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Agent001
I like to go top shelf, where Mama hides the cookies
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57
Of the Asian luxury companies, who will the eventual victor be? Lexus or Infiniti?
Agent001
submitted on 11/11/2007
Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 12:46 PM
from: www.autospies.com
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Tags: Lexus, Infiniti
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Infiniti
Of the Asian luxury companies, who will the eventual victor be? Lexus or Infiniti?
It's been a long hard fought battle between these two formidable opponents, with Lexus presently holding a very healthy lead, on all fronts.
But Infiniti is not standing still.
They are not only building some great new products like the the G37 and EX, but they are gaining momentum with customers mindshare, that they build more of a drivers car than Lexus.
If you think about it, BMW sure has gotten a lot of mileage with that strategy vs. Mercedes.
And with more young people entering the market, shouldn't that be the best mantra to be promoting?
So the question we ask today is- Do they have a rats chance in hell, of ever overtaking Lexus and stealing the crown down the road, or is the game already over?
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Mate
- 11/11/2007 1:13:15 PM
+9 Boost
This is actually a very legit subject. The question for me is, who makes better cars? I believe Infiniti, as of now, makes better models when compared head to head with its Lexus counterparts(with the exception of the QX56 vs. the Lexus LX) Yet, it's Lexus's notoriety and reputation that keeps it ahead of Infiniti in terms of sales. Yet, if Infiniti continue to spit out and come up with newer and better versions of its world beaters such as the G35 and M35/45, we should see a change in the market share in Infiniti's favor. (I would really like to see Infiniti make a S-Class competitor, as well as a luxury GT car to compete with the like of the SL and the 911. IF Infiniti came out with cars such as these, it would greatly heighten Infiniti's image and better establish themselves as a luxury car maker.)
reply to this comment
lexusis350
- 11/11/2007 11:07:19 PM
-1 Boost
I agree. That's also another reason Infiniti is behind in sales compared to Lexus: because they haven't established themselves as luxury vehicles yet.
EnnNorak
- 11/15/2007 1:22:21 AM
+1 Boost
I agree about Infinity as Nissan makes truly good engines. Watch out for the Koreans however as they can beat Japanese prices any day. The Hyundai Genesis should be very interesting with its DOHC V8 power and RWD with LSD.
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 1:24:05 PM
+2 Boost
Hmm..it is true that Lexus is the sales leader of the two brands currently, but Infiniti keeps on winning awards for best residual value (the G and the M both have this) and also car of the year awards from various names. All this will help their image as a luxury brand..and from a company as short as 5 years ago who had a failing lineup and was about to be discontinued made a huge turnaround.
Cars like the FX and EX which are produced exclusively for Infiniti are quite stunning so it shows what they can do. The next M will be great and just in time for the new Q as the people who have been buying M's will move up.
Infiniti is now sold in China, Korea, Russia, Ukraine, the middle east and will moving into the UK soon..so they're not sitting back.
Acura just seems to be floundering
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JUGNU
- 11/11/2007 1:26:58 PM
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+2 Boost
Inifinti is one of my fav company but i still think Lexus is long way ahead and Infiniti has to do a lot of work/investment to reach where Lexus is now.
They also doesn't compete directly with Lexus because Lack of/different types of models.
Like there is no ES,LS,GX and SC series competitor from Infiniti.They r also unlike Lexus nearly non-existent outside USA.
JUGNU
reply to this comment
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 1:32:13 PM
+2 Boost
Infiniti said no more FWD models, so they will not compete with the ES. A new flagship model will come out in a couple years (Q50) to go head to head with the LS. The SC hardly sells, there is no point in competing with it. Infiniti is sold in quite a few countries outside the U.S. and mostly targeting countries with fast growth rates to gain a foot hold in them.
528i
- 11/11/2007 1:40:01 PM
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-5 Boost
Lexus.
reply to this comment
JUGNU
- 11/11/2007 1:41:10 PM
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+2 Boost
rok altima
That sounds like an excuse.My was more of a reason that Infiniti doesn't directly competes with Lexus TILL NOW.As lack of models and there core is still more towards Sport/Performance.
What models will come in future we will see.
and i live here in Middle East(Dubai).And infinti is surely there,but very little and nearly non existent in rest of the Asia.
