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Why is Toyota selling a $400,000 car?

JustaCar submitted on 10/30/2009 Official Bell & Ross Timestamp: 7:52:52 PM

27 user comments | Category: Misc News | Source: | SOURCE: articles.moneycentral.msn.com

By now, we should all be familiar with Toyota Motor's (TM, news, msgs) woes.

No sooner had the automaker finally ascended to the No. 1 global spot, displacing General Motors (MTLQQ, news, msgs), now known as Motors Liquidation, than it began to hit speed bumps and potholes. There were historic financial losses, lawsuits and embarrassing, tragic recalls. At one point, it was widely believed that Toyota could do no wrong. All of a sudden, it could do no right.

So the Tokyo Motor Show, by all rights, should have been an opportunity for Toyota to redeem itself in its own backyard. Along with Honda Motor (HMC, news, msgs) and Nissan Motor (NSANY, news, msgs), Japan's two other big carmakers, Toyota had the place to itself. The grim story of the Tokyo show, traditionally a forum for rollouts of exotic concept cars, was that few international automakers would be spending the money to make the trip to the Land of the Rising Sun.


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JustaCar

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User Comments

dlin

Too many reason, but it all comes down to TECHNOLOGY and BRAND IMAGE.

— dlin (View Profile)

Posted on 10/30/2009 9:33:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

grysko

Toyota is selling a $400,000 car because they can. And secondly, there are dummies out there who will buy it. It's been the business model for Lexus since they came to market.

— grysko (View Profile)

Posted on 10/30/2009 10:18:06 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

downtoearth

— grysko:

> And secondly, there are dummies out there who will buy it.
> It's been the business model for Lexus since they came to market.

There are much dumber people out there who buy 1,5 million USD Volkswagen Beetle (also called Bugatti Veyron).

The Volkswagen Beetle (Bugatti Veyron) corners so poorly that, despite having twice the power and one gear more, it could barely outrun the Nissan GT-R on the Top Gear power circuit (which consists of straight lines mostly).

— downtoearth (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 1:19:01 PM | | Votes: 2   

ErichHartmann

The GT-R and Veyron are two completely different cars. The GT-R is a super sports car while the Veyron is an ultra luxury machine. A Lotus Elise performs and handles better than a Bentley Continental GT, doesn't it? And the Bentley is far more expensive and has way more power. Your logic of comparing the GT-R to a Veyron is silly.

— ErichHartmann (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 5:11:06 PM | | Votes: 3   

downtoearth

— ErichHartmann:

> Your logic of comparing the GT-R to a Veyron is silly.

It's perfectly accurate and proves that Veyron simply is a heavy pig in corners, understeering widely and wildly.


> The GT-R and Veyron are two completely different cars.

1. Both cars are perfectly usable in everyday conditions rather than being die-hard stripped track machines.

2. Both cars are rather heavy and well sound proofed than loud and annoying on longer commutes.

3. Both cars are all wheel drive (RWD + clutch based front driveshaft) and feature automated dual clutch transmissions.

4. Both cars have high pressure turbos on their engines rather than featuring high revving naturally aspirated engines.

5. Both cars are highly computerized machines, heavily assisting the driver rather than leaving her/him on her/his own.

This is exactly why I compared them. And sorry, but the GT-R puts the Veyron to shame terms of performance capabilities. GT-R has just half the power and one gear less and yet, on a Top Gear track it's only 1,5 second slower.

Now if you consider that the Top Gear test track is a power circuit, as Clarkson himself calls it, because it consists of straight lines mostly* which rewards cars with more power than sense, you'll realize how poorly Veyron has to corners and how brilliant engineering achievement the Nissan GT-R is.

Reasons? Weight and inferior engineering from Volkswagen (when compared to Nissan) designing the Veyron.

* See the Top Gear track bird view if you don't believe me:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Top_Gear_test_track_map.svg


> A Lotus Elise performs and handles better than a Bentley
> Continental GT, doesn't it?

