Agent009
Agent009
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough."
View My AgentSpace

Print this Page | Digg It | del.icio.us

Will Skyrocketing Prices Derail The German Diesel Juggernaut?

The rising price of diesel in the U.S. looks set to derail the long-awaited onslaught by German manufacturers, hoping to sell fuel-efficient fuel-sippers to Americans desperate for economic vehicles, as long as they're not gutless, dangerous minicars.

Diesels in Europe have been spectacularly successful in recent years, to the point when about every other new car sold here is an oil-burner. Americans still probably associate diesels with the hopeless turkeys on sale during the 1970s oil crisis, which were unreliable, always bag-a-nails noisy, smelly, dirty, smoke emitting, and gutless.

Modern diesels couldn't be more different. They are so quiet, effortlessly smooth, and with torquey engines offering instant acceleration from low engine speeds, that they are the version of choice by German buyers of top-of-the-range S class Mercedes and BMW 7 Series. They are amazingly fuel-efficient, too. As Congress ratchets down rules insisting that vehicle fuel economy must improve 40 percent by 2020, diesel power offers this without forcing people to scale down to tiny cars which offer scant accident protection and snail-like performance.

The idea of diesels in America seemed like a marriage made in heaven, with the promise of a 30 percent fuel efficiency improvement with no performance penalty, and therefore liberating big SUVs and pickups from the threat of obsolescence.

Read Article
Will Skyrocketing Prices Derail The German Diesel Juggernaut?



Comments:

Images hosted in your AgentSpace can now be posted in the comments section using the following syntax (case matters):
[img]IMAGE URL[/img]
Example: [img]http://agent004.myautospies.com/users/150/Sample-Gallery/sample1.JPG[/img]

w209w114w209w114 - 6/16/2008 5:28:55 PMView My AgentSpace
+5 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Daimler AG has already accused the Oil Industry for trying to sabotage the diesel uprising in the U.S. with high prices for a fuel which takes less time, energy, and costs less to produce than gasoline. It doesnt make any sense.

Diesel used to be cheaper, and still should be. What I wonder is why nobody has already raised this issue until now.


reply to this comment
DieselRulesDieselRules - 6/16/2008 6:48:58 PM
+5 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
of course: vehicles using 70% as much fuel at 70% of the cost of converting crude to gasoline results in revenues of only 50% of current ones.
Of course the oil companies are trying to kill diesel sales.

The DOJ should look into this.
It truly is criminal!



djrickpdjrickp - 6/16/2008 9:10:05 PM
+4 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
What about car companies charging a premium for diesel engines? I realize that diesel engines must be built stronger to withstand the higher compressions but does it really justify a higher premium? Instead of lightweight and exotic metals (aluminum, magnesium, etc) they use cast iron, etc.


abcdabcd - 6/17/2008 3:28:34 AM
0 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
"Of course the oil companies are trying to kill diesel sales."
You`re wrong . In europe goverments with car makers are trying to enlarge diesel sales by adding them tax advantage . But now even tax advantage can`t help becouse peoples bought to many diesels and diesel fuel is now more expensive than petrol and peoples are coming back to petrol :

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/06/04/high-diesel-prices-and-pollution-concerns-put-off-potential-buye/

"A bit of surprising news comes from Germany, where one out of four diesel owners state that their next new car will likely be a gasoline vehicle, thanks in part to the complexity of owning a diesel and the high repair costs. Things even look worse for old models: those cars not fitted with Diesel Particulate Filters aren't likely to be purchased second hand (and will probably end up in Southern Europe), mostly due to the restrictions in some cities."



lexusrox123lexusrox123 - 6/17/2008 8:02:23 PM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
i still dont get why after years of diesel being cheaper than gasoline, the diesel gradually rose in price way faster than gas, so diesel prices were higher than gasoline's. diesel cars have to have better mpg's than ever before to offset the overly high diesel prices.


w209w114w209w114 - 6/16/2008 5:28:55 PMView My AgentSpace
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Daimler AG has already accused the Oil Industry for trying to sabotage the diesel uprising in the U.S. with high prices for a fuel which takes less time, energy, and costs less to produce than gasoline. It doesnt make any sense.

