled out that option because of legal and contractual reasons, he said. Instead, workers agreed to reduce the target for time bank hours to 50 hours from 90 hours.

The Working Time Account allows workers to bank full-salary hours that can be used when they are sent home because of temporary production cuts. Additionally, they can go into deficit but must later pay borrowed hours back to BMW.

Schoch also said BMW workers have settled on a wage demand of 7.9 percent for their next contract, which has to be negotiated this fall.

reply to this comment

bmwdrvr - 8/26/2008 7:46:39 PM

+1 Boost

this article is rediculous...to say the least.....BMW's cars every single one of them embodies performance, luxury, and exceptional handling.......not to mention BMW doesnt need to create a competitor for the R8(which is essentially the same concept as the M1 a lamborghini based sports car) It is Audi that hopes to improve its performance image...not BMW...and while Mercedes and BMW have typically fought in previous years in product...a response to an Audi isnt necessary in the slightest...theyve done the R8 once......in fact the M1 wasnt in response to anything other than to get into racing...neither was BMW's M line of cars, nor the fact that since creation BMW's have been known for their performance being better than its rivals.....creating models in response....no

reply to this comment

darzav - 8/27/2008 6:17:06 AM

+4 Boost

Totally agreed. BMW is the benchmark in terms of pure balance of performance and luxury. Mercedes has been the one true competitor till recent Audis. Though for Audi its a swing and miss. The new RS6 will chip away current M5 sales, the upcoming 5-series replacement thus the future M5 will see that fixed. A8 and S8? For all we know BMW could be working up an M7. I dont see why not. there is M versions comming for both the X5 and X6 and are available for nearly the entire BMW range.*except the X3 and 7*

In all honesty. BMW aint backing up from performance and never will. Question is? Who can take BMW's title away. Simple. No-one.

bmwdrvr - 8/27/2008 10:00:46 AM

+2 Boost

my point exactly.....and as far as the RS6 reviews I have read of it say the M5 still has the performance edge and overall is the better performance machine...like in the Car mag review, and a few others...so unless you care about the additional horsepower which may or may not give it a 0-60 advantage the M is still the better car

Heyhuub - 8/27/2008 11:40:40 AM

-2 Boost

@bmwdrv

Please show me the articles where they say the M5 has the performance edge over the RS6.
Because all articles i've read about the RS6 say it trounces the competition in performance and dynamics.

bmwdrvr - 8/28/2008 6:20:09 PM

+1 Boost

sure no problem ill give you the quote and the article.......As a driver’s tool, the M5 is more convincing, has the more engaging power delivery and a more exploitable chassis that still offers huge amounts of grip – if it’s wet just leave the traction control on! It’s also £10k cheaper.................http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-RS6-Avant/?content-block=3

aarononymous - 8/29/2008 11:42:28 PM

+1 Boost

performance is measured in numbers.

enthusiastx11 - 8/26/2008 8:05:11 PM

+1 Boost

how exactly is bmw "backing away from performance?"

they've decided not to make a limited edition of a low volume vehicle.

all bmws still handling wonderfully and have superb engines (specially the twin turbo inline 6). not making a CSL has no impact on that.

reply to this comment

Agent009 - 8/27/2008 9:14:01 AMView My AgentSpace

-5 Boost

5 years ago, BMW would never have let Audi release the R8 unanswered. They have too much pride for that, but something has changed.

enthusiastx11 - 8/27/2008 5:23:44 PM

+1 Boost

agent:

so by your logic, my 335i, and my friends' M5s, are someone less performance oriented?

AdmiralT20 - 8/26/2008 10:20:55 PM

+2 Boost

I still think there will be a CSL. Guys don't forget that the M3 is barely a year old in North American market.
My take is that we will start seeing a flurry of activities by this time next year.

reply to this comment

quizz - 8/26/2008 11:24:26 PM

-1 Boost

It's all about the bottom line. When the good times return, so will the CSL. No big. BMW is not like Porsche, where its reputation is staked out on performance numbers.

reply to this comment

E36er - 8/27/2008 1:27:44 AM

+1 Boost

Interesting article Viso.

reply to this comment

atomicbri - 8/27/2008 8:34:09 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

curious to know what you think? What car takes skills to drive in your opinion then?

reply to this comment

Agent009 - 8/27/2008 9:15:22 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

cptamazing4 is still trying to figure out that self park feature.

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Audiphile - 8/27/2008 9:25:06 AM

+1 Boost

Let me play the devil's advocate here. Isn't the M3 hot enough as it is? For those of us who can't afford or don't want a dedicated "track car", the M3 is a high-performance sedan that can also function as a comfortable, everyday family hauler. A few hundred pounds less weight wouldn't make that much of a difference, would it?

Too bad that BMW isn't planning to build a supercar, though. Perhaps they will change their minds when the economy improves.

reply to this comment

sector - 8/27/2008 1:26:12 PM

+1 Boost

Why all the fuss? just take a standard M3, rip out the truck floor and lining and replace with cardboard, replace trunk lid with plastic, remove the hood, replace with plastic, take out air con, take out the radio, idrive, go dumpster diving for set of used worn out tires, install and perform balancing and alignment(important here you don't want to upset the legendary BMW dynamics), and add the final touch of CSL plastic logos all around, and voala! you're a CSL owner :)

reply to this comment

gooch - 8/27/2008 4:10:16 PM

+1 Boost

The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away.
And soon, the Lord with giveth again.
The CSL will be back.

reply to this comment

huu76 - 8/28/2008 10:59:20 PM

+2 Boost

If the title has 'Lexus' on it, there would've been atleast 100 posts in the first day.

What's BMW's answer for apparently following Lexus?

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