80 Votes

Lexus GS 350 vs. Hyundai Genesis V8: Has Hyundai Out-Lexus Lexus?

Agent009 submitted on 8/18/2008 Official Bell & Ross Timestamp: 11:25:45 AM

184 user comments | Category: Reviews | Source: | SOURCE: www.edmunds.com

It's almost hard to write: Lexus vs.

Hyundai. That's the New York Yankees taking on the Albuquerque Isotopes — same game, different leagues.

It's pitting an exalted brand name to which millions aspire, up against the bargain brand millions settle for. And yet despite that, putting the 2008 Lexus GS 350 up against Hyundai's audacious new 2009 Genesis 4.6 in a luxury sedan throw-down has resulted in one of the closest finishes ever in an Inside Line heads-up comparison test.

Yes, the Hyundai Genesis holds its own quite well against the Lexus GS 350 — without all that pesky prestige

Thanks to bwmdrvr for the tip!

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Lexus GS 350 vs. Hyundai Genesis V8: Has Hyundai Out-Lexus Lexus?

About the Author

"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough."
— Agent009 (View Profile)

User Comments

Nobody is buying Lexus in Japan because everyone there knows it's rebadged Toyota.
— NewBeginning (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:39:06 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 12

And that goes the same for Mercedes & BMW in the U.S., Lexus is the #1 selling Luxury Brand in the U.S. No one wants a rebadge S-Class-Smart-For2 nor a rebadge 7-Series-Mini-Cooper...

And a lot of people would choose a Toyota anyday over a Mini Cooper and a Smart for2...
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:48:19 AM | | Votes: -46

An S-Class is not related to the Smart in anyway besides being owned by the same company.

Same applies to BMW 7 - Mini Cooper

I'm suprised you're not embarassed after your comment was posted at the bottom of the page of the article about the great Japanese Mercedes-Benz fan.
— Carboy (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:52:06 AM | | Votes: 18

Silver1- Look at BMW's sales REAL close for 2008. They are GOING to over take Lexus this year in US sales, it is just a matter of time. So pretty soon that argument will need to be revised.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:53:46 AM | | Votes: 13

silver1 is an idiot. The 7 series is not related to a mini cooper in any way. The S-class has nothing in common with a Smart. Lexus, however uses the same headlamp/wiper/cruise control stalks from the Toyota Corolla. And the same gated shifter from the Camry and Avalon.
— pushrod27 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:11:40 PM | | Votes: 16

Thank you Homer......

A lot of people are happy that there Lexus is own by Toyota Motor Corporation. Can't say the same for Mini Cooper BMW peoples and Smart Cars S-Class people. They might be shame cause they do know it's horrible...
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:12:14 PM | | Votes: -23

you're totally right silver.

just stick an S550 badge on a smart and any reasonable person would confuse the two cars.

just like the camry and ES. or LX and land cruiser. or RX and harrier.
— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:16:39 PM | | Votes: 11

Silver:

The reason they don't share parts is because doing so would kill the prestige of BMW and Benz (which Lexus can only dream about).
Enjoy your rebadged Camry.

S-Klasse has always been regarded as the leader in its class. The LS has always been known to copy it.
— audirevolution (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:16:58 PM | | Votes: 14

Homer:

Using a GM-tranny and Mitsubishi turbos aren't as noticeable as using the same exact interior parts, engines, and design. If I weren't a car enthusiast, I would have never known that my BMW 335i was using Mitsubishi turbos. However, the Lexus LX is OBVIOUSLY a LandCruiser. The ES is obviously a Camry. The IS, GS, and LS all have similar interiors to the Highlander/Camry. The LS has many design cues from the Camry.

Oh yes! Just like how BMW copied the Lexus LS bangle-butt and the Lexus GS hoffmeister-kink!

Copying features is natural, after all, what would we do without ABS or airbags? The competition has to one-up eachother every generation (better for the consumer). Technically, everyone copied Benz for the first "modern"-era automobile.
Lexus, however, copies styling. The first generation LS was a complete rip of the S-Klasse. The newer LS has many BMW design cues, especially from the 5er.
— audirevolution (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:50:15 PM | | Votes: 3

You Lexus fanboys... Like to cause trouble. Why is an S-Class mentioned in a Lexus vs. Hyundai comparison. Too embarrassed that Hyundai is even mentioned in the same sentence?

Hyundai's are great value for money. I saw one in person on the road and it's by far the best Hyundai ever built. Give credit where credit is due otherwise all your ranting will come and bite you in the ass.
— Agent63 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 3:21:06 AM | | Votes: 3

Don't forget GM is working with Toyota on some developments.
— Agent63 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 8:06:28 AM | | Votes: 3

What Japanese do well, Koreans do better.
— NewBeginning (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 9:43:51 AM | | Votes: 4

Lexus sales are up in Japan.
— truthpursuit (View Profile)

Posted on 8/22/2008 8:20:35 PM | | Votes: 1

I wish the article had compared 6-cylinder engines in both the Acura and the Hyundai. I'd be interested in real-world mileage in the 6-cylinder Hyundai (measured during routine driving, not performance testing).
— blackbr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:39:56 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

Agree. The V8 model is not much faster than the V6 model; it is offered in U.S. to satisfy big engine fans. Basically the review says that the performance of GS is little better but does not worth extra money. The V6 model could have won this comparison with even bigger margin.
— TopGear (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:33:22 PM | | Votes: 1

^^^Whoops, Lexus and Hyundai, I've got Acura on the brain for some reason.
— blackbr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:40:22 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

Asian luxury sedan battle......
— hao420 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 10:44:10 PM | | Votes: 1

I can't wait to see how long this thread gets...
— golfer38 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:46:36 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3

80+
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:50:02 AM | | Votes: -19

Me too.. So funny the way Lexus fans defend themselves against being compared to Hyundai, yet they think it is OK to compare themselves to MB, BMW and Audi...
— BMW3forMe (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 4:05:28 PM | | Votes: 4