Diesel used to be cheaper, and still should be. What I wonder is why nobody has already raised this issue until now.


reply to this comment
w209w114w209w114 - 6/16/2008 5:30:10 PMView My AgentSpace
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
I got a 2 for 1!. Sumbmit once, and u get a bonus right under. Autospies.com still has some glitches that need to be looked at.


Designer1Designer1 - 6/18/2008 10:13:28 AM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Its not that just raising the price on the diesel that doesn’t make sense, but the gas too, there're truly no reasons, all this propaganda of high demand is bull shit, its nothing but greediness of the oil company owners who will never say enough. We used to say the government must do something, but now days the government is part of the gang too, so at whose direction do we need to scream?



EvoAudiEvoAudi - 6/16/2008 5:37:34 PMView My AgentSpace
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Depends if consumers are smart enough to figure out that driving certain diesel cars can save you money.

Most people i talk to about diesels just cring in fear of the more expensive gas unable to comprehend the logic that i feed them.


reply to this comment
S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 6/16/2008 6:27:43 PMView My AgentSpace
+5 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
You already wrote this article, 009.

w209 is completely right, and so is EvoAudi in saying that you just need to do the math. How much do you drive per year? How long do you plan on keeping the car? What kind of MPG does it get? You'll see if you save money.


reply to this comment
WhattheWhatthe - 6/16/2008 7:01:29 PM
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
I can't believe I'm saying this...but you my friend are right. People need to do the math.
By the way, diesel is $5.25 in NYS. Thanks Hillary.



S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 6/16/2008 10:14:37 PMView My AgentSpace
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Oh, I feel liberated, I finally have Whatthe's stamp of approval. I shall host a celebration. Pop the champagne cork.


S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 6/16/2008 6:36:27 PMView My AgentSpace
+8 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Or, ride a bike.

reply to this comment
EL34EL34 - 6/16/2008 6:36:46 PM
-2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
I don't give a damn about the environment.

I'll buy cars with styling I want.


reply to this comment
damikcodamikco - 6/16/2008 6:43:48 PMView My AgentSpace
+4 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Its sad but true, but when we all die the enviroment will repair itself. The earth has the means to clean it self since the earth was first formed.

reply to this comment
DieselRulesDieselRules - 6/16/2008 6:47:27 PM
0 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
if you cared about the environment you'd sign a petition to ban hybrid cars, or any electric cars based on huge amounts of rare materials that cannot be easily recycled.

But then, you'd also have to be smart enough to understand the big-picture and "whole product life-cycle" environmental impact ... something that seems beyond the Toyota Marketing trolls of Huu and MT.


reply to this comment
bimmerfan25bimmerfan25 - 6/16/2008 11:42:33 PM
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
LOL @ EL34- what a typical dumb right wing anti-environemtn bozo. Seriously, those conservative republicans or whatever the hell they're called are STUPID. My dog could run a country better than them.

reply to this comment
BoredBored - 6/17/2008 2:51:50 AM
-1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
And if YOU really cared about the environment, MichaelTaylor, you would chase a ball into the path of a moving Prius or LS600h -- stop being such a waste of existence!

BTW, nimrod, Toyota does make diesel engines.


reply to this comment
AlexTxAlexTx - 6/17/2008 3:14:54 AM
0 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Funny you should say that.
The Lexus Ls600 is the most over hyped Hybrid..
And the new Diesels coming from Europe are CLEANER than the Prius... that's right MichaelTaylor... the emit less CO2 than the Prius.
Let's not forget the batteries.... OUCH!!!


reply to this comment
HeyhuubHeyhuub - 6/17/2008 8:36:17 AM
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
I agree with EL34, i don't give a damn about how clean my car is.
The only reason why i drive a fuel efficient car is because fuel costs 1,60 euros per litre overhere.


