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TimesOnline: The New M3 Review

minimalist submitted on 08/11/2007 Official AutoSpies Timestamp: 2:17 AM
from: driving.timesonline.co.uk

[59] user comments | category: Reviews

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TimesOnline: The New M3 Review

BMW M3

The new BMW M3 is more comfortable than the old one, but has something been lost in the transition from street-legal racer to high-performance everyday coupe?

Andrew Frankel

"But admiring and desiring are not the same thing. I admire the art of nouvelle cuisine but I’d rather have a proper meal, and the truth is that, even after 100 miles on some of the Continent’s most challenging roads, the M3 left me hungry for more. Not more raw power, but something less tangible and easy to define, but no less important for that: I’ll call it driver interaction.

Truth is, the M3’s steering is a touch too numb, the brakes too light. The engine is neither particularly smooth nor fabulous to listen to. The interface between engine and gearbox is not as seamless as it should be. And, for what it’s worth, I think the car looks fussy and inelegant. On every objective measure the M3 is a masterpiece, but subjectively I found it slightly wanting."

"For most people this new M3 will be everything they could want from an everyday, high-performance coupé, and to them I fully recommend it. But for those few as interested in the feel of the steering as the punch of the engine, it is worth pointing out that BMW’s decision to raise the price of the M3 from about £42,000 to £50,625 has brought it within reach of the Porsche 911, which starts at £58,688.

The Porsche may have cramped rear seats and a small boot, but it is more than a quarter of a ton lighter, and will raise your pulse rate more on one good stretch of road than the M3 could on an entire motorway. That may be irrelevant to many, while to some it will be the most important consideration. I am one of them." Read Article

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farabira1 - 8/11/2007 3:44:53 AM

+5 Boost

Yeah, that is the complain that many auto enthusiasts are pointing out about the M3, it may be fast, and powerful, and very well made, but it lacks that sense, it is hard to describe it in words, but it lacks that connection that the driver feels while turning the steering wheel to the road surface, that is missing. And Porsches are considered the true driver's car because of that magical feeling that only some cars like 911 and F430 have been able to give to the drivers. Well anyway i think M3 was a fine effort, but it seems like it shorts fall to please a true driver's pursuit of the magical feeling that makes a car a great one.

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JUGNU - 8/11/2007 5:43:18 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Is the swithch from I6 to V8 to be blamed?

JUGNU

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alfistiDK - 8/11/2007 9:49:20 AM

+1 Boost

Hardly, the Cast iron I6 was just as heavy if not more than the V8. Power wise the 3.2 I6 shouldent be near the high rev V8 either. So i dont think the engine has anything to do with it. Looks like they have targeted a broader audience with the new model. Thats more likely the answer...

MunichRob - 8/11/2007 8:10:45 AMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

These reviews don't mean too much to me when the most respected auto related magazine in North America "Car & Driver," gave the new M3 such a rave review.

It's just like when the S5 was first introduced, it got nothing but poor reviews until some respected players in the world of the car business said the totally opposite thing.

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Hyundai - 8/11/2007 8:22:31 AM

+1 Boost

OoooOOOOoooh!

The M3 has lost some of that "magic feel"!

The M3 is a sweet car, and I'd love to have one, but I guess even the champ can lose his touch.

I can see the REPOST for this story! It is called:

"Has the Land of Sauerkraut, Sausage, and BMW Lost its Competitive Edge?"

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henbmw - 8/11/2007 9:48:44 AM

+2 Boost

I'd still take one.

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M53R - 8/11/2007 10:29:51 AMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

Anyone posted the top gear review yet?

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ThierryHenry14 - 8/11/2007 11:19:58 AM

+3 Boost

Its hard to out-do one of the most perfectly engineered car in history.

Everyone expected a big jump, and got a small leap.

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Hyundai - 8/11/2007 12:44:57 PM

+2 Boost

Or, a step backwards?

ThierryHenry14 - 8/11/2007 11:33:03 PM

-1 Boost

definitely not a step backwards...

Hyundai - 8/12/2007 10:12:00 PM

+2 Boost

Fine, then, a step sideways?

DiamondJim - 8/14/2007 2:49:53 PM

+1 Boost

a step in the wrong direction nonetheless

maikoazu - 8/11/2007 11:37:29 AM

0 Boost

There's a Ferrari 360 Modena in my garage but I rather drive the X5 for the same reason an all out high performance sportscar is not a practical daily driver's car.

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mini22 - 8/11/2007 1:01:13 PM

+1 Boost

Maikoazu-A Porsche 911 can be used as an everday car(that includes a GT3)and still gives you that special connection with the road. The difference here is the M3 is based on BMW's 4 dr sedan roots.Perhaps it shows that it's harder to make a sportscar out of a sedan then it is to make a practicle use sportscar.

david989 - 8/11/2007 12:17:39 PM

-1 Boost

So basically the Lexus IS-F is better? As expected.

