AutoWeek Readers' Choice Awards

I prefer a fully loaded Buick Lucerne myself.

— EL34i (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 10:39:19 PM | | Votes: -6   

I prefer a fully loaded Buick Lucerne myself.

— EL34i (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 10:40:06 PM | | Votes: -6   

BEST EXOTIC
1995 Buick Riviera

BEST LUXURY CAR
Buick Lucerne

BEST ECONOMY CAR
Buick Century

— EL34i (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 10:44:41 PM | | Votes: -10   

The average price for it is probably about $30K.

And the reason it's the best is because it has a nicer interior, it's much cooler looking, and much better to drive than most compacts. It has a price premium for a reason.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 9:26:19 PM | | Votes: -3   

The A3 actually starts at 25,340.00 according to their website.

— johannas (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 10:05:30 AM | | Votes: 2   

You can quote base price on any car but the fact is, the A3 is $35k with the options, including DSG, tech, open sky, upgraded stereo, cold weather. I don't think the A3 is premium for any reason other than Audi greed.

— audiot (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 11:04:55 AM | | Votes: -3   

"the A3 is $35k with the options, including DSG, tech, open sky, upgraded stereo, cold weather. I don't think the A3 is premium for any reason other than Audi greed."

Mine has all of those options, and the sticker was actually $31K. A special bodykit was added by Audi, bringing it up to $35K (not an S-Line).

And no, it does have a premium for a reason. Like I said, it's infinitely better to drive, much more stylish, and expertly crafted compared to most compacts.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 7:22:03 PM | | Votes: 1   

Caltrans are u from europe?

— CarNut (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 10:18:10 AM | | Votes: 2   

If you read extra-close, it said "Best People Mover/ SUV"
So it was the Honda

-

I do kinda think that "Economy Car" dosen't exactly fit the A3.....should have gone to the Fit/Versa/Yaris/Accent category...

— mstangpny07 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 9:52:26 PM | | Votes: 2   

(Smirk) It's not like the LS or 7 Series are better.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 9:58:18 PM | | Votes: -2   

"S4, didn't you just call the S-Class the greatest car in the world? What kind of paralell universe are you living in in which the hideous S-Class and outdated A8 are the best in the class?"

Well, most people would agree with me that the S-Class is truly the best car in the world. That's at least what the journalists have been saying.

A8? Outdated? You can't be serious. Its interior is still much fresher than the LS's bland interior design. The LS is really not nice enough to be considered "special" for this class. S-Class, Vanden Plas, A8L and 750Li just make you feel richer when you ride in them.

"It also is available with the most luxurious rear-seating configuration this side of a Maybach."

Well, I'd say the A8 has a much better view from the front, especially with its James Bond-like flip-up screen. Electronically adjustable and massaging rear seats are also available on the A8L and A8L W12.

"The LS can virtually park itself!

It also has an 8-Speed transmission!"

Neither of these make a real difference in every day life. Park assist is a worthless feature, and as if the seven-speed weren't enough, eight speeds is outrageous. It's not faster than the S-Class, and its fuel economy figures don't justify the extra cog.

"It also has the best price."

Not really. Like I said, lexus.com does not let you UNCHECK an option box- there's always at least one package checked. The actual base price of the LS460 is $67K, with the LS460L coming in at $77K. Neither of them have the park-assist standard.

"It also is guaranteed to have high-quality and reliability. It IS a LEXUS afterall..."

Everything else in this class has quality. XJ8 is just as reliable as the LS430 was, oddly enough, and S-Class reliability ratings haven't been released yet.

"The only thing you can dispute are the looks. And let's just say that the new LS is cleaner and more streamlined than the S-Class, and more intriguing to look at than the A8."