Are these cars even in the same class?
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:50:58 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -20

Most important thing is Genesis won!
— NewBeginning (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:53:49 AM | | Votes: 7

Good question. The Genesis fits in between the ES and the GS I believe.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:54:50 AM | | Votes: -4

technically no they arent,but i guess for the sake of comparison you could compare them....on a side note good job to Hyundai on winning...but...if you ACTUALLY READ the article(which i tried posting earlier), it would appear Edmunds wasnt very impressed with it..in fact it won by such a small margin, with the HUGE price difference being what garnered it the SLIGHT win....which saids they have along way to go still in creating a luxury car...but in reality Hyundai didnt intend for this car to compete with the GS but with the 300, and G8.....
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:18:37 PM | | Votes: 9

yes, they are in the same class in many objective terms and the prices aren't that far apart. the genesis is simply the value version of the lexus. sound familiar?
— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:19:48 PM | | Votes: -5

no they arent in the same class.....because for one the V8 GS is a nicely optioned Elantra a way from the price of this Genesis....not to mention if you are simply comparing 35-40,000 sedans with luxury car aspirations that would make the Avalon, Passat, Lucerne, Maxima, and 300 all in the near luxury class and they certainly arent...not defending Lexus but I mean lets be logical here Hyundai had no intentions of this being a head to head competitor with the near luxury class cars.......and it does sound very familiar like another company that wants to be a luxury company and it is neither polished, refined, premium, lacking in interior quality, and blandly styled like it could be anything, and winning on price alone.....
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:30:41 PM | | Votes: -2

bmwdrvr - Forgot to give you an acknowledgment for the tip. It is in there now, please accept my apology.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:50:33 PM | | Votes: 2

bmwdrvr- I think the ONLY reason the Genesis is being compared to the GS is the fact that Hyundai intended it to be in the market.

Now the fact that it falls somewhere in between the ES and GS in features will open the door to such comparisons.

The bigger question might actually be, why did it favor so well against a proven GS series? Logic would dictate then that it may outclass the ES all together.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:53:41 PM | | Votes: 2

I've tested the genesis and the only thing they have on Lexus to me is the Blue hue of lighting on the inside at night, and softer leather seats (The softest I have ever felt).....

I have yet to test the Lexicon vs. Mark Levinson sound system, but i'm pretty sure Mark will win....
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:55:44 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -14

I have been meaning to go out and test drive this car. I will judge for myself :-)
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:58:19 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 7

Looks like Lexus has some work to do. Good job Hyundai!
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:09:20 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

Hyundai...Lexus what's the difference...
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:16:20 PM | | Votes: -3

Well if you can't tell the difference then you really aren't qualified to post anything here are you?
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:26:05 PM | | Votes: 3

LE43,

well you just said in your previous post that Hyundai is better. Is that the result of your expertise in this matter? You are good.(sarcasm)
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:55:05 PM | | Votes: 2

And just where did I say that Hyundai is better than Lexus? All I said was that Lexus has some work to do. Your problem is that you jump to conclusions before actually analyzing something and then responding. You have dont this many times here and it just lowers your credibility. And please, by writing my name as LE43 as you have these past couple of days you make yourself look even inept.
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:52:39 PM | | Votes: 3

I said a few weeks ago, Hyundai and Kia are what Toyota have to worry about in the future, because they will do a "Toyota" to Toyota. The Koreans will build a quality competitive appliance that appeals to the middle classes and take away market share from Toyota. A Lexus buying is not interested in "The Badge" the way a Mercedes, BMW, Audi or Jaguar buyer is, they are interested in reliability, value for money and hassle free ownership.
— steve27t (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:10:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6

neither are Audi buyers.....
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:19:58 PM | | Votes: 3

bmwdrvr:

Audi is highly regarded outside of the USA. In Europe and Asia, Audi is a Tier 1 brand just on the heels of BMW/Merc. In the U.S., Audis image is rising rapidly and will be considered Tier 1 within the next few years. Of course, you're too blind to see that.
— audirevolution (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:37:57 PM | | Votes: -3

ok for one I didnt trash Audi....but since thats what you expect...i guess you thought I was that amazinbimmer guy.....on the heels of BMW/Mercedes means they arent Tier 1....they just arent maybe tier 2 but certainly not tier 1...it wasnt until the first A4 (which ironically was after the creation of Lexus) that Audi decided to go head to head with the TIER 1 crowd....hence the Audi commercial where there are 3 brands---Lexus, BMW, and Mercdes (Tier 1), and Audi is saying to try something different....(tier 2)
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:53:08 PM | | Votes: 3

Audi in Europe is regarded on same level as BMW and Merc. In the UK in 2007 Audi sales surpassed BMW.
— steve27t (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:57:59 PM | | Votes: 3

"A Lexus buying is not interested in "The Badge" the way a Mercedes, BMW, Audi or Jaguar buyer is, they are interested in reliability, value for money and hassle free ownership."

That argument is totally laughable. LOL.... If that were truly the case Toyota would not have spent the millions in marketing over the last twenty years to have a LEXUS BADGE on a Toyota. It has been my experience that many Lexus owners only bought one because of the badge, not realizing there is a comparable Toyota. BTW MB and BMW have always been just that, what ever they are today is the result of years of development, not marketing.
— mpwr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:55:04 PM | | Votes: 3

so did VW's that doesnt make them Tier 1 and I can promise you not every European regards them the same......read reviews on the Audi cars, and you will see even they dont care much for all of them...and often mention the BMW, or Merc equivalents offering more prestige.......as far as America even Audi knows they arent tier 1 find the Audi commercial for the A5.....
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 6:22:39 PM | | Votes: 0

Hyundai...Lexus what's the difference...

— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:16:41 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

Star...EL34 what's the difference...
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:27:46 PM | | Votes: 0

LE43,

what is wrong with you buddy? Find something else to relieve your stress other then replying to every post I make with some insult. Are you an adult? Don't you realise how pathetic you look staying on my a** all the time. Bring something original to the table. Ah yeah...you could not even find a user name for yourself without copying other user(EL34). Are you not ashamed of yourself? Stop living like a parasite attached to a host around here. Get a life!
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:44:11 PM | | Votes: -8

OMG this guy is too funny!
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:47:10 PM | | Votes: 0

My opinion about hyundai genesis : What`s a point in getting a car that is agglutination of parts from their competitors , doesn`t offer something better or some new technology or what ever new or unigue styling , what`s more it`s even looking like their competitors ( e.g. inside like infinity , backlight like bmw , grill like mercedes and more ) . First lexus ls400 was at least upgraded , more relible copy of mercedes s class , genesis isn`t even upgraded version of cars that it copies , so it`s like buying this chinese copy of fiat panda or whatever chinese copy . It`s simply a stealing from hyundai when they do the same as competitors even not upgraded only 5 years later . It may be the best in their very attractive price range but it not better than more expensive cars it copies . I think in near future chinese will also do quite good copy of some premium brand car .
— abcd (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:17:32 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

everything you just said was true of the first LS. it was a total copy of an S-class. where it was really different was in the level of dealer service (mercedes was horrible at the time).
— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:23:54 PM | | Votes: -3

Actually in 1994 Mercedes-Benz got #1 on the JD Power Service awards.
— Carboy (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:32:35 PM | | Votes: 2

the truth is that these are both sedate luxury sedans. there's nothing fun about either of them. this quote from the article sums it up...

"But ultimate speed isn't what these sedans are all about. These aren't sport sedans like the BMW 5 Series or Infiniti M that engage the road and then go about the business of filleting it. They're luxury machines first, with just enough feedback through their controls to keep the driver from nodding off."
— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:25:01 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

^and isnt it ridiculous how on this site its always BMW vs. Lexus, when it should be BMW vs. Infiniti?
— M35MT (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:58:41 PM | | Votes: 4

it's true.

infiniti is the natural japanese competitor to bmw.
as lexus is to mercedes.
— enthusiastx11 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 7:22:41 PM | | Votes: 0

"This Hyundai is a joke"

Apparently Lexus is even a bigger joke.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:48:04 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 8

Actually, if you read the article, you'll note that they do praise the GS for all that it is worth. However, Hyundai did a nice job with the Genesis.
— M35MT (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:53:21 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 12

I'm tired of the pissing contest so I'm going to be fair. That answer was just to piss MT.
Hyundai is as far from Lexus quality as Lexus is from Mercedes quality. Three completely different levels of quality and engineering with Mercedes way on top and Hyundai at the far bottom.

I root always for the best and the best in this comparison(with Hyundai) is Lexus by far. This b**ls**t articles are intended exclusively for the brainwashed part of the population that is on a budget. Selling fake dreams to fools.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:11:17 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

Wow, star making an intelligent post. Has hell frozen over? Im shocked!
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:52:30 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

Everyone wants the Hyundai because it comes with the poo-poo platter.

:-/
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:45:48 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

Any body that read the article know's the hyundai won only by price. They actualy didn't like one bit about the genesis.

So if they compared it to a 5-serie or E-class it would have still won.

But thats hard to except for the Fanboy's like Star and enthusiastx11.
— STJ88 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:50:09 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -12

And this is the same criteria that gained Lexus a foot hold in the 80's. Back then their cars weren't quite as good in performance and features, but a whole lot cheaper. So it became a value 90% of the car for 70% of the price.

Exact same concept. To see how far this goes today is another story.

The fact remains that Lexus has raised it's standards significantly since then, and it is very hard to draw a tangible difference between a Lexus and a MB or a BMW. They all appeal to different cross section of buyer, and fit specific needs. In a nutshell they do what the buyer wants. If the buyer values one aspect over another then he will buy the brand that best fit his needs.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:08:32 PM | | Votes: 7

It would be similar if they introduced it as its own brand.
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:08:28 PM | | Votes: 4

The Hyundai may look like a Lexus and drive like a Lexus, but you really can't compare with everything else you are getting.

Loan cars, pick-up and deliver, 24-hour 4yr roadside, service, quality, resale value (not so much with the GS, but in general). In the long run, the Lexus is a better engineered car. The Lexus is for people that work hard for their money, and want to show people that they can afford a strong and quality car.

I will say this, the Hyundai looks great. It is a great leap into the luxury market, and I welcome them. The big flaw is that they have their bargain cars devaluing their new flagship.

Hyundai can't have both. But I did gain a lot of respect with this car, and am looking forward to the Coupe next year.
— adamsaf723 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:55:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6

I would have also liked to see the comparison with the G37 Sedan coming out in the fall. As far as pricing, it makes more sense to use that in the comparison.
— adamsaf723 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:56:05 PM | | Votes: -2

I wonder who deboosted me, No. It couldn't have been Star or EL34. They always have smart comments.
— STJ88 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:57:36 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

I actually have seen 2 of them on the road here in the suburbs of Atlanta, I thought they werent due out yet??? Its actually not a bad looking car....the HUGE grill is what caught my eye 1st though. they need a "H" on it.
— NISSANINFINITI (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 12:59:10 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

after watching the video, these are some of the facts that were reported. so let me get this straight:
1) the lexus is faster
2) the lexus has less fading brakes
3) the lexus gets 4 more miles per gallon throughout the test
4) the lexus has a better interior and exterior

and yet, the hyundai wins. automotive journalism at its best
— LexusKindaGuy12 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:01:48 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -16

I cannot believe the Japanese fanbois. Suddenly all the things they were not seeing in comparisons between BMW and Infiniti, or Mercedes and Lexus appear so CLEAR to them now. Hyundai is to Lexus what Lexus is to Mercedes. Infiniti is to BMW what Hyundai is to Lexus. Are you that BLIND???? How BIASED somebody needs to be to NOT see the obvious.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:15:44 PM | | Votes: 7

