Motor (Australia) - BMW M3 DCT Sedan vs Mercedes C63 vs Lexus IS-F

Congrats BMW for the WIN!!!

— America (View Profile)

Posted on 3/7/2009 10:12:57 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

Both C63 and M3 got 9/10, so, as the article states, it was a "dead heat".

— senorgato (View Profile)

Posted on 3/7/2009 10:31:27 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

Lexus....ha, ha, ha...

— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 3/7/2009 11:09:26 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Lexus...why do they even compete?

— Star (View Profile)

Posted on 3/7/2009 11:10:24 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

"1st place: BMW M3 (9/10)" (see first line of article listed above)

Do you not realize that that is what the author of THIS article on this blog wrote and not how the actual article ranked them? Try clicking on the link to the ACTUAL article.

— senorgato (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 12:18:46 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

This pretty much sums it up, no matter what, the Germans will win. Just skip to the last page, no need to actually read the article.
"But its the difference in character..."

Oh my, the "Sport" button is located behind the steering wheel, that throws off the handling completely. It must be too much work to hit the button and set it back to sport every single darn time you start the engine. Must throw the drivers concentration right off.
They feel the shifts are slow. Yet if it were fast, they'd complain the IS-F doesn't hang onto low gears long enough.
The ISF's dash requires familiarization. OMG, and the C63's 900 buttons don't?
Of course the M3 (being the driver's car) scores huge points for caring about the rear passengers. Not to mention the cheap-ass pop-out cupholders are simply superb and they didn't feel the need to mention them.

Didn't the C63 do 0-60 in 3.9sec? Now it can barely beat the M3 at 4.74. Guess they wanted to keep the Germans even as much as possible.

Aussie's are probbaly a bit miffed that the Chinese are outdoing them in everything else at home so they take it out on Toyota (30 million Europeans surrounded by approx 2 billion East Asians that out educate and out commerce them). Of course the IS-F has to be cheaper here, they're biased against anything not German or European. I bet Australians would be surprised that North Americans don't hold the same old world bias and the IS-F actually costs the same as the Germans. Then again, Australia did vote in a PM that thinks America is the enemy and being China's resource bitch is the way to go.

Against the M3, the ISF is too sporty. Against the C63, the ISF isn't sporty enough yet both German cars somehow score better in the same category.

A few irritating faults is much worse than having brakes that don't live up to extreme handling, of course, its not important for every day driving unless we're talking about the IS-F. Irritating details really determine German handling. One of the details is probably because Toyota sent them the wrong colour. They asked for White!

Article doesn't prove anything new though, until you glue a German name on a car, it'll always lose. Remember the CTS-V finished first but I'm sure that contest didn't really count.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 12:52:43 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -17   

Huu76, as an Aussie I might take the chance to reply to your racist rant:
- Toyota have gone from a laughing stock here in the 1960s to #1 in sales, hardly the Australian society 'taking it out on Toyota'. Toyota have respected models in every category, including 4wds in the bush and 6-cylinder sedans. Roo-shooting country people here swear that you don't want to be caught outback in anything other than a Landcruiser.
- We have 21 million people, not 30 million. Thanks anyway for suggesting we can still compete with 1 billion Chinese. Since when are we miffed about the Chinese here? Our PM won an election with a campaign that heavily focused on his fluent Mandarin!
- China largely kept our economy booming over the last decade with their energy demand, and we were delighted to help! As for being outdone and outeducated, have you researched how many Asian students are studying in our universities? How many Aussies are getting their degrees in Beijing?
- Australian motoring journalists have a proud and well established industry. One is the editor of a US mag (http://www.motortrend.com/auto_news/112_040426_motortrend/index.html), several have edited CAR (often called the world's best English car magazine) and Wheels is almost a household name in Oz
- As for the Lexus and the Germans, it is well known that the Japanese have often struggled to build 'character' into their cars. No set of statistics can define this difficult-to-capture characteristic.

— aaspiridis (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 3:50:01 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 16   

Once again, have you ever driven a BMW?

— theoptimisticpessimist (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 4:11:29 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

Love the M3 and Benz, can't say the same for the isf. By the way I wonder what the sales down under are on the isf? I'v seen about 2 in the last 3-4 months but on the same hand seen several dozen M3 and c63.

— xj13 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 5:43:04 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

The BMW M3 sums up what BMW does best; superb performance on a small luxury car!

— M53R (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 6:16:22 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 9   

It also has the best cow catcher nose.

— TurboSpyder (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 10:19:53 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

um... Performance? Otherwise, just get an ES350...
- F666

— formula666 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 11:08:21 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

M53R: I agree with you , that´s why I wonder why BMW is doing so many cars that no body ask for. ie: X6, V5, MX6...an list goes on...bad move from them.

