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Mitt Romney Makes An Open Call To Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

Agent009 submitted on 11/20/2008 Official Bell & Ross Timestamp: 9:52:08 AM

46 user comments | Category: New Cars | Source: | SOURCE: www.nytimes.com

IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye.

It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check.

I love cars, American cars. I was born in Detroit, the son of an auto chief executive. In 1954, my dad, George Romney, was tapped to run American Motors when its president suddenly died. The company itself was on life support — banks were threatening to deal it a death blow. The stock collapsed. I watched Dad work to turn the company around — and years later at business school, they were still talking about it. From the lessons of that turnaround, and from my own experiences, I have several prescriptions for Detroit’s automakers.

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Mitt Romney Makes An Open Call To Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

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Agree 100%
— sold2early (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:23:23 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

Mitt Romney's political views are much different from mine but, like sold2early, I have to agree with him 100% on the auto industry issue. He gives sound management advice in this instance. UAW 's vision has extremely short range -- they want to keep the status quo even if it means going completely out of business in the slightly longer run.

If Detroit automakers go belly up, their manufacturing assets will be sold cheap to foreign carmakers who will end up using these facilities to build cars in North America. The only difference is that the unions will end up giving up some of their ill-gotten gains. the unions have fleeced us long enough with their use of strikes as a weapon of blackmail.
— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 11/22/2008 6:28:10 AM | | Votes: 1

If he means Detroit the city...it already is.

If he means the mayor, he is morally bankrupt.
— StarSearch (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:25:26 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Whether it is right or wrong, it very easy for Romney to said let the big 3 go under when his job is not on the line and have plenty of money in the bank to buy a filet mignon every day for lunch while sitting in his big house on his expensive couch and big flat panel tv.

— Brembo (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:31:11 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

you are right
— 1UAW (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 12:53:16 PM | | Votes: 0

THATS NOT MY TAX DOLLARS PAYING FOR HIS FILET MIGNON!!!!
Nor is he asking for tax dollars to continue paying for that because he is out of money or about to be our of money. So he can have all the filet mignons he wants!!!
He has a valid point, especially considering he has seen an american car co. go through this and how it was restored.
However, he is right. A bailout will do nothing to save gm, ford, or chrysler if they are unwilling to change how they do business, which they are not wanting to do.
And they want MY TAX DOLLARS to do so.
If you want to refute his arguement based on who he is, that is fallacious reasoning. And don't take away the mans right to eat filet mignons as he is paying for it and not you!!! (or me)
— toyfan (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 3:00:51 PM | | Votes: 3

Our tax money is paying for his employment in the senate sit. Where do you think the money comes in order to pay the people in the government? You think they're working for free.
— Brembo (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 9:46:18 PM | | Votes: 2

whether his job is the one at risk is irrelevant. This is about right and wrong. Decisions need to made using facts not sentiments and by people NOT under pressure which may misdirect the proper action to take.

As soon as the Big3 get a bailout, everyone else will line up for a free check. We've become a COMMUNIST country overnight. Thanks Clinton, Obama, Franks and Pelosi.

There used to be an opposite to Success... and that was failure, now the antonym for Success is Bailout (the mediocre). The history here tells all that we need to know... for 30 years the Big3 have FAILED and reigned in MEDIOCRITY. Do you think a big check will do ANYTHING to fix the problem? If you do then you clearly (and hopefully) should not be making ANY decisions for the people you work for.

The precedence here is incredibly dangerous for the American Way of Life.

I agree with Romney 100%.
— MeanVulcan (View Profile)

Posted on 11/21/2008 1:45:59 PM | | Votes: 1

Brembo, I don't think Mitt Romney wastes his time watching TV.
— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 11/22/2008 6:32:24 AM | | Votes: 1

Just think we could have had President Mitt Romney and VP Mike Huckabee and we ended up with Bozo Obama and Chia Pet Biden.

:-E
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:37:07 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

Teknik -

This how I'm getting used to it.

I'm urging all Republicans and they do all the work to get out of the military. If another 9/11 happens Obama boy can start up the draft.

I'm urging all Republicans to NOT buy any American Union made products. A list can be found at the UAW website.