You couldn't have failed more at comparing, Herr Hartmann. Everything separates the Lotus Elise and a Bentley (just do the check lists from above for these two vehicles) while the Veyron and the GT-R share most of their technical characteristics.

— downtoearth (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 6:09:41 PM | | Votes: 2   

LexSucks

Downtoearth,

The Veyron is heavy yet still manages to kick the GT-R's ass around any racetrack. Also, the GT-R is far from being a light weight itself. You mention Top-Gear yet you didn't post the actual times. The Veyron is 1.7 seconds per lap faster than the GT-R. That my friend is an Butt Kicking. Look at it this way; After just 10 laps the Veyron would be 17 seconds ahead of the GT-R. What point are you trying to make again?

Top Gear - Power Lap times.
1:17.1 - Gumpert Apollo Sport
1:17.3 - Ascari A10
1:17.6 - Koenigsegg CCX (with The Top Gear Wing)
1:17.8 - Pagani Zonda F Roadster
1:17.9 - Caterham Seven R500 (cold tyres)[6]
1:18.3 - Bugatti Veyron
1:18.4 - Pagani Zonda F
1:18.9 - Maserati MC12
1:19.0 - Lamborghini Murciélago LP670-4 SuperVeloce
1:19.0 - Ferrari Enzo
1:19.5 - Lamborghini Gallardo LP560-4
1:19.5 - Porsche 997 GT2
1:19.5 - Ariel Atom 2 300 [7]
1:19.7 - Nissan GT-R
1:19.7 - Ferrari 430 Scuderia

— LexSucks (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 9:50:23 AM | | Votes: -1   

TheDepressingTruth

Same reason a Dog Licks its Balls...

— TheDepressingTruth (View Profile)

Posted on 10/30/2009 10:23:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

guambombboy

Well, as long as $400,000 worth of work was put into it, then I would not care what brand is selling it.

— guambombboy (View Profile)

Posted on 10/30/2009 11:02:44 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

VISO

You are an idiot downtoearth. How is Volkswagen engineering inferior? Show some kind of proof to back your baseless fanboy claims. You're comments are intellectually inferior and have no merit in anything but opinion with now serious engineering or automotive knowledge of any sort.

— VISO (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 12:13:30 AM | | Votes: 1   

1UAW

The car was designed and dreamed up years ago when Toyota wass in better shape and more liked by the public so it made sense at the time to make this thing. It takes years to test and make a plant to build a new car. Now things are not so good but the time, effort, amd money was already invested in this thing so it would be wise to go through with it.

— 1UAW (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 2:01:24 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

Badgewhore

Typical of short sighted americans to ask such dumb questions.

— Badgewhore (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 4:22:20 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -8   

darzav

I believe the company is called Lexus. Their goal was to build a sports car and thats exactly what they did. The rich will buy it non the less.

Yes Lexus are owned by Toyota and source many parts from them. Thats good DNA though. If Cadillac builds a sports car and sourced their parts from Vauxhall, i'd be worried. When i turn up the volume in an Audi, i feel like im touching a Volkswagen. Hope the point im making isnt going adrift

Whoever posted this article should reconsider the title.

— darzav (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 5:33:35 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

JustaCar

Lexus is not a company. Lexus is a brand of the Toyota company.
Up until the last couple of years, the same cars that were being marketed in the US as Lexus were being sold in Japan and other countries as Toyota models.

— JustaCar (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 7:46:32 AM | | Votes: 0   

JustaCar

By the way, the title came verbatim from the MSN article. They obviously also know that Lexus is not its own company. Only Lexus fans think that.

— JustaCar (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 7:56:24 AM | | Votes: 0   

darzav

My attacks on the person who titled the article was clearly not on you mate, i was aware you sourced it from somewhere else. Lexus is a brand i guess. In Malaysia, before Lexus' were sold, they were badged as Toyota and used Toyota parts. Based on working there i can guarantee you the parts the Toyota Harrier used were not the same parts they used in the Lexus Rx250. Why? I really dont know, ask the guys upstairs i guess.