Wow! sounds like a Merc vs Lexus comparison in the early 90's

Merc won in all of the performance goals but Lexus was so much less is actually wins? History repeats itself yet again.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:16:51 PM | | Votes: -1

The funny thing now is that the Hyundai fans are going to drive Lexus fans out of their mind by using BS arguments like value for the money or telling them that choosing a Lexus over a Hyundai makes them badge whores just like the Japanese fanatics did to the car enthusiasts community when comparing their lowly Infiniti and Lexus cars to the German engineering marvels made by Mercedes and BMW. This is going to be fun.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:46:21 PM | | Votes: 11

"Wow! sounds like a Merc vs Lexus comparison in the early 90's"

Not necessarily :

http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=r-B2SJzUTLk
— abcd (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:22:10 PM | | Votes: -5

1989 Q45 6.7sec
1989 LS400 7.1sec

This was a time when the 7 Series was taking 9 seconds to get to 60. So, no 009, it did not win in all performance goals.

Wow!
— M35MT (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:53:55 PM | | Votes: 4

If I recall correctly, way back in 1989 R&T and C&D both placed the LS and the Q45 ahead of the competition not because they were cheaper, but because they were better. Smoother, quieter, faster, better interior, etc.
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:34:02 PM | | Votes: 4

""It is by design," wrote Car and Driver about the LS 400 as it won its first comparison test — besting the Audi V8 quattro, BMW 735i, Cadillac STS, Infiniti Q45, Jaguar XJ6 Sovereign and Mercedes
420SEL — with impressive ease, "a very filtered, silken automobile, the hardest job of all to pull off. We stand in admiration of the engineers who executed this assignment"

"But if there's one element that stood out amid the refinement of that first LS, it was its interior. "The arrangement is logical and fine," continued Car and Driver. "The texture and colors are chic. And the steering wheel's leather feels as if it came from a heifer that enjoyed Elizabeth Arden treatment all its life." Other observers noted that the cabin's oversized controls contrasted sharply with the dinky switches then infecting many German machines and that the electroluminescent instrumentation set a new standard for readability and simple beauty."
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:39:10 PM | | Votes: 4

Star/009, are you saying the G35 cant compete with the 3 series and C class?
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:01:22 PM | | Votes: 1

"0to60" Star/009, are you saying the G35 cant compete with the 3 series and C class?

Infiniti is as much of a competitor for BMW and Mercedes, as Hyundai is a competitor for Lexus. Is really quite simple. If you want more horsepower for your money you have to give up quality. For the same price you can have a fantastic 230 HP BMW, a mediocre 330HP Infiniti or a low quality 375 HP Hyundai. Your choice.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:25:20 PM | | Votes: -5

I actually agree with Lexuskinda...All he did was layout the facts. I think your username created all the deboosting. In this case its not fanatical, its just a summation. I'm not a Lexus fan or basher, but I don't understand the outcome. From the enthusiast aspect, I put more credence on the performance figures and less on the value equation. Although important, when you're at this level its secondary.
— golfer38 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:43:29 PM | | Votes: -1

Michael - we also mustn't forget that when Lexus LS came out, the Mercedes S was about to be replaced. It was a very old car by that time.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 8:20:45 PM | | Votes: 5

Yes, but the then next generation 1992 S was forgettable too.
— _43LE (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 12:28:47 AM | | Votes: 0

Somebody deboosted LexusKindaGuy12 because he actualy read the article. I love this site.
— STJ88 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:08:34 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

I upped him one, he deserves it.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:17:30 PM | | Votes: -3

So we can assume that you DIDN'T READ the article before posting? Typical..
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:20:20 PM | | Votes: 5

@Star

Whats wrong with you, can't you read or something.
— STJ88 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:26:02 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6

A comment like:
"Somebody deboosted LexusKindaGuy12 because he actualy read the article"

especially "ACTUALLY READ"

implies that LexusKindaguy is the only one who read the article or is somewhat special because he read it. He was not deboosted because he read the article. He was deboosted because he didn't UNDERSTAND the article.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:31:34 PM | | Votes: 3

lol. my mistake. i must have made all those comments up
— LexusKindaGuy12 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:54:02 PM | | Votes: -5

The funny thing now is that the Hyundai fans are going to drive Lexus fans out of their mind by using BS arguments like value for the money or telling them that choosing a Lexus over a Hyundai makes them badge whores just like the Japanese fanatics did to the car enthusiasts community when comparing their lowly Infiniti and Lexus cars to the German engineering marvels made by Mercedes and BMW. This is going to be fun.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:46:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

"Still, the lack of any brand identification anywhere on the car except its tail"
Even Hyundai is embarassed to have their name on this car.

The Toyota Avalon would've been a better choice to go up against the Genesis, its V-6 would've still lost to the Genesis' V8 but the pricing and options would still be similiar.

If Hyundai wants to take on Lexus, lose the Accent and Elantra, and the 0% financing. BMW has proven that any junk car company can give a car away, it takes a unique company to charge what they want for a car.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:47:36 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6

" it takes a unique company to charge what they want for a car"

I really hope you are referring to the Bugatti Veyron.
Toyota and Lexus have their pants all the way down offering clearance prices and special financing for the entire line. They are simply giving their cars away.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:57:28 PM | | Votes: 6

huu76, I guess that is why we see Lexus have all of the Seasonal Sale Events.

Do you ever watch TV? The Lexus Summer Sales Event, The Lexus Winter Sales Event.... etc, etc, etc.