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printhan - 8/11/2007 12:58:19 PM

-1 Boost

get some help from ya granny.. she mite be ablE 2 answer it

ThierryHenry14 - 8/11/2007 11:34:40 PM

0 Boost

I had no idea why Lexus is coming up in this...

S4cabriofoxone - 8/11/2007 1:18:15 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

This is why I'd rather have an RS4 than the new M3. The new M3 has lost something... and it seems like both the RS4 and 335i have inherited the E46 M3's driving perfection.

It's disappointing to me that BMW is losing focus. I don't care if it doesn't have 612hp like the 2015 C65 AMG; I want it to give me something special. There's a replacement for displacement, and it's called handling. It's a shame, then, that Audi has beaten BMW at its own game: they have seamlessly combined fabulous V8 power and sound with incredible handling in the extraordinary RS4. I hope the next M3 can regain its crown, though.

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SevorbeupstryIsBack - 8/11/2007 3:05:21 PM

+2 Boost

My advice: wait for the CSL.

M53R - 8/11/2007 5:22:43 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

My advice: The RS4 doesnt handle better than this no matter how good the reviews say, wait for the head to head comparisons.... Did you read the top gear review?

If it doesnt handle as well as the older generation ( which was the case since the 1st generation came out) doesnt make it rubbish. I thought you knew that.

BMW M all the way!

TauronB2G - 8/11/2007 2:13:34 PM

+1 Boost

Basically the M3 needs a diet. This sounded more like a good review for Porsche. The Bimmer boys are still gonna take 2nd mortgages on their homes to get one though. The M3 is going to succeed on perceived image and brand loyalty.
T

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Will_ - 8/11/2007 4:11:40 PM

+3 Boost

This is what I don't understand about all of this. Why do all of you look to magazines to tell you which cars have "magic" and which cars don't? What is this "intangible feeling" that the M3 is missing? Maybe these reviewers haven't gotten off the high of a Disneyland trip yet.

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SevorbeupstryIsBack - 8/11/2007 4:31:31 PM

+1 Boost

You don't love cars.

Will_ - 8/11/2007 4:45:38 PM

+4 Boost

I guess that's my problem. I decided to reserve my love for superficial things like my family...

Will_ - 8/11/2007 9:26:51 PM

+1 Boost

I don't know, you tell me why this reviewer can't seem to find the "magic" in the newest version of BMW's most important model?

izfuney - 8/14/2007 3:42:22 PM

+1 Boost

This review probably points out everything that is wrong with drivers today.... Gone are people who could race a rally with an old school Mini or Lancia Delta (notoriously peaky powerplant), gone are those who could take a compromised car like the mustang (bad chasis balance) or Civic Si (narrow powerband) and make it dance from apex to apex.
Words like "magic" were reserved for drivers not machines!!!.... those who could coax out the performance from a car.
I guess if everything is expected from a car then what sets the driver apart?

SevorbeupstryIsBack - 8/11/2007 4:31:10 PM

-1 Boost

One has to realise the new M3 is perhaps again the best handling car in its class, that has never been an M3 problem. It is still HUGELY capable.

But that's not the problem, it's too mature, too heavy (for an M3) and too refined.

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M53R - 8/11/2007 5:25:25 PMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

Thank you! Some of the guys here think that because the older 1 was more responsive this means this one is rubbish and will be out handled by a corolla!

rg12345 - 8/12/2007 1:48:33 PM

0 Boost

Not by a Corolla, but by the new C63 AMG and by the to years old RS4. Certainly not by a corolla.

M53R - 8/12/2007 4:54:21 PMView My AgentSpace

+2 Boost

We'll see about that *grins*

SevorbeupstryIsBack - 8/13/2007 2:37:17 AM

+1 Boost

I still think the M3 will beat both RS4, C63 and definitely IS-F on a track. In a straight line the C63 will take the cake.

Anyway, the E92 M3 is a very very very good car engineering-wise and performance-wise but it has become more mature and grown-up. But still this is about as good as it is going to get. If BMW can't do it, nobody can.

Now, let's wait for perhaps the most legendary name out of German motorsport to return.

bmwdrvr - 8/11/2007 7:02:12 PM

0 Boost

this all sounds like bs, you mean to tell me that the 335i the non performance variant of the 3 series, if a better handler, and performer than the M3??? thats crazy. these reviews all sound like that the editors expected the new M3 to be something that BMW didnt want it to be and thats a hard edge race car for the road. these reveiws and these posts make it sound like the M3 was softened up more than the 335i, and the last M3 and its some luxo cruiser steering thats to nuetral, light brakes, disconnected steering it sounds like they are reviewing a Buick for gods sake. there is no way mag or not that the M3 is a softer car than the 335i. they just were expecting something else

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SHOWTIME - 8/13/2007 11:01:28 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

I completely agree with you...How is it that when the 335i came out, they say it handles so much better than the 330Ci and that it's very close to E46 M3's performance and now the E92 M3 is not as good as the older one. This is just nonsence and like you said, they expected it to be a ferrari killer or something or god knows what!