JUGNU
reply to this comment
mikeydred20
- 11/11/2007 1:43:38 PM
-5 Boost
I'm tired of these bias articles from the Agents, there is no reason why Acura should not be mentioned here, let me guess it's because they have no V8 or RWD (not iportant to most buyers). By this time next year after the introduction of the new TL and TSX Acura will be making noise there AWD system is more sophisticated than Infinit's or Lexus and it will make them competitive in the performance race once again. Sales wise they are the only real threats to Lexus.
There interiors are better than that of Infiniti and you get more car for the money than both Lexus and Infiniti.
I know Honda tends to be secreative about there plans but instead of all this Lexus and Infinit talk there is no reason why we can't get more Acura news and I know alot of people will agree with me.
Acura "Advance"
reply to this comment
markusck
- 11/11/2007 2:02:13 PM
-4 Boost
I agree, in my mind, from a purely design standpoint, Acura is far more sophisticated, far less overly stylized to meet some marketing demographic. It is a shame Acura has not marketed themselves a bit more forcefully, but at the same time, I like that they are not the marketing whore that Lexus is.
It does go to show you how important marketing is as all 3 of these brands are very similar in how they became to be.
Agent001
- 11/11/2007 2:31:52 PM
View My AgentSpace
+8 Boost
Acura?
What planet are you on?
They are sooo far out of the game, hell would have to freeze over for them to even become relevant again.
Dude, get over it.
They make some nice rides, but they are a verrry distant third in this game.
001
Bmw8ter
- 11/11/2007 3:00:17 PM
+8 Boost
it doesn't help that Acura exists only in N. America...whereas in the rest of the world it's just called Honda.
Blakura
- 11/11/2007 3:28:29 PM
-2 Boost
I agree 100% Acura is very innovative and there designs, especially the interiors are copied by others in the market. Why do you think Infiniti took the path they did with the new G35 interior? And don't forget about the new CTS's interior. Great points Mikey!
SoSnootySo
- 11/11/2007 4:24:12 PM
+5 Boost
Lets put things into perspective. Infiniti is a great brand, but they were risking bankruptcy a few years ago. They are getting better and better (that's good) but Acura is not even close to being out (not yet anwyays). The sales numbers for Acura are down because their TSX and TL models came out at nearly the same time. They have 5 year cycles for model changes. Remember when the TL and TSX came out around late 2003 early 2004? These models including the RSX made Acura king... Those cars, even though they were FF blew away the competition in terms of sales, fuel econ, overall features, and even handling. The problem now is that the competition is fierce and continually inovating in terms of performance while Acura/Honda is concentrating most of its resources on being green. In the future, which will be more important? Who knows, maybe something will happen and you can get 600hp sedans that weigh 3 tons while getting 70mpg?
Anyways, in the mean time. Acura still needs to distinguish itself from Honda. Like differentiating designs and building an FR platform (long shot, cuz it's cost prohibitive. yada yada). Not many people care about RWD vs. FWD, But it gets into the minds of quasi-enthusiasts. Driver enthusiasts who form most of their snobbery and opinions from auto magazines, online forums, and television shows. Word spreads and people start hating on a car without actually driving it..
I applaud infiniti for recognizing this before it was too late. They set out on a path to win this psychological battle by emulating the driver's favorite symbol of enthusiasm, BMW. In 2005, I looked at the G35, but I chose the TL instead. The reason was fuel economy, better exterior, interior, and tons of gadgets. The G35 had terrible fuel economy at the time, felt cramped, and looked horrid inside (I gotta say BMW has horrid interiors as well. I guess they like to emulate that as well lol). I dunno about now, but the G got around 22mpg on highway. Regardless, the G35 set out to be a performance sedan to compete with BMW, they are getting close and the enthusiasts are rewarding them for it. (i.e. This article). Good for them.
I think Acura is a great brand. I love their cars but they don't have their eye on the prize. Winning enthusiasts over. These are the people who influence popular opinion. Come on acura, you're about to go global.. Do it with a bang! Get that FR platform out, build the NSX on the HSC concept, give us a new roadster, don't go GS on us with the next TL!
From wikipedia:
------------------------------------------------
By 2000, Infiniti was facing extinction. The company rededicated itself to developing a dynamic and powerful line-up of sporty luxury cars. Car and Driver reported that Infiniti executives invited members of the motoring press to a meeting where they "swore never again to take their eyes off BMW." - Wikipedia
------------------------------------------------
zorbeeze
- 11/11/2007 7:09:05 PM
-1 Boost
Acura interiors and exteriors are better than Infinity and Lexus? Since when? Whatever, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
But in my personal opinion Acura can't be directly compared to the other two. I see Acura as a Buick and Volvo competitor and even then Volvo is much better. The TL looks like to overbloated. The only vehicle in their lineup that can compete is the RDX.