reply to this comment
lexusrox123lexusrox123 - 6/17/2008 8:04:34 PM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
btw, i WISH gas was $3.79 a gallon!

reply to this comment
damikcodamikco - 6/16/2008 6:48:52 PMView My AgentSpace
+3 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Ive always said i wouldnt buy diesel because ove the price when evryone was preaching diesel it would be helpful if it was cheaper though. But as of now it is not the anser if evryone drove a diesel it would increase the demand wich in term would increase what?....... the price.

reply to this comment
BoredBored - 6/17/2008 11:11:16 PM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
@ damikco,

So are you suggesting not having more diesel options because of fear and assumptions?



olscuulolscuul - 6/16/2008 9:43:31 PM
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
diesel was cheaper than gas until vw introduced the tdi. amazingly, even thought not many were sold, the prices flipped the other way. this back around 2000.

reply to this comment
bimmerfan25bimmerfan25 - 6/16/2008 11:40:20 PM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
"The higher the price of crude oil, the more favourable will be the (second generation) hybrid. We see strong increases in hybrids starting from 2009. Gasoline engines combined with hybrid technology will beat the diesel. Plug-ins will further increase the advantage of the gasoline engine. Electric power is cheaper than fuel power. Around 2015, we expect in the U.S. that more than 40 percent of all new cars will be mild or strong hybrids, and at least 20 percent plug-ins," he said.

---------------------

Word. That's what I've been saying for years.

Germans need to wake up. Toyota has it right with the hybrids- they will dominate every market on the planet 10 years from now. You can bet your parents house on it. Anyone with half a brain can see that diesels solve absolutely nothing.


reply to this comment
SpectatorSpectator - 6/17/2008 11:38:42 AM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Very intersting comments.

I personally think this article was inherently biased towards gasoline hybrids as well. And as most people pointed out...all you have to do is the math. Unfortunatly most people don't do the math. The see that diesel is more expensive than gas (by a lot) and they instantly start equating that to the amount of fuel they put in their current gas vehicle. So their equation leads to this conclusion "Why would I want to pay more in gas for the same size car?!"

Wrong as it may be...this is the end result none the less. Leaving the conspiricy theory off the table that diesel prices might be "fixed" the whole consideration that there will not be a new refinery being built for another 3-5 year is highly suspect in and of itself. Why would we not expedite this process. We have plenty of infrastrucure and areas to place a refinery...why have we not built one already. As a matter of fact, why haven't we built one in the last 30 years? All of those are questions that talk to diesels having a problem.

Onto the final point...

Hybrids

While I am a diesel fan...I don't hate hybrids. Now before I get slamed by my fellow diesel fans, let me explain.

Current Hybrids, the Honda and the Toyota Pious ;-), are not the hybrids I speak of. They use gas engines to power the vehicle. This is increadibly inefficient and sucks power like a vacum cleaner. The better option would be a diesel hybrid or even better bio-diesel hybrid. However not in the manner most people expect.

Like I said using the petrol engine to drive the vehicle is inefficient in a hybrid. Having the battery drive the vehicle is the way to produce more power and maintain high mpg. The fuel engine you would need would not be connected to the cars drive shaft at all. It would be connect to the battery alone. Acting only as a generator. Now as for why I said diesel or bio-diesel...fuel engines produce an optimal power output at a specific RPM, this is why we look at powerbands on a dyno. If you want to run an engine a long time at a consistant rate you want two things 1. Low RPM (this reduces wear and tear not to mention consumption) 2. High Torque...

Enter the diesel engine. This combination along with plug in capability at home would allow you to drastically change the structure of a vehicle to match any shape your imagination could come up with. Because the engine would act as a generator to recharge the battery when the plug-in charge ran low...all it would have to be size of a medium sized microwave oven. Which could be placed anywhere in your design. This would give you all the benifits you could possible want without sacrificing anything.

Well enough of my $.02


reply to this comment
monkeyrunmonkeyrun - 6/17/2008 6:10:09 PM
+1 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
Not really, if I am looking for something that's fuel efficient and sporty I'll buy a diesel.