Direct all illegal aliens to sanctuary cities like San Francisco, New York City, St. Louis, etc.

You'll be getting used to it!
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 11:13:14 AM | | Votes: -8

EL34 = Sore Loser. Wow, I think some republicans are taking it harder than democrats did in 2000.
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 12:16:03 PM | | Votes: 9

0to60-

I;ve despised Unions ever since when my uncle and aunt crossed a picket line in 1986 to go into a small ggrocery store and wne they came out all 4 tiers on their brand new Cadillac were slashed.

My mother was attacked when here in California we had 70,000 union workers go on strike and she crossed the line and they followed her out to her car and harassed the hell out of her.

The Union workers would never mess with me because they know my boot would end up where the sun doesn't shine for them!
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 1:53:49 PM | | Votes: 0

Dude, "ruined this country"?? Is your life in shambles? Don't you have endless access to free porn, cold beer and football on Sundays?

Yup, only in this great country of ours.

Just remember, Sen. Obama could've made huge "changes" in Chicago, and what happened? Crime went up at an alarming rate on his watch as he was passive on gun control and the death penalty. But ya know, it's not "the cool thing" right now to criticize him or point out his flaws, add in some white guilt and we have what is now known as "The Messiah".
— StarSearch (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 3:30:24 PM | | Votes: 0

Sailor, I am sorry you were given that impression, but 99% of America is honestly not that way.

Comparing a slum of an American city to an utterly poor shantytown of an LDC is not accuate. The abject poverty of a lesser developed country is horrendous compared to even what homeless people in America endure.

I don't know who told you what, but the suburbs of LA are not the same as the suburbs of Dehli or ???. Your chances of being shot anonymously in Miami are probably not as high as what you were told. I've been in the "bad" parts of cities all around the US and Europe...it wasn't so bad. Did you experience the situation, or did you form your opinion based on what some stranger told you?

Think about it...being poor in the USA is exponentially better than being poor in a third world country.

America may not be the best country in the world, but hundreds of thousands from the rest of the world try to get here every year.

I don't see that many leaving...
— 09CTSVforMe (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 9:22:42 PM | | Votes: 4

I guess what I am saying is that any medium to major city anywhere is going to have its "bad" neighborhoods, but the "badness" is going to be relative to other places and to different people.

Yes, there are parts of Miami and LA where you shouldn't walk. I was advised not to go past a certain street in San Francisco once.

But I also walked through areas of Paris, Rome, and Frankfurt where I wouldn't take my wife after dark.

In all cases, I think that those areas are relatively small and contained. All of those cities have positive aspects (some more than others) and beautiful and wonderful experiences.

The best place in the world to live could easily be someplace neither of us has ever been...I just don't know. I do know that experiencing different cultures and countries will give an open-minded person perspective on the pros and cons of where they do live, and I think that experience is something we have in common.
— 09CTSVforMe (View Profile)

Posted on 11/21/2008 8:33:55 AM | | Votes: 2

TheSailor

I havent been to Rio, but I think Dubai is one of the best places to live in if you were rich. It's one of the safest places in the world IMO. Which other place in the world could you walk at 2am in without the fear of anything? I love this fact about Dubai. It also looks much more modern than most cities in the US if not all! and is very globalised.. you'll find people from all over the world! You've been to Dubai and you would see some flaws that an insider like me wouldn't notice... what do you think?
— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 11/21/2008 2:59:58 PM | | Votes: 0

EL 34, what's up with your kind words for Huckabee -- do you prefer a theocracy? Just remember that Iran is a theocracy.
— EnnNorak (View Profile)

Posted on 11/22/2008 6:39:50 AM | | Votes: 1

Let Big 3 go under. Bailout will not do any good, they will still f*&k things up.

They should all go out of business and sell all assets to Japanese and German automakers. Workers will get re-hired, UAW will suck big time, quality will be improved. Problem solved.

Oh... almost forgot, hire UAW to clean toilets for all those workers they intend to make unemployed.
— vladyxa (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 11:40:15 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

vladyxa,
"Let Big 3 go under. Bailout will not do any good, they will still f*&k things up.