Acura's problem is they can't move away from Honda. Look at the TSX, it's the Honda Accord in the rest of the world, exactly the same, nothing changes other than the badge. The RL is just plain horrible, but Infiniti's Q is much worse. The MDX does not have the drivetrain to compete, the car will flop if it hits gravel. It was a smart move to drop the RSX, a car like that does not belong in their lineup. I see Acura as a fast and furious brand. It's the first step you take in the luxury market if you want a Japaneese car but as you get older and make more money you move to the other two.
As for the Lexus vs Infiniti battle, it's tough. Infiniti is moving up fast. All their models, minus the Q and QX, are up to par with the competition. Though if the GTR was an Infiniti it would greatly benefit them. Lexus needs to stop production of that monstrocity they refer to as the SC.
M35MT
- 11/12/2007 8:44:23 AM
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0 Boost
Acura is a Volvo/VW/Saab competitor. They were there in the early 90's, but kinda became an "average" luxury car from then on.
EnnNorak
- 11/15/2007 1:33:47 AM
+1 Boost
M35MT, its getting harder and harder to determine which companies are each other's competitors as most luxury features have trickled down to lesser cars. Auto makers still believe that they can simply target a specific competitor by pricing their produst in the same range. The consumer is too smart for that and will buy the product that offers most value for the money. Today's car buyer is smart enough to recognize when a product is overpriced and sales of the overpriced product suffer accordingly.
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 2:32:42 PM
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+1 Boost
It's hard to say at this point. Lexus is a more powerful marketing machine and they already have a foothold in Europe, however small. But I think Infiniti can do better than Lexus in Europe, if only because their cars play to Europeans' wants and needs. I don't know who will end up as the "victor," though.
reply to this comment
huu76
- 11/11/2007 3:43:00 PM
-5 Boost
Lexus as they have no European handicap like Nissan does.
You notice that Nissan's sales have slumped the more awkwardly European their designs get?
I would place Acura ahead of Infiniti easily. From my observations, the G35 is the only Infiniti that actually sells. Personally though, I'd put Nissan above Infiniti since the GT-R was born a Nissan and that car by itself has more credibility than the entire Infiniti lineup.
reply to this comment
zorbeeze
- 11/11/2007 7:13:50 PM
+7 Boost
You'd take an RL over an M?
There's something seriously wrong there.
SpicyMikey
- 11/13/2007 9:48:30 AM
-1 Boost
I shopped last year between the M35, RL, and 535. I took the RL. With the A-Spec package it was the best looking for my taste, had the best ride for city living, and had the nicest interior with the absolute best nav and voice recognition system of them all.
I scratch my head when I hear people count Acura out. yes, they need to do a better job marketing, Yes, they need more choices in their trim package and drive trains. But this company still makes some very good cars. They are far from irrelevant. That's a ridiculous statement I heard some people say.
Bill
- 11/11/2007 3:46:32 PM
0 Boost
Lexus hands down.
Though I'd say that Infiniti has a couple of cars that kill their Lexus counterparts, specifically the M35/M45 and FX35/FX45, which in my book are better than the GS and RX series.
In the top luxury segment, the Infiniti Q can't touch the LS.
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S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 4:24:16 PM
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+3 Boost
That's because there is no Infiniti Q right now. Mark my words... when it comes back, it will be impressive.
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 4:38:36 PM
+3 Boost
This is true, people were surprised at the redesigned M after the first one was a flop. The first G (althought with a cheap interior, though vastly improved in the new one) got many awards for its abilities. The FX was something never seen before and rivaled the Porsche Cayanne in its handling. I don't think Infiniti/Nissan will be play around the new Q as now the people who've had M's for a while will now be ready to trade up.
Bill
- 11/12/2007 8:46:12 AM
+5 Boost
The next Infiniti Q will definiely be a car to watch, but I think they're going to gun for the BMW 7er meaning sport will have a slight priority over luxury/comfort. I expect it to be an awesome car though, like the LS.
huu76
- 11/11/2007 3:54:30 PM
0 Boost
Toyota also has deeper pockets than all the German makers combined. That's what Renault/Nissan/Infiniti are going up against. It's also difficult to win in a category that is completely subjective. (i.e. BMW can put their name on a truck and it'd probably win the handling category in a sport sedan comparison).