Gasoline hybrid is only good for daily commute (to be more specific .. to work).


reply to this comment
huu76huu76 - 6/18/2008 12:09:49 AM
+2 BoostDrop the Boost Up the Boost
monkeyrun,
What are most cars used for? Daily commute to work because most people have jobs (unless it was outsourced to China to avoid environmental laws).

w209,
Why wasn't Germany complaining when diesel was $0.499/L and gas was $0.65/L and that was without government subsidies or tax preference (our fuel is taxed basically at the same rate).
Diesel prices here are $1.449/L, or nearly $6/gallon. This only happened because people started buying into the diesel fad, imagine how high diesel will be if they bought into diesel+fibre fad.

If anything, oil companies should be killing hybrids as they require only 1/2 the oil that a diesel burns.


reply to this comment

To post a comment for this story, you must first Login.

If you do not have an account, you will need to Register (It's Free!).

Most Recent Stories
BMW M Gmbh Sales Exceed Figures Of Entire Previous Year Already In August 2008Smart ForTwo MHD Named Germany's Most Cost-Efficient CarDo You Still Qualify? Many Car Loans Now Require At Least A 720 FICO For Basic Financing!European Auto Makers Ask For $55 Billion In Loans To Meet New StandardsDo You Agree? Clarkson Declares The Chysler Sebring As The Worst Car In The World. Audi reconsidering A1 for the U.S. marketVideo: Honda Insight Hybrid in actionMazda Kiyora to spawn Mazda1Honda's Prius rival will cost less than $19,000BMW cancels X7 luxury SUVMercedes will outdo Lexus 8-speed auto with new dual-clutch New 2013 Baby Porsche2009 BMW 7-Series Photo Gallery: 001 Says '7' Won't Be A Lucky Number For Mercedes, Lexus, Audi And The Others2009 Vw Golf VI by H&RThe Best of Paris - Agent 00J Picks His Favorites, But Is Your Favorite On The List?Audi Take Incredible Petit Le Mans WinAston Martin DBS receives Touchtronic 2 transmission, 2 plus 2 Seating and Bang & Olufson stereoPorsche Wins the American Le Mans Series LMP2 Class and GT2 Class Driver's Championships as well as the GT2 Team ChampionshipVideo: Renault Z.E. Concept2008 Paris Motor Show: Citroen 2CV by Hermes2008 Paris Motor Show: Mazda Kiyora conceptLamborghini’s Bull Kicks Dirt at Porsche and Aston Martin – But Will Rapide and Panamera Wave The White Flag of Surrender?Video: Lexus IS 250CParis Motor Show: Venturi Volage Electric ConceptGTbyCitroen makes its debut in Gran Turismo 5 PrologueParis 2008: Honda Insight Concept RevealedParis 2008: Audi A1 SportbackParis 2008: The Nissan Nuvu ConceptParis 2008: All-New Toyota AvensisParis 2008: The Mazda Kiyora Concept City CarParis 2008: Chevrolet Cruze UnveiledParis 2008: Audi A4 TDI concept eParis 2008: The Aston Martin One-77 supercarParis 2008: Renault Megane Trophy2010 Ford Mustang Teaser Number 8Paris 2008: The speedy Jaguar XKR-SParis 2008: Mercedes-Benz Concept FASCINATIONParis 2008: Pininfarina B0Paris 2008: The 2009 Ford KaParis 2008: The Opel Insignia ecoFLEXParis 2008: Suzuki Alto City CarParis 2008: Peugeot Prologue ConceptClio Renaultsport R3 AccessParis 2008: Peugeot RC HYmotion4 ConceptDriven: 2009 Vauxhall InsigniaToyota introduces first rear-window curtain airbag.The Cars of Paris: Look But Don’t Touch (Cause They Aren’t Coming Here)South-Africa’s Electric Car - The Joule2009 Volkswagen Golf GTI comes to Paris with 5-doorsFerrari CEO says that it will not do a four-door sedan