That is their way of getting rid of excess inventory.. Lexus drops the price by thousands on cars because of overstock..
— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:40:24 PM | | Votes: 11

Next Lexus Sales event will be a Back to School Sales Event...
— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:42:34 PM | | Votes: 10

Hyundai is bringing luxury to the masses, nothing wrong with that. For those not looking for the best in class fit and finish, but a reliable vehicle nonetheless will certainly have a look. I'm sure many will be surprised they could actually afford this car, we're not talking about a Chinese automobile here, Hyundai has proven itself to be dead reliable.
— sector (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:50:56 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -10

that shakes up the status quo.

not trying to sound like a jerk, but luxury should be reserved for people who can afford luxury or else there would be no point in working hard and making millions.

not sure if the world will respond to hyundai, but they are playing with fire.
— LexusKindaGuy12 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:56:20 PM | | Votes: -11

"not trying to sound like a jerk, but luxury should be reserved for people who can afford luxury or else there would be no point in working hard and making millions"

So based on that statement why would Lexus be considered luxury? It is better than Hyundai but still FAR from even touching in quality brands like Mercedes or BMW. I understand the point you make with Hyundai and I agree with it but I cannot see how you fail to notice the resemblance with the situation Lexus is in. Lexus struggles with exactly the same issues as Hyundai. You look at Hyundai in the same way car enthusiasts look at Lexus.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:29:28 PM | | Votes: 6

Hyundai is South Korean. Isnt it?
— outdoorsman (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:00:20 PM | | Votes: 2

audirevolution,
0.9%, $0 downpayment, free automatic transmisssions, targeting lower and lower market segments. I`m pretty sure that`s what will kill BMW`s prestige.

MB is doing the same with low financing, cheaper models and cash rebates (all the way up to their flagship models).

Being owned by Toyota is probably one of the biggest reasons for buying a Lexus. You`ll know that their airbags and brakes will work.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 1:51:15 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

"Being owned by Toyota is probably one of the biggest reasons for buying a Lexus. You`ll know that their airbags and brakes will work"

Hundreds of recalls claim otherwise.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:01:26 PM | | Votes: 5

huu76= Staar reincarnated
— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:35:13 PM | | Votes: 10

"Being owned by Toyota is probably one of the biggest reasons for buying a Lexus. You`ll know that their airbags and brakes will work."

I guess those airbags are important for when the sheer boredom of driving said Toyota/Lexus causes your geriatric ass to fall asleep at the wheel.
— JRobUSC (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:00:41 PM | | Votes: 11

Pass on both,

It was said earlier by AudiRevolution that Audi would be a tier one brand in the "next few years."

Audi has been a tier one brand for the past few years whether BMW drivers recognize it or not.

Now,
I hate Lexus just as much as the next guy under 60, but Hyundai, come on.
— AudiNewEngland (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:02:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4

During this economy I wouldnt be surprised to see people cross-shopping Lexus and the Genesis sedan.

Wasnt it in the 80's that our economy was last this bad? That also happens to be the time when Lexus rolled up to the block and people that could no longer afford the Tier-1 brands such as MB, BMW, Jag (hard to believe it now but back then it was much more prestigious than it is today) then "downgraded" to a more economical Luxury brand from Japan??? (they used to make econoboxes and calculators but real luxury cars???)

Looks like the cards were played right and people ended up liking their "bargains" enough to stay true to the brand, thus eventually with time reaching true competitive status with the brands from Europe after a decade.

The first Lexus was a rebadged camry.

http://www.antennamastsrus.com/Lexus/ES%20250/1991%20ES%20250%20Front%20Photo.jpg

http://kingdomautos.com/91Camry.jpg

So all you Lexus fanboys shouldnt get so "offended" by new competition that you so easily discredit. Americans may well prefer Korean Cars in the next 15 years. Anybody who knows the history of the japanese auto industry and Lexus knows this car can well be the real game changer.
— w209w114 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:02:49 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

Who cares.....Even JD power ranked Toyota above BMW.

Once again, customers are delightful that their Lexus is own by Toyota Motor Corporation. It's a freakin compliment.
— silver1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:23:28 PM | | Votes: -12

I think Hyundai can gain market share from the ground-up by making fuel-efficient cars and build the brand up with reliability and service. Honda and Toyota are really great companies that have been run quite intelligently and they are changing the game to hybrids. Gas is not going to be cheap ever again and the days of RWD V8 engines are over for the common man.
— g2ok (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 6:39:59 PM | | Votes: 2

Neither really appeal to me because I'd choose the infiniti M over those 2 and would probably go for the XF, A6 or S80 over all.
— Htay7500 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:20:28 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

@AudiNewEngland

Audi isn't Tier-1 just like Acura they need RWD.
— STJ88 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 2:20:44 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6

Who say tier one has to have RWD, hear this alot? It is about quality, performance, luxury.

Not which wheels drive the car.

If so AWD should be the prerequisite.
— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:14:26 PM | | Votes: 0

Audi has QUATTRO which beats eveything.
— steve27t (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:05:29 PM | | Votes: -1

Audi is as much tier 1 as BMW or Mercedes. I'm surprised there is even an argument over this. According to the Forbes article, Audi owners have a higher annual income than BMW and Lexus owners. So, does this mean that the wealthiest people are buying tier 2 cars while the less-affluent people are buying tier 1s. RWD has nothing to do with tiers.
— AudiNewEngland (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:09:01 PM | | Votes: 0

and the real ranking:

Tier 1:Bentley, Rolls Royce, Maybach

Tier 2: Mercedes, BMW

Tier 3: Audi, Jaguar

Tier 4: Cadillac, Lexus

Tier 5: VW, Mini, Saab, Volvo, Lincoln, Infiniti, Acura

Economy: Mazda, Subaru, Scion, Toyota, Honda
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:34:52 PM | | Votes: 0

this might sound odd but this whole tier thing has nothing to do with anything other than prestige......in which when it comes to prestige Audi just doesnt have it here....not in America, and not much in Europe....when mentioning prestige in luxury makes BMW Mercedes Porsche and Lexus.....before the mid 90s Audi was nothing more than A German VW, or Saab the odd ball never had cars that directly competed with BMW and Mercedes so tier 1 no tier 3 yes...maybe tier 2 on a good day
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 7:33:42 PM | | Votes: 3

german volvo or saab
— bmwdrvr (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 7:34:36 PM | | Votes: 3

Audi has plenty of prestige in Europe, the same as BMW or Mercedes.
— Rupert (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 8:24:34 PM | | Votes: 1

Just want to say the haters can't have it both ways...