Since I was young once, I know most young people have little or no money. You can spend $600/mth/5yrs to buy a normal car or $500/mth/2yrs leasing an entry-lux car. Which do you think the child will choose?
Perhaps Nissan considers 30+ as young?
reply to this comment
JWalkerLegrande
- 11/11/2007 4:20:53 PM
-11 Boost
Hyundai. Of all Asian makes, they will make the biggest splash.
They are rapidly closing on Lexus on design, and the content is just starting to improve with the new coupe. They will have to leave the econobox market to Kia though, not that I see any problem with that.
At the same time, they will certainly be the price leader, which may make them the king of the recession luxo market.
reply to this comment
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 4:25:52 PM
View My AgentSpace
+5 Boost
This is an article about Lexus and Infiniti.
JWalkerLegrande
- 11/11/2007 4:43:16 PM
-3 Boost
Looks like I was mislead by the article referring to Asian luxo companies; and comments made of Acura.
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 4:51:00 PM
+6 Boost
Hyundai is still not an Asian luxury company..
zorbeeze
- 11/11/2007 7:17:37 PM
-7 Boost
"Hyundai is still not an Asian luxury company"
I'm having a hard time understanding this comment. Hyundai is Korean, Korea is in Asia, thus Hyundai is an Asian manufacturer.
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 7:43:44 PM
+4 Boost
Yes, but they're not LUXURY
Htay7500
- 11/11/2007 4:45:49 PM
+3 Boost
I like the g35 and the m35/45 more than the gs and is.
reply to this comment
STJ88
- 11/11/2007 5:05:13 PM
0 Boost
G= skyline M= fuga Q= cima (still made in Japan). And the G20 was a primera the first M was a leopard and the seconde was a cedric.
So if you want to know infiniti's future watch Japan.
reply to this comment
montyz81
- 11/12/2007 12:04:03 PM
+2 Boost
Interesting, FX, EX didn't have any Japan counterparts, Not sure your theory holds water. Also, the second gen g35 was available in the US before it was available as a Skyline.
Lexus
- 11/11/2007 6:40:24 PM
-4 Boost
Lexus is the Winner of course....Why you might ask?
First, Lexus was originally design as a pure Luxury car not sport car. And their sales already far exceed Infiniti in term of sales and their quality is way better.
And now, they just make their first true sport sedan, the Lexus IS-F. Other model will follow the F-division soon enough, like the GS-F and LS-F. And their up and coming Lexus LF-A with 570+ hp, with a speed limit that exceed 200 mph.
But it doen't really matter because they are both Japanese brands. Nissan GT-R already giving all the German engineer nightmare, I can't wait what the Lexus LF-A will do to them?
reply to this comment
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 6:45:31 PM
View My AgentSpace
0 Boost
I think you're wrong. On every point.
enthusiastx11
- 11/11/2007 7:49:20 PM
+4 Boost
you're totally off base.
for people who like performance (i.e. being able to actually feel the road, good handling, etc) infiniti is a no-brainer over lexus.
charlik05
- 11/11/2007 6:45:41 PM
-2 Boost
Lexus dominates the 38+ market and infiniti the 20-35 market.
the fx is fast and handles like a car, the rx is docile, roomy and luxurious. which one is better?
the lx is ultra luxury, the qx is ultra luxury with a couch. which one is better?
the m is fast and loaded. the gs is not as fast and just as loaded. which one is better?
the ls has always been the top of its class for an asian car. the q has always been 2nd place to the ls. which one is better?
don't forget the g35 and is, the g37 and sc.
both are great makes and will always compete with each other. it all depends on whats important.
look at the Germans, who's on top changes every couple of years or when one of them does something stupid like buy an American car company.
infiniti is entering new markets because many new and slighlty used infiniti are being exported to russia, ukraine, etc... lexus as well. lexus has begun selling in russia and services cars through toyota dealerships in many countries.
remember both infinit and lexus were created for the american market.
reply to this comment
rok_altima
- 11/11/2007 6:58:09 PM
-1 Boost
The cheapest Infiniti is the G sedan which starts at $31,600. Don't know where you got 20K from..maybe thinking of Acura?