The difference here is that the LS kind of tries to imitate the A8. I am not saying they copied it. But, they try to get that simple, elegant look that the A8 pulls off very well. A black A8L with 19" wheels doesn't need much visual pizzaz (chrome, huge exhausts, etc) to make it beautiful. It's truly a timeless piece, and fits like a glove with every stitch perfectly in place, like an Armani suit. The LS, on the other hand, seems a bit contrived. Yes, I've seen two on the street. I like the exhausts, but the front end is its worst angle. It has oddly-shaped, Toyota-esque headlights that don't stray far enough from past LS's, and the side is just a big slab of metal. It simply does not appeal to me.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/1/2006 11:50:59 PM | | Votes: -4   

I think Larry is what he said bout the A8L + a kid

— CarNut (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 10:19:41 AM | | Votes: 0   

now that will has told us what the lexus has compared to the S class, which is that it can park itself (not really) and has eight useless gears.

lets see what the S-Class has that the lexus doesnt.

s550 has:

more hp
more torque
faster 0-60
teleaid vehicle location system STANDARD
better telematics
hand free/voice activated phone (n/a on LS)
vehicle theft notification STANDARD
second row side airbags STANDARD
still 3 inches longer than a LS460L

theres other things that are standard on the S-class which are optional on the LS460.

so if you add up the same options that the S comes with standard. the prices would be more similar

— luvmybmr (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 11:16:13 AM | | Votes: 1   

Apparantly, the readers of Autoweek disagree with you.

— smshnick (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 11:53:59 AM | | Votes: 1   

"The reason you don't like Lexus interiors is because they are functional, just face it. There is no disputing the use of high-quality materials, you could argue "silly plastic" but I'd just remind you of the brittle plastic in BMW, and the coarse plastic of Mercedes."

No, they lack distinction! I could say this over and over and over again, and you wouldn't listen! The LS's interior is not that nice for this class! It has what is essentially the same design as the IS's- and it works well in the IS, but you need your ultra-luxury car to have a more special interior. And there's no cheap plastics in the A8... or the S-Class, now that I think about it.

"MMI, COMAND, iDrive, all fine for whomever wants to learn how to use them and be bothered with them, but for the rest of us, there is nothing wrong with being able to operate a function with the press of ONE BUTTON, and not hassle with a submenu."

Oh, the horrors of using a computer, I know, Will! I haven't had a lot of seat time with neither iDrive nor COMAND, but MMI has been portrayed as being the best of the three, and in reality, it's pretty intuitive. I kind of like the less cluttered computer-ish dash more than the button-filled kinds.

"And you simply cannot be taken seriously about Jaguar reliability, or any of them for that matter. JD Power, Consumer Reports, and nearly all the rest rank Lexus higher. How many times must we go over that?"

Like I said, I was surprised by this- but the XJ has reliability that's apparently on par with your beloved LS430, according to your beloved JD Power. It's far and away the most reliable Jag ever. The new XK remains to be seen.

"Say what you want about the styling. Aside from the grotesquely-out-of-place grille, there is nothing particularly visually-stimulating about the A8, which ironically is the same argument you ave used against previous-generation LSs."

Actually, just about every publication has said the A8's grille fits it quite well. It completes the styling, in my opinion. What the A8 has, but the LS lacks, is an overall sense of elegance. From the shape of the A8's taillights, to the size of the chrome trim on the side, the car is just overflowing with timeless, understated elegance. I'm not biased when I say this- I can't say the same about the LS. It would be great if I could.

"The new LS's interior is understated yet bold, clean yet cohesive, linear yet intriguing. The same just simply cannot be said about the bloated S-Class, and the nonexistant lines of the A8."

This is confusing. At first you talk about the LS's interior, than the others' exterior? The LS's interior is, like I said, pretty average for this class. Nothing special. S-Class's interior is cleaner and more exquisitely crafted, and the A8's interior is easily the best in class, still. It's the sexiest interior ever put in a sedan under $100K.

And I would say that the LS is pretty invisible on the street. Have you seen one? From the rear three-quarte

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 7:32:51 PM | | Votes: 0   

"The A8 however, has lots of buttons AND MMI."

The A8 actually only has about five buttons on the dash board, besides the MMI. They're for ESP, Cruise Control and A/C I believe.