If you say lexus is just a rebadged toyota then you can't also agree with this article.
— chinojk (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 3:04:07 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

You make some of the most stupid comments I have ever read in my life.
— BMWnumber1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 6:37:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

yeah I don't like the new blue titles as well, looking like fungus on cheese gone bad :(
— sector (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 10:52:14 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -3

Right on, AROD550I!

This is the biggest confusion the average American car buyer has. They think that luxury features and accessories are what defines a luxury car. This is the reason for which lowly brands like Acura and Infiniti which have the level of engineering and the built quality found in economy cars are seen as premium by the clueless type of buyer.

They simply don't understand that economy cars like these in spite of coming with leather standard are still economy cars due to their low level of engineering and low quality materials used, while a BMW with cloth interior and a 4 cylinder engine still belongs to the premium segment. Level of engineering, build quality, quality of materials and long term reliability is what makes the difference between the durable superb premium German automobiles and the run of the mill, short term appliances made in Japan and Korea.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:01:50 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 8

If it does this well against the GS350 it would kill the BMW528I.
— truthpursuit (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 4:48:01 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -8

Aww yes the Genesis, i love the shots they throw a mercedes LMAO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9N14XHTSojQ&feature=related

im pretty sure Mercedes, BMW and Lexus fanboys isnt going like it LMAO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTg-C1yAzCc&NR=1
— Denali (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:00:00 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -7

I don't get why they compared it to the GS. By InsideLine's own admission, Hyundai specifically stated the Lexus ES. In addition to that, I fail to see why the automotive media is so intent on comparing Hyundai's with Lexus'. The Veracruz went up against the RX, now the Genesis against the GS. Not only are there numerous other luxury brands to choose from, it's slightly insulting.

Also, it's rather humorous when Audi fans look down upon Lexus. Lexus is not the only brand that shares platform, Audi/VW has a long history of doing that as well. I love Audi, and I love Lexus. Both are not on Merc's or BMW's level however.
— Patriots7 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:10:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

Lexus is not the only brand that shares platform.

What other models does the A4,5,6,8 share platforms with?

Ok, the A3 shares and the Q7 has some Porsche/VW in it but no current Audi is rebadged like Lexus/Toyota.
— steve27t (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:45:30 PM | | Votes: 3

The A3, the A4 (up until a few years ago shared platforms with the Passat), the Q3, the Q7, and likely the unannounced Q1.

I have no problem with it, again, I truly love Audi as a company. I just don't think people should knock Lexus for doing it. Rebadged products are a completely different thing. I despise the practice, so Lexus hate is deserved for the LX and GX. The ES has made strides to distinguish itself from the Camry, and I'm hoping that even more effort goes into it in the next generation, but at least their similarities are so small that most don't even realize that the ES and Camry are platform sisters.
I also hope that the JX comes into fruition as a replacement for the GX, since at least it is a brand new conception, and based on the GS.
— Patriots7 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 6:13:20 PM | | Votes: -2

I dont get the problem with them sharing platforms. Although they do, they drive and handle different. You can tell the difference from a Lexus and toyota by driving them. Why is the shared platform such a big deal. If toyota where to go away and it were just Lexus, this argument would go away. So pretend they are not related and get over it. My brother and I share similar features but we are still different people. Likewise with my parents. Can I be judged by them? lexus offers a nice smooth ride and my moms (which is in my name) is proof of that. Toyotas ride are not nearly as nice. Stearing and handling is different as is the suspension and features. dealerships etc are like night and day. My girl has a camry and it is nothing like my moms lexus ES. They may share a platform but you will never know by driving it! So why does it matter. Likewise with the Infiniti G and the Altima. Completely different althought hey share the same platform. Get over it!
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 12:02:23 AM | | Votes: 1

Lexus = Yugo

The End.
— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 5:13:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

A resounding NO ! It maybe nice, but it ain't cheap.

"As tested, the GS 350 came fully equipped at $49,670. The Genesis showed up with a $4,000 Technology package and a $42,000 sticker."

For a $40+k car, I would just stick with a known brand. There is a long term reliability issue. Also bad timing to market a V8 with high fuel prices.

I won't say that Hyundai deserves credit because they really do, but it's not really competing against a luxury brand.

Lexus, Mercedes have a great dealership network and service is tops. Hyundai dealers seem like bottom of the barrel and sleazy. They need to work on that as much as building cars.
— g2ok (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 6:28:16 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

Hyundai distroys the Lex on price, build quialty,,, the LOT, GO Hyudai.
— xj13 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 8:09:53 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1

Don't forge pothead ownership rankings!
Over 600 stoners stampeded HYundai dealerships nationwide to grab this worldbeater in July.
BTW, the Lexus V8 outperformed the Hyundai V8, with 5 MPG better economy.
But let's not have facts get in the way of a good story.
Is a Lexus worth the extra money?
Uh..........yeah!
DrFill
— DrFill2009 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 8:23:17 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5

Interesting! This website should be renamed to AUTOSHITTALKERS.
99.9% of the ppl here are morons and only 2% of these morons own cars and 99.9% of these morons own cars own some $200 bux pieces of junk. and 100% of you morons get to keep your accounts because you are all masters of buttsex!!