— Yonder7 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 9:38:06 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

I've seen one Lexus IS-F so far in Germany. It had dealership advertisements plasted all over it.

— uall (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 10:38:25 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

Germany Forever! Superior in everything...

— Fourth_Reich (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 11:28:25 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

M3 deserved the win.

Especially the track chart here:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3619/3332897848_fb09ccc238_o.jpg
shows how faster the M3 is in corners.

However, German sport sedans have no choice other than to offer more, because they simply cost more. 15-30% more, to be precise.

— downtoearth (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 12:36:44 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Australia is one of the best countries in the world with really low crime rates ( Yes, the population is less but then are not a lot of Central Asian and South American Nations sparsely populated with big crime rates ) and China is not outdoing the World in anything. It just has a huge work force, thankfully to the world's largest population of almost a TRILLION and a HALF - Bringing tremendous pressure on World Resources and the most polluted places on Earth.

In the long term, India will outlast China easily due to it being self sufficient for economic growth.
Indian middle class is the largest in the world now, way more than the total population of USA, world's 3rd largest.
In corporate circles everyone know that CHINA DID NOT HAVE A 9% growth rate, since the main customers (west) are not buying as much. But you know corrupt communist governments. Hell, how many people died in the latest chicken flu outbreak and why was it all shielded?

— TECHGEEK (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 2:19:37 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

I adore both the M3 and the C63 but the IS-F I don't buy it's gimmick. Lexus is better of sticking to luxury cars than performance. The IS itself is an uncomfortable car. Might as well get the ES for comfort. The ES350 is very potent for a family sedan.

So M3 or C63 i'll take one of each and never second think about the IS-F

— Agent63 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 4:40:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

asspiridis,
I respected Australia until you elected egghead K.Rudd. Typical lefty, rename your combat troops to support troops and call it a withdrawal to make the simple minded lefties happy. "We hate Bush as long as we don't realize the new PM is doing exactly the same thing as the old PM."
I guess John Howard was old and uncool, probably telling things the way they were even if it wasn't what you wanted to hear.

The Chinese in Australia are probably just like the Chinese in N.America. We more than pull our own weight but don't need to tell everyone about it (I'm an exception :). I'll bet most of your Universities are crawling with both import and domestic Asian students.
Also, tons of Canadian students go to Australia to get a Bachelor of Education because its easier to get into than Canada. What's that tell you?
Australia represents 1% vs 2 billion and you complain that you can't compete? Asians are about 3% of N.America and we make up atleast 40% of the Universities and research groups. Your excuse is a cop-out.

What engineering is there in the German cars? Put a plastic German emblem on a Lexus (and don't tell the journalists) and they'll sing the Lexus' praises because they think its German.

Good for Kevin Rudd if he knows how to speak Mandarin, makes it easier for Beijing to order him around.

I suggest you reread the article if you don't feel like there's any bias. They blow any Lexus fault out of proportion while they ignore the German ones.
My Jeep's audio controls are on the back of the steering wheel and I don't have an issue with using them, then again, I'm no auto-journalist/enthusiast/so-called expert.

Techgeek,
I agree, the commies are following a failed economic plan. However, if China ever becomes democratic and focuses on true growth and innovation instead of focusing on coyping and usurping all the Liberal countries of the world, watch out. A handful of Chinese in N.America already out think and outwork most of the continent, add 500 million more to the mix and see what happens.
However, India has an archaic caste system which will limit their success. A genius born in the wrong "caste" will never have a chance while some lazy rich kid will run a huge corporation into the ground.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 5:12:50 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -13   

I was in India last year and it is refreshing to see the way the country is developing compared to the last time I was over there. A lot of rich indians are already on the richest list and Tata literally makes everything from Salt to Cranes. In China, I definitely feel less safer cuz of the West Hating Selfish Communist Government who will censor everything to their benefit. India is better, atleast a democracy, speaks English and is the most Pro American nation in the world but the terrorist neighbor Pakistan is always trying to create havoc.

— My_Ultimate_Driving_Machine (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 6:18:25 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

huu76, I hope you know your very smart ethnic chinese in North America are american educated and american citizens, not chinese. Lets not have a China vs ... as China without USA is bankrupt and doomed anyways. They copy us, we are the innovators ( along with of course Europe,UK,Australia ). So who is greater ? The CREATOR or the COPYCAT ?
Just my 0.02 cents.

— Lamborghini_vs_Ferrari_Racer (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 6:23:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Yep, chinese people are just good at copying. Huu u just gotta give credit wheres its due. Most of the german cars are superior compared to the japanese.