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 10:13:08 PM
View My AgentSpace
+7 Boost
The Infiniti G37 does not compete with the Lexus SC430--the Infiniti is literally half the price. And it's a better car, in every respect.
skinny
- 11/11/2007 6:59:20 PM
+6 Boost
Who will be the eventual victor? Stories like these are totally pointless. To have a eventual victor would mean at some point one of the 2 car companies would go out of business! There is no "eventual victor". The battle goes on until indefinately. Sometimes one makes better cars sometimes the other does.
reply to this comment
DaHarder
- 11/11/2007 7:04:36 PM
+3 Boost
I doubt that there will ever be a time when the the automotive market reaches a point when it can only sustain a single manufacturer, so both of these companies will continue producing outstanding offerings that offer the consumer the only True Luxury-
The Luxury of Choice.
Note: I really dislike this type of thread because it is so obviously irrelevant, and does little but insight flame wars.
reply to this comment
M35MT
- 11/12/2007 9:00:46 AM
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+2 Boost
You're right, because if there were only 1, that would be communism.
enthusiastx11
- 11/11/2007 7:45:43 PM
+1 Boost
easy answer:
in sports sedans and more performance-oriented vehicles for people under 50: infiniti hands down.
in softer luxury sedans and SUVs for people over 50: lexus already dominates.
reply to this comment
Will_
- 11/11/2007 8:05:23 PM
-5 Boost
It's not even an argument. Lexus has more competitors that go head-to-head with European cars. Like it's already been mentioned, Infiniti doesn't have competitors for the LS, ES, SC, etc. Lexus has already started to pull away from Infiniti as far as the luxury market is concerned anyway. The LS600hL will introduce new premium buyers to the brand, the IS-F will introduce new performance buyers to the brand, and whenever the LF-A gets off its feet, it too will introduce both new performance and premium buyers to the brand as well.
Infiniti has made strides in making cars with striking design and performance, but they cannot take on the whole luxury car market with the G and M alone.
reply to this comment
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 10:14:57 PM
View My AgentSpace
-1 Boost
It's definitely an argument. You know, Will, THINGS CHANGE.
Your bias shows through.
Will_
- 11/11/2007 10:48:01 PM
-1 Boost
There really is no argument. BOTH companies will see tremendous growth. At the moment, Lexus is ahead, and there are no worthy competitors to those cars. It's just a fact.
Your hasty and argumentative ignorance shows through.
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/11/2007 11:50:12 PM
View My AgentSpace
+3 Boost
Infiniti has a lot more room for growth than Lexus. They haven't started in all of the markets that Lexus is in, their cars are more appealing to Europeans and they don't have half of the available segments covered. Full-size sedan, upscale sports car, convertible, etc. are just a few.
chuck717
- 11/11/2007 9:51:43 PM
+3 Boost
Two xlnt cars companies with diffferent direction at the out set, it seems from the get go Infiniti wanted to be a niche player while Lexus sole purpose was to take on MBZ. As the years passed Infiniti got lost and just put product out there and hope it would sell because of dealer network. Lexus like a good football team stayed focus.
To Infinit's credit instead of folding the tent since they were getting left behind they took the G off the market refined the heck out of it brought it back the rest is history. The FX was brought to market as advertised a crossover they would build as it was sent around the country for approval and the public said build it again the rest is history.The M was brillant very different design and improvement over a nice I-30 but the M is great.
Another fine move was the removal of the Q and again wait and bring it back as a true 21 century car ready to do battle with the best of the best.
Lexus is still focus on product for sure, but i think their dealers are getting to comfortable as to we can sell it because of the Lexus name, Infifnti is getting tons of steam will they over take Lexus no of course not, Toyota and Nissan are two very different car companies as to sales volume, Infiniti will now be player for some time Lexus will be a big behemouth who can still and always will sell cars on its laurels after all they do make nice machines this isn't GM vs Ford this is Xlnt cars vs Xlnt cars!
reply to this comment
ThierryHenry14
- 11/11/2007 9:52:03 PM
-1 Boost
I think Lexus has a much deeper pocket for R&D and new project than do Infiniti, therefore, I think Lexus will be the victor.
reply to this comment
ThierryHenry14
- 11/13/2007 10:50:59 AM
0 Boost
I love the deboosting because my OPINION is not what they want to hear...(not that I care)...