"so do Audi's interiors, across the board. Even the instrument clusters all look alike!"

Not exactly. Lexus has come up with this new Asian interior theme lately, and IMHO, they're overdoing it. Audi designed the A8's interior with an extra amount of elegance in mind- the A4 and A6 have nowhere near as much beautiful wood or smart touches (like the special lighting under the seats or the electric screen) as the A8.

"And the LS is not invisiblle "on the street." What does that mean by the way? I'd say more people would notice the LS for its shape than they would the A8. Actually, they might would notice an A8 first for its over-exaggerated grille."

Well, I don't think you've actualy seen one. Like I said, I saw two. I almost didn't notice, but took a second glance. I was, unfortunately, unimpressed. It seems like a half-hearted attempt by Lexus's designers.

I think most people would agree with me that the A8's grille fits in quite nicely- especially in darker colors. It just completes that Armani-ish well-tailored look.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 12:11:59 AM | | Votes: 0   

"The LS looks more interesting than the A8, it evokes more appeal, and it overall is a bolder statement than the A8."

Hmm... again, subjective. The LS just doesn't appeal to me.

And I've sat in an A8L interior, and it's the most beautiful interior in any sedan under $100K, as I said. I said, BTW, that BESIDES THE MMI, there are about five buttons on the dash. And, the MMI really does not detract from the elegance of the car's craftsmanship, but the LS's buttons (not even soft-touch plastic, just plain, shiny, nasty plastic) cheapen the interior quite a bit.

I just see the LS's design and character as an A8 impersonator. Before, it was the S-Class hearse sedan, and now, it's an A8 personality. They tried to imitate the A8's flawless design that looks pure from every angle, and there's not one panel on the car that I dislike. The LS seems half-hearted. I could keep repeating myself, but of course you wouldn't listen. The front end is very, very boring. I'd rather have the larger grille (which I like) than have my car looking like an odd reincarnation of a huge Toyota Camry. It's not a class-leader by any means. However, there is no clear leader in this class. It's based on personal preference.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/4/2006 12:34:24 AM | | Votes: 1   

WILL- READ MY COMMENT! WOW! I SAID THAT besides the mmi THERE ARE FIVE BUTTONS ON THE DASHBOARD!!! And they are SOFT TOUCH plastic, unlike the cheap, shiny plastic in the LS!

"And now you're claiming that Lexus copied AUDI with their new LS?

Anything to make you feel that much better about the uninspiring A8, I guess."

I blatantly stated that it WASN'T copying the A8 in one of my earlier posts- it just seems like they're trying to get the same elegant symmetry that the A8 pulls off, but they failed.

A8, boring, and Lexus not? In your dreams.

The A8's interior really is still better, especially design-wise. I could say this seven hundred times, and you're still going to block it out of your mind- the LS's interior looks cheap for a $70K+ luxury sedan. It may not feel cheap, but it looks it. The VW Phaeton's interior looks more polished.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 2:11:57 AM | | Votes: 1   

Yes, and you still think that Lexus makes the best interiors... I'm done. I am so sick of this. I'd take an A8L W12 or LS600hL over a 760Li any day of the week.

Here is one thing I read, though, which makes me love the A8 even more:

"Even without the optional fridge, the A8 L W12 appointments are hard to complain about. This car coddles its occupants in supreme comfort and surrounds them in artful design, meticulous construction and the latest gadgetry. Its interior is also incredibly quiet. We once parked the A8 2 feet from a catastrophically loud diesel generator and were oblivious to it until we opened a door.

Still, as the Audi successfully isolates you from the harsh outside world, it allows you to interact with it at the same time. Audi understands that its customers, even its most wealthy customers, want to feel the road and enjoy the drive, so the A8 L W12 never feels stodgy like many six-figure cars tend to. Its steering has life and its air suspension, even in the softest setting of its four, has a sporting edge."

That sums up the car perfectly. It's from edmunds.com's Insideline. Here's the page:

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Followup/articleId=106174#2

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 2:55:19 PM | | Votes: 1   

STOP here for a minute!