— uall (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 9:05:01 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

On the other hand, japenese companies produce the best consumer electronics and the chinese are good at e.g rice cultivation :)

— uall (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 9:06:45 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

For the same money, actually a bit less, give me the CTS-V. I am obsessed with that car.

— senorgato (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 10:50:46 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

Lamborghini,
Agree with you there. The Western system allows the best and brightest to floorish, the Chinese have taken full advantage of this big time. The entitled brats over here are more worried about getting bling.

You ever here of VISA students? You'd be surprised how much research is being done at universities by non-citizens (Chinese, Indian, Arabs). Take a stroll across a campus some time and prepare to be depressed at how far 'generation duh' has fallen.
A lot of the brains are also 1st generation imports. In the future, it'll be N.American Chinese vs. China Chinese with a token couple of other guys mixed in there.
North America has lost its way since the 90s unfortunately.

As for copying, go back 5000 years while Europe was still dwelling in caves and China was the most advanced civilization on the planet. I bet you didn't know that until 1820, the world's largest economy still belonged to China.

You should be happy that we're here to protect you since its quite obvious most N.Americans have lost the will to do that. Read "Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire" sometime and see the parallels.

uall,
I guess a Chinese professor creating a way to reverse cell growth inorder to create stem cells isn't worth mentioning as it doesn't handle like a BMW.
Half of NASA is Chinese, and pretty much every other major US corporation. How about concrete that bends instead of shattering so loser Hollywood types have a better chance of surviving an earthquake? Chinese guy from UofMichigan created that one.
Multi-touch touchscreen was a Chinese student from NY.
RIM, the creators of the BlackBerry is chalk full of Chinese engineering students. Same with banking, N.American Chinese are well on their way to running that too. Have you noticed that Mandarin is the only major language the banks here cater to? Maybe in the U.S. its Spanish but I doubt they have much money.
Wouldn't surprise me if a bunch of Japanese and Chinese engineers worked for BMW.
Now go think about that before you fall off your highhorse.

Don't forget Japan has the most advanced robotics industry in the world.

Yeah, rice cultivation must be quite good if Japan's economy is the 2nd largest in the world and what it considers a poor unemployment rate is something the Germans dream about.

Did you want to get into athletics?

1995,
Communist gov'ts control the focus of their industries. Whether it be capitalist or something else, they direct what industries are to do what and how to exploit foreign enterprise for the benefit of the gov't (i.e. Walmart).
Unlike the US system of corporations first, America 2nd.
Is it still Democracy if the people don't have a choice (i.e. N.Korea)?
Not sure what point you were trying to make though.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 11:22:31 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -6   

I forgot, in the medical field, we're more than over reprsented but you wouldn't know that by watching TV. Apparently every 2nd doctor in the U.S. is a Dr. Hibbert.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/8/2009 11:28:26 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

motor magazine use VBOX gps for 0-100 times. plus the variables such as altitude and temp down in aus are different to the states and europe

— bmwpowerf1 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 12:58:51 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 2   

Hello!!

— JB007 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 7:39:07 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

Didn't I hear Lexus Fans proclaiming that the IS-F would rule the roost? All of this before the car was even released. Where are they now?

The only folks in the world that thinks that the Lexus IS-F can beat out the BMW M3 in driving dynamics are retards from America.

— LexSucks (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 10:24:20 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 6   

I'm completely unsurprised...

— adamsaf723 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 12:21:44 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

Still love the MB better.
More aggressive design,
Hulking motor

— fatandsassy (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 12:28:01 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

1995,
True, you can't directly compare government and economic systems. But communism's basis is central control over everything and using everything as a tool to benefit the gov't, not the most efficient for the individual but damn good for the gov't (look how the Russians kept pace with the U.S. with only a fraction of the $$$).
Democracy is people power and good luck getting 100 different voices to agree. Free-market enterprise is the same, competition brings out the best in the individual but is not always the most efficient for the overall group (i.e. CEOs and yearly hiring/firing/rehiring/retraining).

Still think the IS-F is discrimated against because its not German. Usually the same things happen with Cadillac too. Not German so automatically will never win in so called "enthusiasts" eyes.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 8:15:23 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

I need to offer a correction.
The topic of regressing adult cells back to stem cells was simultaneously announced by Kyoto University and one in Wisconsin.
China's research is catching up fast because a large # of Chinese scientists from California are going to China to do their research and complementing China's own efforts because of Bush's stupid church law.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/19/AR2008021902509_pf.html

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 3/9/2009 11:42:33 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0