lexusis350
- 11/11/2007 11:05:38 PM
-2 Boost
It all depends on what you would think victorious would be. Luxury, quality, build, and resale all go to Lexus. Performance, good price, and good technological features go to Infiniti. If you look at the lower-class companies, Toyota and Nissan, it's the same way. Nissans are famous for raising the bar and pushing the limit. But, they often use short cuts to do that by using cheap materials. Toyota is known for quality vehicles that are more conservative. I think the same goes for Infiniti and Lexus.
reply to this comment
mikeydred20
- 11/12/2007 12:26:59 PM
+2 Boost
Honda quality is better than that of Nissan and Toyota if they take taht formula and add it to Acura we wouldn't be having this discussion.
lexusis350
- 11/12/2007 10:04:56 PM
+1 Boost
Acuras aren't true luxury vehicles though. They don't offer RWD, they don't offer a V8, they don't offer luxury features such as push button start, ventilated seats, 16-way power seats, etc. etc. etc.
S4cabriofoxone
- 11/13/2007 10:26:26 PM
View My AgentSpace
+2 Boost
Since when is push-button start a necessary luxury feature? Even the ventilated seats are pushing it. In so many other respects, I've gotta hand it to Acura, their cars are packed with standard features. Sounds a bit like... oh, I'm going there... Lexus. Except that was Lexus, 10 years ago. Now they overprice their cars like everyone else.
DaHarder
- 11/12/2007 12:56:27 AM
+4 Boost
As much as NISSAN debated about whether to badge the GT-R as an Infiniti or Nissan, I seriously doubt that they'll be 'badge-engineering' and Infiniti version...
It would dilute the whole Nissan (Skyline) GT-R mystique.
I do believe that the 'Q' will come back fighting, and very competitive.
Note: The 1st gen Q45 was a very nice vehicle and quite the performer for its time.
reply to this comment
montyz81
- 11/12/2007 9:20:22 AM
+1 Boost
Nissan have already committed to building a car off of the GTR platform for Infiniti. It is due in 2010 or 2011.
reply to this comment
07G35J
- 11/12/2007 9:47:32 AM
+1 Boost
I hope they don't rebadge the GT-R as an Infiniti. Like DaHarder says, it will dilute the GT-R's "mystique". Besides, I think Nissan will have a hard enough time selling a $60-80K car. Imagine if they turn it into an Infiniti, it'll cost even more.
reply to this comment
pchera01
- 11/12/2007 1:29:32 AM
0 Boost
IMO, its very hard Infiniti to become as big as Lexus. they maynot want to be too big. They wanted to gow into status of Japsnese BMW, or ultimate drving mechine from Japan...
Infiniti ;is great brand, but IMO, they will still a stay at #3, behind Lexus and Acura, unless Acura on't want to build a RWD and V-8...
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diddy_nyc
- 11/12/2007 9:11:39 AM
+1 Boost
Infiniti is okay, but they have a very long way to go if they are trying to compete with Lexus. I was going to trade in my 05 Acura TL on Friday for a G37. Performance wise the vehicle is great, but the interior quality is not up to the level of my Acura. The car also did not feel as solid & secure as the TL.
But seriously, Acura in my opinion is a way better brand than Infiniti. Better residual value & quality.
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rok_altima
- 11/12/2007 9:24:23 AM
0 Boost
The ifiniti G has won awards for best residual value and quality..The TL hasn't..
nickymayne
- 11/12/2007 9:27:29 AM
+4 Boost
The problem with Infiniti is that the company has never really been consistently managed well. The original Q45 was a hit, but the current version is ugly and a disaster. When Nissan and Infiniti were coming out with awkward looking, bland cars in the late 90's, it really destroyed brand equity for both. As a result, it will take a lot of time for Infiniti to recover from that. Infiniti really needs to do a good design and engineering job on the next generation Q45 to really be considered to be on the level of Lexus. The Nissan GT-R really should have been marketed under the Infiniti nameplate. I wonder if they will release an Infiniti version that is more luxury-oriented. Also, when dealing with luxury brands, sales volume is really not a good indicator of "success" in the brand prestige sense. Personally, I would never buy a Lexus simply because of the fact that it's too damn common (i live in South Florida). The same goes for BMW (with the 3 series and coming out with the 1 series), and Benz (the C-Class is a brand killer). I just can't understand people spending serious money for a car that is as common as a Corolla. So the fact that Infiniti is a ways behind in sales compared to Lexus is a good thing. Also, don't sleep on Acura. The flagship RL looks too basic and they need a new NSX.