ICON - 8/11/2007 10:53:40 PM

+1 Boost

Idiot...don't come back until you passed puberty and at least have your GED

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ThierryHenry14 - 8/11/2007 11:43:29 PM

+2 Boost

First of all, Infiniti is the worst example... second of all, there is no substitute is Porsche's slogan. At least be orignial!!!

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SHOWTIME - 8/13/2007 11:26:01 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

RICEMASTER, I think you are just too poor to afford BMW, Audi, or Merc, and that's why you hate on them so much. I can understand now, you try to lie to yourself and convince others that there is a chance for you to get a car just as good for less money.

Piece of advice for you...In a BMW, if you study every inch of material, amount of interior room, weight, quality, luxury, performance, etc...No other car company has been able to offer such an overall package altogether and still give such perfrmance numbers in the end. That's what makes BMW on top, you don't sacrifice much for a sports car feel.

Perfect example, M3(5 seater with plenty of options) vs NSX (2 seater)and that's it, not to mention 40k more! Get my point now?

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MunichRob - 8/11/2007 10:44:17 PMView My AgentSpace

0 Boost

I believe the problem is all the hype that was wrapped around this car before anyone actually drove it.

The last M3 was an amazing car, so much so that it almost put the E36 to shame. Yeah we were all hoping & waiting for history to repeat itself, but there's only so far the engineering can go to make this car that much better.

Still at the moment the new M3 regains it's benchmark status in this segment, just the gap between it & the competition has shrunk considerably...So what's the problem?

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BMW995 - 8/11/2007 11:06:34 PM

+2 Boost

The forthcoming M3 CSL (around 300 lbs lighter) will solve some of it's problems, but let's face it, the new M3 is unfortunately a porker.

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ThierryHenry14 - 8/11/2007 11:49:44 PM

+2 Boost

While I must admit that the E46 generation 3ers are much more "raw" to drive than the E90/91/92 3ers, because of the whole active steering thing, it still out performs and out handles just about everything it its class.

The E92 M3 will be no different.

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rg12345 - 8/12/2007 1:45:25 PM

+2 Boost

Too bad it just lost another review .. the new M3 is in kinda bad shape as a performance car, it's more like a VW, 4 driveable wheels and that's it. No feelings whatsoever. The Audi RS4 is much better, from the reviews we ALL KNOW. Probably the S5 will kick it's ass too, if the numbers they got in the last review are consistent. And that is BAAAAD for the king of the kings, the new fat M3.

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M53R - 8/12/2007 10:40:59 AMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Dont forget this new M3 is heavier and bigger in size.

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rg12345 - 8/12/2007 1:46:57 PM

+1 Boost

No, it doesn't. Pls read the review before posting, Bimmer guy.

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M53R - 8/12/2007 4:55:46 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

Oh please rq.... did you see the top gear review?! The praised it from line one till the end.. and that's top gear..

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rg12345 - 8/12/2007 1:46:11 PM

+1 Boost

Just another bad review. Not really really bad, but not good either. I guess BMW fans will have to get used being average lately in the top end.

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GermanNut - 8/12/2007 2:36:55 PM

+1 Boost

Sorry amazinBimmer, but your otherwise glorified product known as a BMW M3 has not really defeated the Audi RS4 in any significant way. Sure, the M3 may go better on the track, but as well all know you don't drive your car on a track when you go to work or take the kids somewhere.

The Audi RS4 is an equally impressive piece of car from from Audi. You can call it a Volkswagen but doing so would just hurt your arguement even further that BMW is better than the Volkswagen RS4 because as we all know the Volkswagen RS4 has defeated the BMW M3 on two occasions.

Face it bimmerCrazeFanatic amazinBimmer, your new M3 is not in a class of its own as it has already lost twice to the Volkswagen RS4 and it clearly is a step backwards from the E46 varaint.

You can go crawl in your whole and say the Volkswagen product is inferior but as the educated people know, Audi existed well before Volkswagen and even BMW for that matter. Additionally, the new BMW M3 has lost to the RS4 in two comparison tests by Autocar and Autoexpress Magazines.

BimmerBoy I hate to burst your bubble but FWD crap architecture, and nose-heavy weight balance has managed to achieve new-found record success against the almighty king BMW M3 and the Volkswagen (actually Audi) brand is on pace to sell more than 1 million cars in 2007 placing them ahead of Mercedes-Benz and even if they come up slightly short, Audi is closer to Mercedes-Benz in sales than Lexus, Infiniti, Acura, Volvo, Saab are to it.