I actually don't see anything blandish looks on a Lexus. Folks, don't be so judgemental by staring at your little monitor for like 5 seconds and deciding to putdown a Lexus LS460, calling it brand.

Fact is this: Most car enthusiast at your local magazine commentaries will say its look too brand.

Truth is this: Most folks in the U.S. are absolutely stunned by its looks and bank vault reputations of the past and take comfort knowing its parent Co. is the Toyota.


The design is L-finesse. Simplicity and functional. "highest aerodynamic luxury car, period".

Form follows function, L-finesse.



Lexus forever.

— Homer008 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 9:40:59 AM | | Votes: 1   

Jugnu- It isn't the best. There is no "best" in this category. It is all personal opinion. Even in reviews it's an opinion. For it not to be an opinion you would have to have something non-human do the testing. God, why can't you people just recckognize their is more than one good car company. The reason they exist is to fill different wants/needs. How would you like to go to the grocery store and only find Cheerios in the Cereal aisle. You might like them but I thank God every day for Raisen Bran. Of course this is just an opinion.

— iown1 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 3:54:28 PM | | Votes: 3   

I used to ask myself that when i was an audi hater...
but after i drove it i changed my mind completely.. u cant really describe it

For example people always say that A6 is pretty much a short A8 that looks slightly better... i like that since i have one myself ;) but if u step from a 3.0 tdi A8 into a 3.0tdi A6(my car) its just totally different... comfortable, fast, has good handling, quick,... i cant describe it. go for a test drive with both and ull know what im talking about .. and make sure u get one with the new bang & ulfsen sound system ;)

— CarNut (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 5:22:49 PM | | Votes: 0   

i way prefer the a8 in this class, perhaps even over the s class. yes, i prefer it over the s class. therefore for me the A8 is the best in the class. i don't like bmw's styling and idrive, i don't like lexus's styling or plastic interior (after they learnt how to make soft touch plastic they decide to stick it everywhere), and the s class/a8 is really just a choice.
and carnut, the a6 3.0 tdi is one cool car. how quick is it?

— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 6:09:27 PM | | Votes: 1   

You know jugnu- I gave it some more thought. I think you're asking the wrong question to get your answer. You should ask "What doesn't the A8 do to make it the best?"

Here's a short list of what it doesn't do...

It doesn't rely on trends.

It doesn't srceam look at me, I'm rich.

It doesn't use gimmics.

It doesn't offend it's existing customers. Etc.

I think I respect this car more for what it isn't than what it is. Even though it can hold its own and then some with the competition, even for years later.

I'm not saying it's better than the competition, I just find it easy to understand why its timeless,elegant design is still appreciated while others in this class haven't faired as well.

— iown1 (View Profile)

Posted on 11/2/2006 6:32:46 PM | | Votes: 0   

"Actually, all of that is what makes people overlook the Audi A8, and go for the 7-Series and S-Class typically. The Lexus LS has traditionally fitted every single one of those characteristics you just mentioned, however, the all new LS has gained a new attitude and has joined the ranks of the latter two, leaving the A8 a lone sheep."

That's a little harsh. The A8 still easily is the most luxurious in its class, and, judging by AutoWeek readers, the best. The LS still looks pretty boring to me. The LS460's "base" price is lower for a reason- you get what you pay for. With the A8, it's the cost of exclusivity, a breathtaking interior and timeless style.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 12:14:46 AM | | Votes: -2   

^ i think acura has the most fairly priced cars.

— luvmybmr (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 10:43:25 AM | | Votes: 1   

hell yea im very pleased with my acura, 04 TL to be exact, and i love my 330ci. acura is way better than lexus. :)

— luvmybmr (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 2:11:34 PM | | Votes: 1   

well sir, when did the es350 come out and when did the TL come out? i dont recall an es350 in 2004, oh yeh but there was a sorry little es 330, with about 225 hp compared to the TLs original 270, hmm, and over looks (interior and exterior) TL is a way better looking car, its very full of life unlike the ES. Interior wise TL offered a lot more features than the es330. oh and lets not forget the drivability, way better then the es330.

to compare the new '07 es350 to the '04 TL, umm.. whats next, your 03 LS compared to a new s-class..
pleasee..