— Gaybear (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 8:55:27 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

His companion is a bear, more specifically, a gay bear.
— sector (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 9:43:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

Strange that the Lexus is compared, when in fact Hyundai does there own comparison against the 5 series BMW.
— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 10:23:05 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -7

Strange that the Lexus is compared, when in fact Hyundai does there own comparison against the 5 series BMW.
— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 10:23:22 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5

That's not a comparison, that's a joke. You just didn't get it.
— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:12:42 PM | | Votes: -1

Tier 1: Audi, Mercedes, BMW<(though falling fast)

Tier 2-...: No one Cares

— AudiNewEngland (View Profile)

Posted on 8/18/2008 11:33:31 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -15

Star,
MB B-class is priced against a loaded Corolla. The 1-series is priced against a mid-tier Camry. The German definition of luxury and exclusivity sure has changed. Guess it goes with the leasing territory.

BMW is having a clearance and they can't clear anything out. Face it, Toyota can charge 9.5% on used vehicles because that's how much they are in demand while new ones are between 6-9%. When was the last time any German company dared charge more than 4.9%?

I'm still waiting for the BMW/MB answer to the Yaris, its bound to happen since they're having a hard time competing against Lexus in the higher markets.

Again, if Hyundai wants to compete against Lexus, they have to lose the low end BMW beaters.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 12:04:49 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -16

Huu, how sad you sound like the old "Staar" that sadly is not here anymore.

You base your statements on what you believe not the facts.

— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 7:50:50 AM | | Votes: 13

The lexus es350 is basically a "blinged out camry" and you want to talk about BMW being low end.. LOL

You are truly delusional...
— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 8:03:03 AM | | Votes: 11

QuantumMatrix, have you driven an ES then driven a Canry? And whats wrong with it being a blinged out Camry if it offer what the buyer is looking for. You can also say an Avalon is a Blinged out camry yet it still sales. So whats the point of your argument?
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 10:54:29 AM | | Votes: -8

FYI - QuantumMatrix = Star's other screen name
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 10:55:12 AM | | Votes: -1

QuantumMatrix, the ES is only 25% more than Camry, people are willing to pay that for the level of luxury and slightly better fit and finish you will get.

And no, the IS250/350 is not based on a Camry/Corolla, it shares the internal bits with the GS, it is not a re-badge.
— sector (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 11:06:58 AM | | Votes: -7

Dissapointed - I thought that Hyundai V8 would've been a beast - but it's slow and poor gas mileage. W/O reading the article I thought the Genesis won cause of performance - it won cause of price? They have to redesign these motors to push out less than 5.7 sec 0-60 times.
— StickShiftCamry (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 12:34:03 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3

I'm confused why you would be interested in performance when your username clearly defines the opposite. So i'm going along the lines that you don't know anything about it.
— Tuscani27 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 7:14:46 PM | | Votes: 2

I'm sorry but Hyundai doesn't have a prayer against Lexus or any other Japanese car. The only real competition for Hyundai is perhaps TATA now that they own Jaguar. The Japanese are in their own bracket now. One that's built on quality and research. Nissan's GTR is probably one of the best cars on the road today. Maybe it's not that great looking but it'll leave anything from Germany in the dust.

Let's face it, German's build great cars but they don't know how to build great cars inexpensively. Don't get me wrong, I drive a couple of German makes myself but I can't tell you how many times mein auto went kaput. Germans always seem to skimp on the critical stuff like water impellers and radiators.

If Honda, Nissan or Toyota build more cars like the GTR I'm signing up.
— E36er (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 1:47:44 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2

I agree 100%. With German brands, you don't necessarily "get what you paid for"; that's sad since they build nice cars but they need to be more reliable, I don't have a money tree in my backyard.
— sector (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 11:16:43 AM | | Votes: -6

My father actually really got interested in the Genesis yesterday. He is looking for a new car and checked out the following vehicles.

Acura RL, Acura TL, Volvo S80, Volvo XC70. He pulled into Hyundai for shits n giggles and asked what their best car was. He has never seen nor heard of the Genesis. He was stunned. Great looks, good power, and for $40K loaded!!

He never even peeked at a Lexus, says they are too old people for him and he is in his mid 50's. LOL! I respect Lexus, and showed him this comparison article. I personally really like the Genesis and think it would be an awesome car to have. I see too many Volvo's and BMWs on the road now, this is def. a rare car just like the G8. I have yet to see either on the roads much.
— Whelan (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 9:24:53 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3

You see to many Volvo's on the road? Where?
— 0to60 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 10:56:33 AM | | Votes: 3

Quantum,
You don't know much about car prices do you? Most 3-series buyers couldn't afford an ES, hence they have to settle for the lowly 3 or 1.
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 9:46:07 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -14

Huu,
Evidently you are the one that doesn't know much about car prices.. LMAO

You need to configure a Lexus ES and a BMW 335i on the respective websites and compare apples to apples, then get back with me..

I have a 2008 335i coupe and it cost way more than a loaded up Lexus ES.

Plus you can talk the Lexus sales dept. into knocking thousands off the price of an ES, but that is not the point. If I wanted a lowly ES I would just save a bundle of dough and get a loaded up Toyota Camry because we all know both are the same car, The ES just has more fake wood and cheap leather.

— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 10:14:30 AM | | Votes: 10

Huu's point is that most 3 series buyers own the lower-end model, not the 335.
The ES and 335 appeal to different types of consumers.
— david999 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 4:30:39 PM | | Votes: -5

Genesis is quite impressive.
— cls550 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 9:47:02 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

Although the Genesis looks like an old Infiniti inside/out, but I have to say a great job for a 1st attempt really.

I'll still stick with the GS though.
— Designer1 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 9:52:26 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

Dude you need to refill your bong.

At least when you are high you can stay on topic.
— bmwman1963 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 7:53:45 PM | | Votes: 1

Sorry man, that wasn't directed to you it was meant for Michael Taylor below.
— bmwman1963 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 7:58:12 PM | | Votes: 4

Dude you need to refill your bong.