All i am aware of is that Lexus parts cost more to produce than Toyota parts obviously. Otherwise Toyota's wouldnt be accessible to its intended market.

Im just trying to get people to stop 'hatting' Lexus for being a Toyota.
Why buy a Lexus IS to a Corrola is like why buy an Audi A3 to a VW Golf?

— darzav (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2009 6:43:18 AM | | Votes: 1   

Inline6

^^^Hmmmm, you do know that Toyota is positioning Lexus as it's own company, it's products being seperate from Toyota.

— Inline6 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 8:30:02 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Timzilla

Lexus and Scion are exactly the same, ones a cheap version of a Toyota, on is an expensive version.

The reason they only made 400 is because most people who own super cars wouldnt want one to have a Lexus badge. Most people who enjoy driving dont want a Lexus badge on their car. Lexus is the anti car.

— Timzilla (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 5:44:55 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

StickShiftCamry

Y would Lexus b anti-car? Lexus mostly makes classic configuration front engine rear wheel drive cars that don't break down and can be revved to redline all day everyday without over heating, I'm part of a black car co. in NY, i know which brand luxury cars can handle nyc beating and 80,000 nyc miles a year.

— StickShiftCamry (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2009 11:14:58 PM | | Votes: 3   

huu76

As mentioned before, yes, because "they can".

Writer just proves that no matter what Toyota/Lexus, peopel will complain.

Lexus is too old so when they add a supercar to the lineup, they complain it will ruin the Lexus name.
If Toyota created a new brand, they'll say no name recognition.
If they called it a Toyota, they'd say Toyota making a supercar should be the last thing on their mind right now.
If they didn't make the LF-A, then peopel would bitch that Toyota was all talk but no results.

People are just upset that Toyotat can and did.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 6:03:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

g2ok

Toyota is the New GM.
This just won't cut it.

— g2ok (View Profile)

Posted on 10/31/2009 8:26:26 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

mini22

Well a "halo" car is important for a company image. Porsche had the Carrera GT,Ferrari the Enzo,Nissan the GTR,Alfa Romeo the 8C Competizione etc,Honda had the NSX. Toyota has never really had a halo car.Also as some previously mentioned this project was too far along in development to pull the plug. Importantly it highlights a companies technicability. Further these technologies eventually filter down to main stream production cars over time.I'm curious as to why a the LF-A is so expensive,however.Is the technology of the LFA that much more involved then the GTR? I almost get the impression that by calling it a Lexus, Toyota is figuring they can add 100 grand to the price.

— mini22 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2009 12:59:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

veyron1001

Toyota never had a super car division. All of their efforts was focused on this limited production supercar. The price makes sense even though it is a bit much.

— veyron1001 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2009 7:54:56 PM | | Votes: 1   

XYZZ

the LF-A's v10 is based on toyota's Formula One race car engines. they have pumped BILLIONS of Yen into that game, so you can expect it will feature state-of-the-art engine technology.

the projected price also doubled when toyota decided to make this car largely CARBON FIBER rather than ordinary aluminum.

— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 11/8/2009 5:30:01 AM | | Votes: 1   

kpaxx

I guess their logic is if we charge a lot of money for it someone will actually think it is special. A bet the price was set by their marketing department.

— kpaxx (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 9:24:00 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Whelan

I'm more curious to see how much Acura will charge for the new NSX when/if it comes out.

— Whelan (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 11:23:17 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

adamsaf723

Isn't a Bugatti Veyron just a VW??? STFU, you don't know what you're talking about.

— adamsaf723 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 11:57:01 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

david999


It is worth very penny. Exclusivity and technology seperates this from the pack.

— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2009 12:01:56 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

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