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07G35J
- 11/12/2007 9:38:16 AM
+4 Boost
IMO, both Lexus and Infiniti are formidable cars. They simply are aiming at different targets. Infiniti's bull's eye is called BMW. Lexus's is Mercedes Benz. Infiniti emphasizes their vehicles toward performance over luxury, while Lexus leans more towards the latter.
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Loki123
- 11/12/2007 10:42:59 AM
-5 Boost
How will eventually be the victor? Good question.
What we know about Infiniti:
- 7 years ago they were facing extinction
- seem to be always struggling financially
- had a sh!tty brand to begin with (that whole Zen nature ad campaign just blew)
- has a fleet of only 2 decent cars (G and M)
What we know about Lexus:
- top selling brand in the US
- fleet of many awesome vehicles
- has be consistently on top
- buying experience much better at Lexus than Infiniti (as a result - will get more return business)
Therefore Lexus will be the victor.
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S4cabriofoxone
- 11/12/2007 9:40:28 PM
View My AgentSpace
+4 Boost
The EX and FX are both very stylish, sporty SUVs.
lyonboy
- 11/12/2007 11:39:08 AM
-1 Boost
History says Infiniti will never get close to Lexus. Lexus has a strong, complete line-up with one dud, the SC430. Infiniti has 2 reasonably selling models, the M and the G and that is it. Lexus is not my cup of tea but it is hard to argue with Lexus's sales. If lexus could work on styling and offer a little more driver involvement it would be even more successful. Lexus has never had a beautiful car, never offensive but never a wow. I rate styling as follows, 1 BMW/Mercedes, 2 Audi, 3 Jaguar, 4 Infiniti, 5 Lexus.
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montyz81
- 11/12/2007 12:22:56 PM
+1 Boost
Not all History says that. The G and the M have out sold the IS and the G more months then they haven't in the last 5 years. As they apply the same philosophy around their other cars, look for the same thing to happen in the other segments. The key here is that the leaders at Nissan understand the mistakes of the past. It takes time to turn things around (not just in what they produce but in what peoples perception is of what they produce). I think Infiniti will go make it as a number 2 or 3 in this segmant and will certainly cause pain for Lexus along the way!
mikeydred20
- 11/12/2007 12:09:30 PM
+2 Boost
Acura does not only exist in Noth America, China and Mexico currently have Acura dealerships. With the arrival of the next NSX Acura will go global as they had planned to in 08. It's nice to see the support, let us post a survey thread out of the three, who do people favor and we shall see.
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diddy_nyc
- 11/12/2007 12:35:39 PM
0 Boost
In terms of the Japanese Brand ratings, I see Lexus as #1, Acura as #2 & Infiniti as #3. No matter what some of you may say, Acura is way beyond Infiniti! The TL's value is much higher than a G
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M35MT
- 11/12/2007 12:51:28 PM
View My AgentSpace
+2 Boost
The Luxury sport sedan game is RWD in the modern world. Acura needs an AWD model line to complete, a la Audi.
montyz81
- 11/12/2007 3:32:42 PM
+1 Boost
2007 hasn't been done yet, so I ask where is the TL in this list?
1. 2006 Honda S2000 — 51.7%
2. 2006 Mini Cooper — 51.5%
3. 2006 Acura TSX — 47.7%
4. 2006 BMW M3 — 47.6%
5. 2006 Mercedes-Benz SL-Class — 47.0%
2006 Mercedes-Benz SLK55 AMG — 47.0%
7. 2006 Infiniti G35 — 46.9%
8. 2006 Acura RSX — 46.5%
9. 2006 Lexus SC 430 — 46.5%
10. 2006 Subaru Impreza WRX STI — 46.4%
montyz81
- 11/12/2007 3:33:46 PM
+1 Boost
By the way that list was off of edmunds.com and the tests were performed by intellichoice.
SoSnootySo
- 11/12/2007 6:28:19 PM
-1 Boost
montyz, I didn't even know what that list was... I had to search for it. Next time put a caption. "RESIDUAL VALUE". BTW, Acura has been known to have great residual value:
http://www.forbesautos.com/advice/toptens/resale/01-resale_value.html
http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/basics/2004-10-08-mym-autos_x.htm
5) Acura TL
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I found this article from vtec.net. Acura sales are down. I've seen similiar numbers in the other months