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GermanNut - 8/12/2007 7:20:33 PM

+2 Boost

amazinBimmer.....oh yeah I'm a lowly sales guy that can only afford a lineup of BMWs and a previous Audi that you would be completely envious of.

Obviously you show your lack of automotive knowledge by saying Audis are rebadged Volkswagens when the Audi R8 is more Lamborghini than anything and shares absolutely no parts/chassis/drivetrain/design with Volkswagen.

Great refute of my arguement that states the BMW M3 is no longer king of its class.

Your response......I'm a lowly sales guy.

I'm glad to see you amazinBimmer.....openly complimenting Audi for their success with the RS4 sports saloon and R8 sports car as you have no on-topic response for my post.

I appreciate your long awaited recognition of a brand that is turning up the heat on its German rivals in terms of performance (both straight-line and handling/dynamic with the R8), sales (rising faster than any other premium German brand) and vision (goal is to become #1 premium auto-manufacturer by 2015)

I'm glad to see your appreciation of Audi this is from a BMW supporter.

Finally, you realized that BMW and Audi can coexist on the same planet and Audi doesn't always follow BMW as witnessed by the sales figures in Germany that clearly place Audi and Mercedes-Benz ahead of BMW and the RS4 which BMW miraculously gave almost the same exact horsepower with same V8 powerplant.

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kablaam - 8/13/2007 3:21:26 AM

+1 Boost

So the M3 isn't as good as the 911, I didn't think people would cross-shop such different beasts. Even though the M3 is the 3-series halo, it is still 20k less and we all know for 75k, the porsche is nothing more than 2 seats, 4 wheels and an engine. Modest comparable M3-Standard options would spawn the 911 price to 80k+. This will be the best M3 ever, make no doubts about it, too much competition around for BMW to drop the ball.

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MunichRob - 8/13/2007 7:58:56 AMView My AgentSpace

-1 Boost

"GermanNut" I'm not teaming up with "amazing radical fan boy bimmer" here, but I really wouldn't be so confident to say the M3 isn't the king of it's class anymore.

Car & Driver gave the car a great review when they drove it in wet weather, still produced great numbers, and said expect it to do even better when they test it at their usual stateside venue.

This class is about performance, the M3 delivers the most performance in this class...enough said.

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GermanNut - 8/13/2007 11:58:31 AM

0 Boost

amazinBimmer, if the Audi R8 costs $109K or $118K depending on transmission choices (manual or R-tronic) and the BMW M6, which happens to be BMW's closest competitor to the Audi R8 costs $105K or 108K for convertible form, obviously the Audi buyer has achieved more than the BMW buyer because the Audi buyer is paying more for their respective Audi when compared to the BMW guy.

I love how you post completely false claims and provide no proof to back up your so-called facts although we all know what you provide is purely opinionated claims with absolutely zero credibility.

Since you fail to provide on-topic responses of how the R8 hasn't achieved new-found performance both in straight-line and handling/dynamics and claim that because I can't afford such a car (even though when you total all my cars together they are over $275K are current time) that the R8's achievement is irrelevant.

amazinBimmer I'm so glad to see you openly praising the audi R8 for its brilliance in creating another supercar genre known as the everyday supercar with exotic looks.

0-60 mph in 3.9 seconds (something BMW can't match bceause they are all slower to 60), a $118K price-tag (another price that BMW is below with all of their M cars) and looks that make you openly advocate the car as a brilliant effort in exterior design coupled with truly exotix performance that can be used every single day.

amazinBimmer when you provide an on-topic factual response to my posts I will believe you are defending the BMW brand, but as long as you continue to provide off-topic responses and claim the R8's performance and achievement as being irrelevant because you believe someone can't afford the car (what a great comeback, my arguement is that the R8 sets new standards in acceleration and handling/dynamics and your refute of my arguement is that all of the R8's achievements are irrelevant because you believe that I can't afford it because I'm a VW sales guy????) I know you are openly praising Audi.

amazinBimmer, I knew you would come around. I'm glad to see your appreciation for the Four Rings known as Audi.

Mark this as a historical day in Autospies history:

The day when amazinBimmer openly supports Audi's efforts and praises the brand.

Congratulations

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MunichRob - 8/13/2007 8:46:38 PMView My AgentSpace

+1 Boost

GermanNut the R8 is slower than both M6 & M5, mabye not in the 0-60MPH sprint but in both the 0-100mph dash, & the 1/4mile.

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GermanNut - 8/14/2007 11:28:54 AM

+1 Boost

MunichRob we all know that will be changing when the R8 comes with a 500 horsepower V10. That car will surely do 0-60 under 4.0 seconds if the current V8 with 420 horsepower has been clocked at 3.9 by Motortrend.

Look for the 0-60 to be in the 3.5-3.8 range and 1/4 mile times in the high 11's to 12.3 at lowest.

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