At least when you are high you can stay on topic, even though it doesn't have any substance worth mentioning.
— bmwman1963 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 8:00:45 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

The Genesis is a derivative car. The front is clearly a Merc S class and the tail a BMW 7. There's nothing ground breaking about it except for it's size.
— E36er (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 2:20:11 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

The article and the video seems fair. Overall Lexus is slightly better car but not good enough to pay extra for. Hyundai has came long way, now if they drop that stupid Hyundai name and logo, I might consider replacing my wife's aging E320.
— 2001W210 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 3:32:24 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5

Quantum,
Hmmm, really. The ES doesn't have as many options as the 335i, but the IS350 does. Load them both up and the 335i looks like it costs $4500 more, then you have to factor in BMW's $5000 rebate (one of those incentives that are eating in the Quandts share prices). Then you have to factor in the difference in finance rates, so another big price discount for the BMW.
You also forget that the IS350 isn't a direct competitor to the 335i (BMW's turbo'd reply to the n/a IS350). If Toyota felt like bringing back their turbos, an IS-turbo would leapfrog the 335i price easily.

A lowly Camry doesn't fall apart quite as easily as a BMW, and the Camry has airbags and brakes that actually work.

You should've just gone all the way and said you have an M3 (conveniently).
— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 4:23:39 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -11

huu,
You really don't mess around when you fabricate your own bull__it do you..

BMW does not offer a $5000 rebate on the 3 series, maybe the outgoing 7 series to make room for the NEWLY DESIGNED 7 series.

And yes the IS350 is a direct competitor to the 335i with turbos. The engine in the 335 is smaller displacement 3.0L compared to the IS350 3.5L...

What a dunce you are...

BMW is using turbo's to increase power without having to increase displacement.. And it SLAYS the IS350...

And as far as I can tell BMW's don't fall apart as easily as you say, at least that is according to the customer satisfaction report on this site.

I wish I had an M3.. but I'm thrilled to own the benchmark 335i, that Toyota/Lexus tries to duplicate but always fails in it attempts.

You really don't know much about cars do you.
— QuantumMatrix (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 4:49:27 PM | | Votes: 14

Please, somebody moderate this site, and when people get -15 -20 -all the time...... ban them ! They are obviously pissing everybody off.
— steve27t (View Profile)

Posted on 8/19/2008 10:34:48 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

Here's the thing, it's a Hyundai. Hyundai's are (and might always be) known for cheap, crappy cars. They're a laughing stock in the car world. I was watching a TV show and Hyundai was used as a joke to show how poor someone was to have to drive one. I just wish that everyone would stop praising the Genesis as a worthy competitor against one of top of the line Lexus'. That, by connection, is comparing the Genesis to the A6, 5 Series, and E-Class, and saying it competes well with those cars. It's a joke. Here's a few things the Genesis 4.6 lacks compared to the GS 350, for example:
-optional AWD
-optional automatic suspension
-10-way power driver's/passenger's seat on the GS (8-way driver's, 4-way passenger's on Genesis)
-power lumbar support
-four power windows compared to two on the Genesis
-reverse tilt down mirrors
-power folding mirrors
-exterior entry lighting
-wood interior (simulated wood on Genesis)
-memory passenger seat
-trip computer
-optional pre-collision system
-more airbags
-standard xenon headlights
-headlight washers
-Lexus Link (similar to OnStar)

I got my information on a car comparison by Edmunds.com. And if you added all of that to the Genesis, it would be about the same price as the GS 350. The reason it's cheaper is because they've cut costs (a.k.a. taken short cuts) and eliminated features.

— kut17 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 12:37:08 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2

"Here's the thing, it's a Hyundai. Hyundai's are (and might always be) known for cheap, crappy cars. They're a laughing stock in the car world. I was watching a TV show and Hyundai was used as a joke to show how poor someone was to have to drive one. I just wish that everyone would stop praising the Genesis as a worthy competitor against one of top of the line Lexus'."

Apparently things have changed.
Hyundai Genesis won.
— NewBeginning (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 11:54:38 AM | | Votes: 0

That's what I'm trying to say. I don't know why all of these reviewers are trying to pull for Hyundai. Like I said before, the Genesis isn't as well equipped to compete as everyone says.
— kut17 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 12:26:42 PM | | Votes: 3

Lexus used to be value luxury not long ago. People who bought car from Lexus weren't impressed with the all the bell and whistles ToMoCo put in their cars or unknown reliability when Lexus kicked off, they simply bought it because of they believe they were getting luxury for the substantial discounted price of those cars from Germen. Since Lexus isn't priced as discounted luxury like it used to, I don't see problem HyMoCo stepping up into that spot and filling in. Because I myself is looking for a decent car to replace my wife car. More value for a buck with slight of hint of luxury, what can I as cumsumer ask for more?

Oh yeah...
I want new brand name and logo...
— 2001W210 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 1:19:58 PM | | Votes: 0

Well, here's the difference between Lexus's start and the Genesis's start. First of all, Hyundai is notorious for screwing people over with their pile of crap cars. Then they realized that "Hey, we might do better if we actually make better products". They finally realized that recently, no one knows for sure if they're actually good cars long term. Toyota had that reputation already and passed it on to Lexus who managed to get an even better reputation. Not to mention that the first Lexus's weren't cutting corners like the Hyundai. They actually could compete with they S-Class because they had the stuff. Hyundai eliminated several features in order for their prices to be lower. Lexus didn't.
— kut17 (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 6:49:41 PM | | Votes: 2

Lexus fan ladies please make me a list of Toyota innovations and contributions to the automobile industry . I know this list will be very short.
— 1000rrRider (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 10:32:06 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4

I sure doctors and lawyers will be trading in their Lexus for hyundai,like they traded their BMW's and Mercedes in 1990.
— truthpursuit (View Profile)

Posted on 8/20/2008 2:32:13 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1

Your living in a dream world.
— truthpursuit (View Profile)

Posted on 8/22/2008 8:19:09 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0

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Lexus GS 350 vs. Hyundai Genesis V8: Has Hyundai Out-Lexus Lexus?

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