— luvmybmr (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 3:05:14 PM | | Votes: 1   

for your information sir,

whats so much better about the IS/ES then a TL? please explain.

and secondly rs4 is a v8, and beats the current m3 stats by a thin line, have patience for the v8 m3 to come out. and we'll see what happens. and what ever happened to the v8 IS?

why is lexus tryin to stick its nose where it doesnt belong. they should start off small and then come and try to play with the big dogs. :)

— luvmybmr (View Profile)

Posted on 11/3/2006 6:59:07 PM | | Votes: 1   

IMHO, it's...

BEST INTERIOR: A8L

BEST INTERIOR QUALITY: A8L

BEST DRIVING EXPERIENCE: 7 SERIES

WORST INTERIOR: LS460

WORST DRIVING EXPERIENCE: Hmm... they all drive pretty well for large sedans

BEST OVERALL: S-CLASS / A8 TIE

I know the Lexus fans will bash me for saying I dislike the LS's interior. But, in reality, it's not special enough on the inside to be the nicest in this class.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/4/2006 10:33:54 AM | | Votes: 1   

"A8L is bland, overpriced, and its interior is not the best in the class. You keep talking about how "special" an interior in this class must feel, well I fail to see what's so "special" about how the A8's interior resembles every other VAG product with just acres of fake-looking wood plastered everywhere."

Ha! You're reverting to calling the A8 cheap-looking! Wow!

That is pretty sad, especially when you've admitted before how nice the interior is... it's undeniable. And yes, I really would like my car to make me feel special if I paid this amount of money for it. Therefore, I'm never going to buy a Lexus LS460. Happy?

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 2:14:29 AM | | Votes: 1   

"I didn't say the A8's interior looked cheap necessarily, I meant that in terms of layout and design, it resembles everything else from VAG. Take a look at all the instrument clusters/dials/gagues: they all look alike!"

I think Lexus interiors pretty closely resemble some Toyota interiors, too. It's bound to happen.

And what separates the A8 from others in VAG is its acres and acres of wood- it makes the interior look like a five-star hotel. The quality is also right up there with its Bentley cousins.

And the gauges are simple and cool-looking. Nothing wrong with that. But I have to ask- have you studied the gauges of cars in the VW Group?

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 2:58:26 PM | | Votes: 1   

You said the A8's inteiror wood looked fake.

Look at this picture, and then talk to me:

http://www.autofotos.com/2006%20Audi%20A8L%20W12%20Dashboard.jpg

Now, look at this picture, and compare them side by side. Notice which one looks better:

http://www.carbuyersnotebook.com/archives/2007ls460int.jpg

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 3:17:39 PM | | Votes: 1   

You have to admit, the LS interior still just doesn't look as good. What I showed you wasn't an audiusa image- that was a lexus.com image, though.

I don't know what you see in this car's interior, but it's not all that great.

The A8's design inside is sharper, more elegant, more flowing, less plasticky (and more wood-y), blah, blah, blah...

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/7/2006 10:37:27 PM | | Votes: 1   

"A8 defetas it in slalom, though S class with 4wd comes in at very close time to the A8, cuz its shorter and more manuvarable"

Actually, the S-Class is longer than the A8L, I believe.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/4/2006 12:38:06 AM | | Votes: 1   

Yes, the S-Class interior, especially in black, looks almost spartan next to the A8/7 Series/LS/XJ interiors. They simplified it TOO much- a luxury sedan should have buttons! I feel like the A8 has the perfect medium of just enough buttons in all the right places. The S-Class doesn't have enough, and the LS has too much.

— S4cabriofox (View Profile)

Posted on 11/5/2006 3:00:36 PM | | Votes: 1