They should all go out of business and sell all assets to Japanese and German automakers. Workers will get re-hired, UAW will suck big time, quality will be improved. Problem solved."

Let me guess, you can drive a car and now you are an automtove inudstry expert. Since you are so smart, you must have stumbled upon the research that shows Big3 quality is on-par with Japanese.

So the Big3 will just "f*** things up" eh? Glad to see you are so well connected into the big3 so that you can give us your solid insight.

F*** things up how i ask? The Chevy volt? The Ford Fusion hybrid? The new union deals which save GM alone $4-5 billion a year come 2010? The fact that the big3 factories are amongst the most efficient on the earth?

Quiet down son, go tour big3 facilitie, do REAL, UN-BIASED research and get that Toyota emblem out of your rear end.
— neutral (View Profile)

Posted on 11/23/2008 7:29:47 PM | | Votes: 1

HMMM makes since,

"lets let 4 million americans loss their jobs when unemployment is already at a 16 year high because we just dont like american cars"

JUST PLAIN STUPID
— 1UAW (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 12:51:43 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

No, it makes perfect sense, cmon now. CAPITALISM means we HAVE to support the japanese and korean economies!!

YOU COMMUNISTS YOU!!! (just kidding)

Oh by the way, AIG got $150 billion, Citigroup got $25 billion, and GE has $139 billion of debt guaranteed by the federal government.

God.. talk about anti-detroit bias in this country.

On CNN, they spent about 10 mins being "tough and stern" about the big3 bailout, but then started to talk about how important it was that we made sure to keep Citigroup's bailout well funded, even it it meant we GIVE them more than the $25 billion theyve already got.
— neutral (View Profile)

Posted on 11/23/2008 7:33:36 PM | | Votes: 2

So the same people who have spent us into a nearly trillion dollar deficit, allowed the economy to tank because they lacked the foresight and couldn't see the impending crisis, the same individuals that botched the first bailout package and whom still can't agree on how it should be spent, not to mention the same miscreants that probably received 100s of thousands of dollars in Detroit lobbyist payouts...is criticizing the Big 3 for mis-management and financial imprudence. Forgive me if the latest round of Congressional grandstanding doesn’t leave me sympathetic to either side. What I do know is that the entire United States of America needs to be taught a lesson. Yeah, let Detroit fall on it’s ass…I’m hoping the rest of the country goes with it. We’ve been far too arrogant with our country’s resources and wealth and we continue to believe that the “not me” attitude will somehow personally insulate us from the crisis growing around us. It’s amazing how easy we jump on the bandwagon when it’s not the one on fire…but the minute there is smoke it’s every man for himself. Listening to these ‘lawmakers’ makes you believe that they did not have anything to do with any of this. I mean, how many of those same lawmakers drive Prius’ as opposed to the big gas-guzzling SUVs that are sitting in their driveways and reserved parking spots. How many pork-barrel checks need to be spent for you to realize you getting screwed from both ends. Yeah, the Big 3 need to learn a lesson…let them try and reorganize into a leaner, meaner organization…God only knows we’ve been waiting for our government to do the same.
— Need4Speed (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 12:53:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3

Bravo, Bravo!
— cktoo (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 11:22:40 PM | | Votes: 2

if the big 3 fall, you do know they have business in europe and other countries that will fall as well. The parts suppliers American and abroad will foreclose as well. Can you imagine how many people will lose their homes in this event? Can you imagine many more financial companies will fall since they won't be getting monthly payments from their customers? Some states are already running out of unemployment benefits as it is. People resorting to guns and religion was not a lie. Can you imagine what people will do when they or their kids need to eat?
— 610looper (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 2:00:57 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

people equate bancruptcy with a company going out of business. United Airlines and many other companies have been through here before. Bancruptcy will help them reshape the way business is done. the big 3 do great abroad. Their products aren't terrible. And apart from the SUVs they have great fuel efficiency. Toyota has trucks with terrible gas mileage but people think "Prius" when they think Toyota and not "Tundra" or "Sequoia".

It's sad that GM and the rest are stereotyped as a gas guzzlin companies. Such is not the case.

But, pay a worker $50 or better an hour all the while begging for cash will not solve anything. Let's be honest, if they get the money and continue business as usual, they'll fail. Why wouldn't they? Then we'll be left with the bill and everyone that works there will be unemployed anyway.
— RaulT (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 4:03:41 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

RaulT, you are the first person to show some coherence to reality regarding the fall of the "US auto industry" that I've seen on Internet boards. Thank you!

What in the world makes anyone think that the bankruptcy of the "Big" 3 will mean their non-existence?

They are not willing to jettison their unprofitable ways, brands, employees, or processes.

IF (<---BIG "if") the big 3 were to not able to continue operations under Chapter 11, they WOULD NOT CEASE TO EXIST, NOR WOULD THEIR SUPPLY CHAINS.

Toyota, Honda, BMW, MB, or whomever would do what the Big three need to do themselves...

They would buy them and get rid of that which is not profitable. They would focus resources on that which IS profitable.

Think about it, my auto-minded friends...

If you were [enter operationally functional automaker of your choice here]...what part of GM or Ford or Chrysler would you think is functionally worth maintaining and what would you pay to acquire it?

Let's take GM...

Chevy can consist of low cost cars, high-performance cars, and any range of trucks and SUVs anyone could want. Saturn...I mean Opel...could consist of "World vehicles" and Cadillac could consist of high-end luxury/performance vehicles which already outperform Germany's best.

Why have GMC, Pontiac, Saab, and Buick? They bring nothing to the table in and of themselves. Three brands are all GM needs.

I bet Toyota can see that, and I bet Toyota would buy GM and get rid of the WASTE. They would also streamline the supply chain, get rid of the UAW's overpaid slackers, and make "GM" profitable.

I really bet they would. GM, Ford, and (maybe?) Chrysler will not cease to exist if the US taxpayers don't bail them out. Someone who knows how to run an auto manufacturer will operate the good parts profitably, and jettison the rest.

I would. That is why I don't want our Gov't to bail them out with one penny of my money.

Me for Pres, 2012. Love it.
— 09CTSVforMe (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 9:45:54 PM | | Votes: 1

09CTS...would you buy a car from a bankrupt?company...this is a trick question...It will test your honesty and your intelligence!
— Need4Speed (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:08:57 PM | | Votes: 1

No trick. What bankruptcy do you mean? Chapter 11? it depends on what the restructuring plan is.

Chapter 7? It depends on who buys what assests.

Again...bankruptcy of the big 3 does not mean their ceasing to exist.

BTW...if GM ceases to exist, I have an instant classic in #848 produced Pontiac Solstice. Instant collectible. Wanna buy it?
— 09CTSVforMe (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 10:12:22 PM | | Votes: 1

And while I'm on a roll...

Why does there need to be four+ Chevy dealers in a 15 mile radius?

I'm tired of hearing the dealers cry about how they're getting screwed by the unprofitablity of their manufacturer.

If I can't drive 30 minutes to get to the "local" dealer to get a car that is competetive to other brands...seriously...it isn't competetive.

I'm sorry, but if you are trying to sell me a Malibu or Cobalt for less than the other 3 dealers within a 15 minute drive, maybe you didn't make the best choice of allocation of your resources to start a business.

Hell, ask Troy Aikman of "Troy Aikman's Ford" how easy it is to sell Fords with eight other dealers within driving distance.

The over-abundant dealer network gets no pity from me. I've bought cars from dealers 10, 300, and 1500 miles away from my house...literally. Welcome to the information age, fools! I wouldn't open up shop to sell stuff across the street from a Wal-Mart.

It ain't rocket science, you know.
— 09CTSVforMe (View Profile)

Posted on 11/20/2008 9:59:00 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3

Ok, so why not let BearSterns, Morgan Stanley, although Mitusbish came to the rescue, Washington Mutual and other investement firms fall and file bankruptcy? Legalized gambling and nobody goes to jail. Give me a break, give WallStreet a bailout, but not the Big 3, the laborers always get screwed no matter what the profession. The laborer has no say in defective designs, thats a research/quality control problem and bean counter problem.

French Revolution in America, now that would be something..
— 610looper (View Profile)

Posted on 11/21/2008 4:05:08 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

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Mitt Romney Makes An Open Call To Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

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